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Thread: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

  1. #26

    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    If Ochocinco can stay with it, he and Brady will pair up well together.

    For Haynesworth, he just needed to get the hell away from Shannahan and Redskins. He's a good tackle and will do well for them.

    The Patriots will make these guys valuable which will make them a great team once again.
    In 49 states it's just basketball, but this is Indiana!

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Sandman21 View Post
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    I think its going to blow up in New England's face. You can only get so many malcontents to behave before one continues their act.

    I hope you are right.

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Let's hear some specific names on trades. Who goes, who comes in, etc.

    Right now all you guys are doing is wanting changes, just in order to make changes. How does overspending in FA workout for the Redskins?

    In the past 5 years, there has been one team with two SB appearances. Guess who that is? The Colts.

    I used 5 because it's a nice round number, but I fully acknowledge if you move that number to 6years there's two teams with two SB appearances. If you move that number to 7 years, there are three.

    Let's not act like the Colts are the Ravens. A team that has been pretty good, but has never made the jump. The Colts are contenders year in and year out.
    I just posted yesterday that the Colts could trade Anthony Gonzales and a 4th to Houston for Amobi Okoye their 24 yr old DT who is still young, very strong and prefers a 4-3 defense... Houston is switching its defense to a 3-4 and said they would take offers for him.

    They are always looking for wideout help so that definitely wouldn't hurt.... We have a lot of wideouts that have shown up in this previous year and could stand to let him go. Okoye would be an upgrade over the group we already have and he still has tons of room to grow...

    We could possibly do the deal for a 3rd and a 6th if we really wanted to. Plus I will say that his contract is pretty inexpensive so it wouldn't hurt us if we did it for picks... if we traded Gonzo it might actually give us even more cap space... I am sure I could think of other trades but this is one that came to mind...
    Why so SERIOUS

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Scot Pollard View Post
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    If Ochocinco can stay with it, he and Brady will pair up well together.

    For Haynesworth, he just needed to get the hell away from Shannahan and Redskins. He's a good tackle and will do well for them.

    The Patriots will make these guys valuable which will make them a great team once again.
    He was at odds with the Redskins/Shannahan because they went from a 4-3 system, which Albert wanted to play in, to a 3-4.

    Guess what system the Pats use.....

    A 3-4.

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Well i think or am hoping that this draft we finally got it right with the OL, thats why i left off some of the bigger OL names that are out there. And i agree that Cover 2 wouldn't utilize those Corners as much as they could, im just not happy with our CBs play and it would be a big upgrade to have a playmaker back there. I personally hate how we play the Cover 2.. If your gonna play it you should let your Corners play up tight and shadow the recievers as best as possible, unless its an extremely talented guy that you need to back off and then attack right when the ball is thrown towards him. But unfortunately a lot of the time thats how we play against all of the recievers and we just let them catch the ball without much contesting. That is my biggest complaint about our team. But also as i stated im worried because i don't feel we are improving like the other teams are and with peytons neck surgery it just makes me think we are going to start going downhill these next couple years.

    I also think we need bigger DT's and at least one big LB, speed is nice but when you get trucked its pointless.

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Scot Pollard View Post
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    If Ochocinco can stay with it, he and Brady will pair up well together.

    For Haynesworth, he just needed to get the hell away from Shannahan and Redskins. He's a good tackle and will do well for them.

    The Patriots will make these guys valuable which will make them a great team once again.
    I agree with this. I think Chad is in better shape than Moss was when he came over to the Pats and we all saw how dominant Moss became with Brady. Though Moss had the size advantage too. I think Haynesworth will really benefit from a change of scenery, the Pats will likely get his butt into gear, unfortunately. They appear to be using him as a DE in NE which will be interesting. Him and Wilfork put together..... We will have problems blocking that line. Peyton should pray before Pats games and throw the ball right after he hikes it..

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by BPump33 View Post
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    But he will play more End (which supposedly will make him happy) with New England. It's not like he's replaceing Wilfork at DT. Again, if he's unhappy, then he's cut. No big deal.
    plus NE plays multiple sets not just 3/4 (i think they play 40% 3/4) they will put him in packages for him to be successful. The reason he didn't like NT was because he was always getting double and triple teamed in Washington. Im sure they will put him in some packages what he was in Tennessee DT.

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  10. #33

    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    In the past 5 years, there has been one team with two SB appearances. Guess who that is? The Colts.
    And the Steelers. This past Super Bowl and 2008 Super Bowl against the Cardinals.
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  12. #34
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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ownagedood View Post
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    Well i think or am hoping that this draft we finally got it right with the OL, thats why i left off some of the bigger OL names that are out there. And i agree that Cover 2 wouldn't utilize those Corners as much as they could, im just not happy with our CBs play and it would be a big upgrade to have a playmaker back there. I personally hate how we play the Cover 2.. If your gonna play it you should let your Corners play up tight and shadow the recievers as best as possible, unless its an extremely talented guy that you need to back off and then attack right when the ball is thrown towards him. But unfortunately a lot of the time thats how we play against all of the recievers and we just let them catch the ball without much contesting. That is my biggest complaint about our team. But also as i stated im worried because i don't feel we are improving like the other teams are and with peytons neck surgery it just makes me think we are going to start going downhill these next couple years.

