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Thread: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

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    Default We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    http://twitter.com/#!/MikeWellsNBA/s...11622900158465

    @MikeWellsNBA Mike Wells




    Vogel's coaching staff - brian shaw, dan burke and jim boylen - scheduled to meet with the media on wednesday.

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    George Hill Apologist mattie's Avatar
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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff

    I can't get over the fact that we got Brian Shaw. It makes me giddy every time I read his name. He's just an awesome person all the way around, whether it be basketball or who he is as a person.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference Wed)

    I edited the title a bit to make things more clear to the casual browser.

    Seems like Vogel has made himself a very nice supporting staff here. I'm very happy with how this is appearing to have turned out. Proof will be in the pudding whenever we finally end this damned lockout.

    My only modest concern is that Boylen seems like kind of a doofus in front of the press, but otherwise I generally like what I've read.

    Between Shaw and Boylen, newbie Frank has certainly surrounded himself with a lot of experience, notably championship experience at that.

    I wonder how Frank intends to generally implement each of them. Like with Bird, Rick was the offensive coordinator and Dick was the defensive coordinator. I'm assuming Frank will be more hands-on with the X's and O's. Brian Shaw seems like the natural choice to keep the locker room in order at all times and to prevent the issues we heard about last season with players slacking off.

    Boylen I'm more fuzzy on, though he certainly seems like he has an abundance of experience, and I think I read he specializes in offenses built around a front court, which could bode well for Tyler, Roy, and if we add another PF in free agency or trade. Certainly would seem to fit with Frank's goal of "Smashmouth Basketball" he had last time around.

    I'm sure Dan Burke will continue to do whatever it is Dan Burke apparently does so well that he's now been a part of (counts) FIVE different Pacer coaching staffs. That's pretty incredible to me.

    Hopefully we'll get some decent elaboration on their roles and perhaps in the case of Shaw and Boylen, their philosophies they intend to bring to the table, because God knows they can't talk about anything else.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference Wed)

    After reading the thread title, I thought Boylen was going to get his own press conference. I was thinking, "Man, things must be really, really slow..."

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    My only modest concern is that Boylen seems like kind of a doofus in front of the press, but otherwise I generally like what I've read.
    When is an assistant ever in front of the press? He may be on the postgame show occasionally, but since as of now we have no one to interview him, I don't think we need to worry.
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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy View Post
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    When is an assistant ever in front of the press? He may be on the postgame show occasionally, but since as of now we have no one to interview him, I don't think we need to worry.
    Well, there's that, but I guess if he's going to act like that in front of the cameras, how much of a jackass is he going to be towards the players, and how quickly will his act wear thin with them?

    Let's just say I'm much, much happier about Shaw than I am Boylen from that POV.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Well, there's that, but I guess if he's going to act like that in front of the cameras, how much of a jackass is he going to be towards the players, and how quickly will his act wear thin with them?

    Let's just say I'm much, much happier about Shaw than I am Boylen from that POV.
    Some people just don't like the press, but behind closed doors could be the coolest man around. Different situations bring out different personalities.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    A question that no one seems to have asked - why are we going from 5 assistants to 3? Is it a money issue? Preference of quality over quantity? What impact, if any, would we see on games, player development, etc. With only 3 guys, I'd guess that there are no specialists on staff, i.e. each assistant will have multiple responsibilities.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    A question that no one seems to have asked - why are we going from 5 assistants to 3? Is it a money issue? Preference of quality over quantity? What impact, if any, would we see on games, player development, etc. With only 3 guys, I'd guess that there are no specialists on staff, i.e. each assistant will have multiple responsibilities.
    Its a good question, but I'd rather have Shaw than basically any two other assistants that I can think of.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    Its a good question, but I'd rather have Shaw than basically any two other assistants that I can think of.
    I want 2 more having only 3 leaves so much work for the 3 we have they are basically almost doing double the work now.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    I want 2 more having only 3 leaves so much work for the 3 we have they are basically almost doing double the work now.
    I can see that. With Birds staff you had Carlise and Harter only, but that was a veteran group of players, so you really probably just needed an offensive and defensive coordinator. It goes back to the idea of having a big man coach or coaches who can work extensively with individuals.

