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Thread: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

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    Member bambam's Avatar
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    Default Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    http://ken-berger.blogs.cbssports.co...38893/33584531

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    Ken Berger

    One of the surest bets of the soon-to-begin 2011 NBA free-agent period is that Nene wants out of Denver. Where he winds up, and how, will be among the most intriguing storylines when the floodgates open around Dec. 9.

    The Nuggets are operating under the firm belief that Nene will test the market as an unrestricted free agent, according to a person familiar with the team's thinking. Six teams have registered interest, the source said: Golden State, New Jersey, Indiana, Miami, Dallas and Houston.

    Nene, the top unrestricted free agent on the market in the view of many team executives, will have a say over where he winds up -- though not as much as free agents did under the previous system since free agents can no longer get max deals when leaving their teams via sign-and-trades.

    Nene, 29, has long coveted Miami and Dallas as landing spots, but would have to force his way to one of those teams via a sign-and-trade since both are well over the cap. And whereas LeBron James was able to get a max deal through a sign-and-trade when he went from Cleveland to Miami, Nene would have to settle for a four-year deal with 4.5 percent raises under the new system in such an arrangement.

    If the Golden State used the amnesty provision on Andris Biedrins, the Warriors would have enough room to sign Nene outright for close to the max -- but again, that would be a four-year deal with non-Bird raises as opposed to the five-year deal with 7.5 percent raises he'd get by re-signing with Denver. There's no incentive under the new rules for Nene to push for a sign-and-trade as opposed to an outright signing with another team, unless there was a clear preference for a team that didn't have room to sign him.

    There is incentive, however, for the Nuggets to accommodate his wishes in the hopes of getting significant assets back through a sign-and-trade. For the Nuggets, the most advantageous scenario would be if Nene wanted to be in Miami, Dallas or Houston enough to be willing to accept less money to get there.

    UPDATE: The Nets would have room sign Nene to a max deal starting at 30 percent of the cap -- $17.4 million -- if they used amnesty on Travis Outlaw. The Pacers have enough room regardless, while the Rockets are close. They would either do a sign-and-trade or use amnesty on Terrence Williams and clear the rest through separate deals to clear room for an outright signing.
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  3. #2
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Damn, Nene with the Pacers

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    If its a sign and trade what would you give up? Hans?

    I think Houston could work a deal and thats the most likely place for a sign and trade.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    I would love to have Nene, but not for the max.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    I like Nene but at the price and his age , does he fit the youth movement we are on?
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    I would love to have Nene, but not for the max.
    Agreed. I'd probably go up to around $12M per, but anything much more than that would be ridiculous.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by GrangeRusHibbert View Post
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    Agreed. I'd probably go up to around $12M per, but anything much more than that would be ridiculous.
    You have to go 13 IMO and you have to do a sign and trade with the Nuggets involving a big. They will need a center and there is no way we give them Hibbert IMO. The best we could do is to include Hans and thats a steep price. At some point its too much.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    You don't even get in the conversation with Nene without offering the max. Even then, another team almost certainly offers the same (I'm looking at you New Jersey) and he takes that offer if he doesn't just re-sign in Denver as he should.
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Of course he's open to alot of different teams, more specifically teams that have the max contract money available.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Nene, Josh Smith and OJ Mayo should be the off season shopping list.

    If we can't do that this off season then when CAN we do something?

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    It's hard not to want Nene. I'm just not sure that he's worth the max money that people will offer. Especially when you've got another super strong free agent class coming next year. We really need a player exactly like him though. It's a tough call.

  15. #12

    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Anyone who gives max money to a career 12 & 7 29-year-old deserves to be stuck in salary cap hell for years to come. In that regard, I hope some team does give it to him, preferably an Eastern Conference team not named the Indiana Pacers.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
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    You don't even get in the conversation with Nene without offering the max. Even then, another team almost certainly offers the same (I'm looking at you New Jersey) and he takes that offer if he doesn't just re-sign in Denver as he should.
    Denver only lets him walk and he only takes a deal outside of Denver for less if it has more years on it. A sign and trade is the Pacers best chance over NJ who really don't have anything to offer over the Pacers unless its Brook Lopez (doubt it).

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    You have to go 13 IMO and you have to do a sign and trade with the Nuggets involving a big.
    Why do we need to do a sign and trade? We have enough cap space as is. There's no advantage to a s&t under the new rules - what we can offer Nene using cap space is exactly the same as what he could get in s&t.

    All we need to do is convince Nene to sign here, there's no incentive for us to offer Denver anything, nor would it make Nene likelier to sign with us. The s&t option is only for those teams without sufficient cap space.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by 90'sNBARocked View Post
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    I like Nene but at the price and his age , does he fit the youth movement we are on?
    He's 29, 30 next september. I'm not too concerned there (4 year max in new CBA, makes him 33 at the end of that contract). Its the max thing thats too much for me. I'd rather pay him like Danny gets paid. You don't want to impact the future in not being able to sign anyone or miss out on trades because you over reached here.

    Make no mistake, he's a difference maker for this team. You are instantly a certain playoff team in the East every year, if you get him. I'm just not sure, he makes you a contender...but I also don't know who you can reasonably hope to get that makes you that either. It likely has to come from within.