    I also think we need bigger DT's and at least one big LB, speed is nice but when you get trucked its pointless.
    I agree on everything you state about the corners. Our corners are weak. Our LBs are weak. Our DTs are weak. We have some fairly one-dimensional DEs (albeit very good at that dimension) and one solid and one above average S.

    I don't care if it's cover 2. There's a reason we constantly line our corners up 10 yards off and just let people catch the ball in front of us. Our corners suck. They can't cover anybody. Add that to our swiss cheese run D and ouch.

    I do hope the run game improves with (hopefully) these O-line additions. At least maybe we can try to keep our D off the field more.
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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Really? View Post
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    I just posted yesterday that the Colts could trade Anthony Gonzales and a 4th to Houston for Amobi Okoye their 24 yr old DT who is still young, very strong and prefers a 4-3 defense... Houston is switching its defense to a 3-4 and said they would take offers for him.

    They are always looking for wideout help so that definitely wouldn't hurt.... We have a lot of wideouts that have shown up in this previous year and could stand to let him go. Okoye would be an upgrade over the group we already have and he still has tons of room to grow...

    We could possibly do the deal for a 3rd and a 6th if we really wanted to. Plus I will say that his contract is pretty inexpensive so it wouldn't hurt us if we did it for picks... if we traded Gonzo it might actually give us even more cap space... I am sure I could think of other trades but this is one that came to mind...
    Love the sentiment. If Houston would deal, I'd do it in a heartbeat, but there's the whole trading to a division rival thing too.
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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    plus NE plays multiple sets not just 3/4 (i think they play 40% 3/4) they will put him in packages for him to be successful. The reason he didn't like NT was because he was always getting double and triple teamed in Washington. Im sure they will put him in some packages what he was in Tennessee DT.
    They play a 3-4 a lot more than 40% of the time. Yes it's a modified 3-4, but when they modify it, they usually drop their DE's into coverage and then blitz linebackers.

    Or they stand around before the snap, and then go into their rush/coverage once the ball is snapped.

    But they are a 3-4 team, that occasionally uses a 4-3. Either way, Haynesworth is going to be lined up in the exact same position as he was in Washington. He'll have limited reps, because him and Wilfork will need to share the role.

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by D-BONE View Post
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    Love the sentiment. If Houston would deal, I'd do it in a heartbeat, but there's the whole trading to a division rival thing too.
    Yeah that is the only sucky part... but hey I would give it a go... it is a deal that could help out both teams, if it was lopsided to one team or another then I could see a problem...
    Why so SERIOUS

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    They play a 3-4 a lot more than 40% of the time. Yes it's a modified 3-4, but when they modify it, they usually drop their DE's into coverage and then blitz linebackers.

    Or they stand around before the snap, and then go into their rush/coverage once the ball is snapped.

    But they are a 3-4 team, that occasionally uses a 4-3. Either way, Haynesworth is going to be lined up in the exact same position as he was in Washington. He'll have limited reps, because him and Wilfork will need to share the role.
    it is 40% nfl network showed it yesterday

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    I find that extremely low. I can't fathom calling your basic philosophy a 3-4, when you don't even execute it half of the time.

    Do you remember the other major formations and their percentages?

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I find that extremely low. I can't fathom calling your basic philosophy a 3-4, when you don't even execute it half of the time.

    Do you remember the other major formations and their percentages?
    no but here is a video on how the Pats plan to use him. They arent playing him at NT.
    http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-free-a...th-to-Patriots


    http://www.zimbio.com/NFL/articles/R...iots+ESPN+blog
    found the percentage

    Last season, Haynesworth made it known that he did not like the way he was used in the Redskins’ 3-4 scheme. Like the Redskins, the Patriots also run a 3-4 defense although they lined up in that front less frequently. The Patriots used a 3-4 defense on 40.1 percent of their snaps last season, 11th-most among 15 teams that lined up in a 3-4 defense on at least 200 snaps. Washington lined up 50.6 percent of the time in a 3-4.
    Last edited by pacer4ever; 07-29-2011 at 04:59 PM.

  19. #41

    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Mike Reiss of ESPN Boston every year breaks down every snap by formation and by personnel, and that analysis above is roughly accurate.

    They routinely use 4 man fronts on passing downs and they even almost exclusively use 4 man fronts and 5 or more DBs against pass-heavy teams like the Colts, with a 4-2-5 or even 4-1-6 alignment. Typically a safety also lines up as the a LB in those two formations. used to be Rodney Harrison, now it's Patrick Chung and/or Meriweather.

    They always use game-plan personnel, so it's not like they always line up the same way and say "here we are, deal with it".




    Haynesworth is a turd. His contract is not guaranteed at all, so he's got about 4 weeks to show he cares and if not, bye-- and the cost is a 5th round pick in two years.