    On that note, is Billy Keller still employed by the team as a shooting coach? If so, this may be a way around the above concept. Being in Indiana, I'm sure there are a plethora of options for skill set type coaches available.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    A question that no one seems to have asked - why are we going from 5 assistants to 3? Is it a money issue? Preference of quality over quantity? What impact, if any, would we see on games, player development, etc. With only 3 guys, I'd guess that there are no specialists on staff, i.e. each assistant will have multiple responsibilities.

    I doubt it is a money issue (the 4th and 5th assistant coaches don't make a ton of money.

    Bird always said when he was the coach that there is no need for a bunch of assistant coaches - there just isn't enough for each guy to do.

    Having said that I'm sure there is a video coordinator and some other guys behind the scenes who do some of the grunt work.

    On Brian Shaw, don't get me wrong, I am not unhappy having him as our lead assistant, but do we know what his coaching philosophy is? He's been an assistant coach in one capacity or another for 7 seasons - which is pretty good, I guess, but that is still a newby by most standards. I guess I just don't get all the excitement over him.
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 07-12-2011 at 08:46 AM.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    I can see that. With Birds staff you had Carlise and Harter only, but that was a veteran group of players, so you really probably just needed an offensive and defensive coordinator. It goes back to the idea of having a big man coach or coaches who can work extensively with individuals.

    On that note, is Billy Keller still employed by the team as a shooting coach? If so, this may be a way around the above concept. Being in Indiana, I'm sure there are a plethora of options for skill set type coaches available.
    Thats the key i mean they had a locker room leader in Reggie who could handle the locker room and let the coach get work done.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    On Brian Shaw, don't get me wrong, I am not unhappy having him as our lead assistant, but do we know what his coaching philosophy is? He's been an assistant coach in one capacity or another for 7 seasons - which is pretty good, I guess, but that is still a newby by most standards. I guess I just don't get all the excitement over him.
    I am basically going off of him learning under Phil Jackson and the endorsement of Shaq, to me, is a pretty good compliment. Also, the background as a player on highly sucessful teams is a plus. Also, seeing that video of him was really telling I think as to what kind of person he is. He seems genuine, that goes a long way with people in general, I think.

    What I'm impressed with is his soft skills. I think Phil was sucessful because he knew how to get to players psyche and get them to participate in the greater good for the team. I think that, with what looks like his natural personality type could make him a huge asset.

    Now I just typed two paragraphs without hardly mentioning his knowledge of basketball. So who knows on that front.

    I have thought for a couple of years now, that most coaches at the NBA level know the game and that the soft skills have become whats more important in managing an NBA team. Just my opinion.

    Besides even if Shaw isn't a genius on the Xs and Os, I kinda get the vibe that Vogel is rainmanish in breaking down tape and strategy, especially after some nice work against the NBAs coach of the year, last year. Thats just my opinion too.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    Thats the key i mean they had a locker room leader in Reggie who could handle the locker room and let the coach get work done.
    Reggie was never the locker room leader, Mark Jackson was the leader of that particular group of players.

    Reggie was a lot of things and he certainly was a leader from the standpoint of keeping himself ready and being an example of work ethic, but he was never a locker room or even a floor leader.


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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    A question that no one seems to have asked - why are we going from 5 assistants to 3?

    Is it a money issue?

    Preference of quality over quantity? What impact, if any, would we see on games, player development, etc. With only 3 guys, I'd guess that there are no specialists on staff, i.e. each assistant will have multiple responsibilities.

    My belief it's a money issue.