    I like him, I think he fits with both Roy and Tyler. That sounds sortsighted, but I like both of those players and (to me), he's the perfect compliment to both.

    I guess I could argue both sides of getting Nene, ya he's not Dwight Howard, Deron Williams, or Chris Paul, but I'm pretty sure they aren't coming here. So as far as that next rung of player, he's pretty good. No, he's not a max player, but is he the best player the Pacers can get for the max?
    Last edited by Speed; 11-29-2011 at 01:08 PM.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by aaronb View Post
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    Nene, Josh Smith and OJ Mayo should be the off season shopping list.

    If we can't do that this off season then when CAN we do something?
    A return to salary cap hell is kinda tempting, but I'll pass if those three guys are driving the bus there.
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  24. #17

    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    Why do we need to do a sign and trade? We have enough cap space as is. There's no advantage to a s&t under the new rules - what we can offer Nene using cap space is exactly the same as what he could get in s&t.

    All we need to do is convince Nene to sign here, there's no incentive for us to offer Denver anything, nor would it make Nene likelier to sign with us. The s&t option is only for those teams without sufficient cap space.
    I thought s&t still would involve one more year and thats what incentive for Nene and the Nuggets to work a deal with us. They could get more years and a decent player for doing that. I could be wrong..

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Let Frank Vogel recruit him. That's our best chance, regardless of whether that combines with a max deal or not.

    Does anyone know the numbers on this alleged max deal anyway? I'm not sure.

    Lastly, I don't know whether the max is appropriate or not, but I know that you always have to overpay for quality big men, so anyone who thinks we'll ever get one at a 'fair' or 'appropriate' contract are likely fooling themselves.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    I want Nene, but not that badly. I'd love his presence in the paint, but not for a max deal. I want to attempt to get EJ next year.
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Let Frank Vogel recruit him. That's our best chance, regardless of whether that combines with a max deal or not.

    Does anyone know the numbers on this alleged max deal anyway? I'm not sure.

    Lastly, I don't know whether the max is appropriate or not, but I know that you always have to overpay for quality big men, so anyone who thinks we'll ever get one at a 'fair' or 'appropriate' contract are likely fooling themselves.
    The more I think about this if we front load the contract then thats what puts us over the the Nets and possibly Houston. Do I think Bird like Nene enough to do that. Maybe not but thats the one advantage the pacers have over possibly Houston.

  30. #21
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    The more I think about this if we front load the contract then thats what puts us over the the Nets and possibly Houston. Do I think Bird like Nene enough to do that. Maybe not but thats the one advantage the pacers have over possibly Houston.
    I don't know if front loading a contract even means anything to the players, thats a team cap issue to free up money down the line when you need it. Player's gonna get the amount they sign for whether its front loaded or not.
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    Artificial Intelligence wintermute's Avatar
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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    I thought s&t still would involve one more year and thats what incentive for Nene and the Nuggets to work a deal with us. They could get more years and a decent player for doing that. I could be wrong..
    Yup under the new rules s&t is limited to 4 years and 4.5% raises - exactly the same as a free agent offer from another team.

    Denver alone can benefit from Bird rights in signing Nene - 5 years and 7.5% raises. However, I don't think Nene gets paid enough for the difference to be crucial (I could be wrong too).

  32. #23

    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    I don't know if front loading a contract even means anything to the players, thats a team cap issue to free up money down the line when you need it. Player's gonna get the amount they sign for whether its front loaded or not.
    Money in the pocket means something IMO. Its not a big advantage but it deters other teams from offering the same deal. Front load the contract and he becomes more tradeable in the future and he gets more money upfront.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Not sure how reliable this is...

    http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/11/...s-max-contract

    How NBA Lockout Deal Affects Nene's Inevitable Max Contract

    by Tom Ziller • Nov 29, 2011 1:15 PM EST

    Reports indicate that Denver Nuggets center Nene, an unrestricted free agent, has suitors willing to give him a max contract. Tweeters are in an uproar. Cynics remember the long list of insane contracts handed out every season in the modern history of the NBA and shrug. Of course someone will give Nene the max. Probably Marc Gasol and Tyson Chandler, too.

    But the deal that sprung from the NBA lockout will fix this injustice, right? Surely after that painful defeat at the hands of the Neo-Scrooges among NBA ownership, Nene's max contract won't end up being too huge. Right? Right?



    In the old collective bargaining agreement, assuming a $58 million salary cap, without cajoling the Nuggets into a sign-and-trade, Nene would have been eligible for a max contract of five years, $100 million.

    In the new NBA, with a $58 million salary cap and again assuming no sign-and-trade, Nene is eligible for a max contract of four years, $74 million.

    It's an absurd contract for a non-All-Star, non-All-NBA player in both cases. But it's about $26 million less absurd now.

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    Default Re: Nene wants out, Pacers one of teams mentioned

    Thats 18.5 mill per year. YIKKKEESSS. Thats too much and no way should we do that.

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    Yup under the new rules s&t is limited to 4 years and 4.5% raises - exactly the same as a free agent offer from another team.

    Denver alone can benefit from Bird rights in signing Nene - 5 years and 7.5% raises. However, I don't think Nene gets paid enough for the difference to be crucial (I could be wrong too).
    Thanks for pointing that out. Thats good news for us either way.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 11-29-2011 at 01:30 PM.

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