    Chad Jackson is a self-promoter but not an on-and-off-the-field lousy person and teammate like Haynesworth. The reported cost? 5th rounder next year, 6th rounder in twom years. Sure he has lost a little. How does he compare to Deon Branch, who was reborn after coming to NE last year?

    I'll be stunned if Chad doesn't work out and surprised if Haynesworth does work out. When the cost is three picks you would normally use to practice squad-type talent, I can't argue with the overall risk-reward ratio for either move, though.
    Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 07-30-2011 at 12:19 AM.

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Haynesworth failed his conditioning test. Shocking.

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    So happy I can read stories about Fat Albert and not see "Redskins" attached to his name

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Tick...Tick...Tick... One of these bombs are gonna explode in their face. I know they gave little for them but Chad is getting really long in the tooth and Albert just doesn't seem to love the game or have a work ethic.

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  26. #45

    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by Heisenberg View Post
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    Haynesworth failed his conditioning test. Shocking.
    link?

    It would not surprise we, but this was not confirmed anywhere. He passed his physical on Friday, worked out on Saturday but didn't practice with the team, a full-pads practice. Perhaps he disn't yet know the system well enough for a full contact practice.

    Today he passed the conditioning test and practiced, a light walk-through.

    http://espn.go.com/blog/boston/new-e...ditioning-test

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  28. #46

    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Belichick discussed 4-3 vs. 3-4 defensive lineups yesterday, basically refuting the contention of the person asking the question, that NE has largely always relied on a 3-4 defense:

    Quote Originally Posted by the guy in the gray hoodie
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    “We won two Super Bowls playing a 4-3,” Belichick said via Tom Curran of CSNNE.com. “In ’01 and [‘04]. Second half of the ’01 season, we played 4-3 after Bryan Cox and [Ted] Johnson got hurt.”

    Belichick also often used the 4-3 in Cleveland and says he essentially did with the Giants as well. He has the confidence to use both alignments and stressed that it’s how the Patriots play, not what scheme they play that really matters.

    “I think honestly [the 3-4 reliance] is something that’s a media fabrication,” Belichick continued. “There are a lot of different alignments out there, you see 4-3 teams use odd spacing, you see 3-4 teams use even spacing. Look, you have 11 [defensive] players. You can put them in various positions. Whether you want to put it in the pregame depth chart as one thing or another I think is a little bit overrated.”
    http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com...t-4-3-defense/
    Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 08-05-2011 at 12:58 PM.

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Except they started two DEs and on NT for the '04 Superbowl. The starting DL was Hamilton (LE) Washington (NT) and Seymour (RE).

    They started a 4-3 lineup during the '01 SB, and a 3-4 during the '05.

  30. #48

    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    wikipedia agrees with you that they started in a 3-4 in the 2003 and 2004 Super Bowls, and a 4-3 in the 2001 Super Bowl.

    Maybe the second instance Bill was referring two was a championship with the Giants when he was defensive coordinator, and whomever wrote this story guessed he was referring to '04. Those Giants teams were considered 3-4 teams, but one year may have been different due to injury or personnel, I don't recall.

  31. #49

    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    OK, I found it and jogged my memory.

    One of the keys in Super Bowl XXXIX was NE unexpectedly scrapping the 3-4 after the 1st series and going with a 4-3 package for the first time in years. It was a "light" 4-3 with two linebackers playing D line.

    http://www.patriots.com/news/article...6-F7FD9BCEC37E

    In Sunday’s Super Bowl XXXIX win over the Philadelphia Eagles at ALLTEL Stadium, the Patriots scrapped the 3-4 two-gap base defense it used all season and went with what could be termed a light 4-3 front that included only two defensive linemen and five linebackers.

    In two weeks, the Patriots abandoned what got them there. They went away from the 3-4 front that helped them win 16 of 18 games before Super Bowl XXXIX. Sure, they are a multiple front defense, but even when they play four down linemen at times, they play it with 3-4 principles and two-gap techniques unless in the nickel or another subpackage when everything goes out the window.

    Sunday, they scrapped it all. They played in the gaps. They played head up on the guards with the center uncovered. They played shading the center and over the center. They penetrated. They rushed. And they blitzed early and often...

    the outside linebackers were asked to play with their hand on the ground even on early downs when the Eagles run was a threat. Of course, it turned out to be no threat at all. With five defensive linemen rotating into two defensive tackle spots, the middle of the line was strong and fresh all night while the perimeter guys, those versatile linebackers, did a remarkable job blowing up outside runs and setting the edge. Philly ran it only 17 times for 45 yards with 22 of those coming on one Brian Westbrook run. That made the Eagles one-dimensional and the man coverage was good enough to make McNabb hold the ball while the heat was turned up around to him.

    “We never really played a 3-4,” Belichick said. “We felt like we needed to get as much pass rush on the field as possible to get McNabb and try to contain him. We knew chasing him around all day was going to be a long and tough proposition. We tried to match up as best we could with our best pass rushers.”

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    Default Re: Chad Johnson and Albert Haynesworth are Patriots ....

    Quote Originally Posted by pacers74 View Post
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    I hope you are right.
    NostraSandman called it: http://espn.go.com/boston/nfl/story/...rt-haynesworth
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