    Bird took a cut in pay, Vogel won't make O'Brien's salary, and fewer ast coaches says to me it's a money issue. Fewer ast coaches to pay during the lockout = money saved for ownership. Who is to say that once the lockout is over the Pacers won't hire another ast coach? Or the saved money is paying Pritchard's salary.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Reggie was never the locker room leader, Mark Jackson was the leader of that particular group of players.

    Reggie was a lot of things and he certainly was a leader from the standpoint of keeping himself ready and being an example of work ethic, but he was never a locker room or even a floor leader.
    I think Reggie was a floor leader, just as Derek Jeter is a field leader. No, he wasn't going to say "Rah, rah...let's do it guys," but you knew in a big spot that he was going to do everything in his power to help his team win and expected to win. Most of the times he succeeded too. I think that type of mentality picks up your teamates. Was he the only leader? No. However, he was a leader.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    I'm sure he wasn't the leader, but I remember Reggie's teammates and coaches on the '94 World Championship team unanimously saying the thing they were most surprised about on the team was Reggie's leadership and preparation.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    Thats the key i mean they had a locker room leader in Reggie who could handle the locker room and let the coach get work done.
    Who said Reggie was a locker room leader? He was a lead-by-example guy. Mark Jackson was the leader.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Who said Reggie was a locker room leader? He was a lead-by-example guy. Mark Jackson was the leader.
    That is what we are missing (a guy like kevin durant) our best player who works hard day in and day out and leads that way(kevin durant is first one in the gym last one to leave same as Reggie). I mean last year there was rumblings of players dogging it in practice.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    That is what we are missing (a guy like kevin durant) our best player who works hard day in and day out and leads that way(kevin durant is first one in the gym last one to leave same as Reggie). I mean last year there was rumblings of players dogging it in practice.
    I don't know. It seems to me that Danny Granger might already be this guy. He's just not vocal enough, but appears to put in his work and backs it up on the court (see the playoffs against the Bulls).

    Hibbert looked like he might take over the "charismatic, everyone wants to be around Mark Jackson role", but his confidence issues might prevent that from ever happening.

    I think we need the Mark Jackson leader more than we need the Reggie right now.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    On Brian Shaw, don't get me wrong, I am not unhappy having him as our lead assistant, but do we know what his coaching philosophy is? He's been an assistant coach in one capacity or another for 7 seasons - which is pretty good, I guess, but that is still a newby by most standards. I guess I just don't get all the excitement over him.
    First off I agree with what "Speed" said but to add my 2 cents...

    What gets me interested in the guy or excited, is the fact that Kobe wanted him as the front runner for the head coaching position for the Lakers job. To me that says enough. For one of the best players of all time IMO to want him, thats enough for me to buy in that he's one hell of a Coach/Leader/Man. And he will get the respect(like Bird gets) in the locker room, coaching, practices, games, ect... Just for the simple fact he is who he is, a winner.
    Try hard-er or Die hard-er. In this to win it.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    That is what we are missing (a guy like kevin durant) our best player who works hard day in and day out and leads that way(kevin durant is first one in the gym last one to leave same as Reggie). I mean last year there was rumblings of players dogging it in practice.
    Wait, I thought you said Reggie was a locker room leader?

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    Could have swore I had read somewhere that it was a financial decision. Unfortunately I can't find the link at the moment. Personally, though, I don't think it's that bad of an idea.

    First, we seem to be headed towards a lockout that may last the entire season. With teams trying to save every penny why spend for four new assistants that wouldn't even have a chance of working with any of the players?

    Second, Vogel is a babe in the woods in this position for a team still rebuilding. He has quite a few issues to deal with this year and maybe in this instance, simplicty is best.

    As a side note, I'm an old school fan and quite honestly have never understood why there were more than two or three assistants to begin with.

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    Default Re: We have a coaching staff (Boylen is on board, Press conference for assistants is Wed)

    We have three assistant coaches who at some point in time were in the running for HC positions (not sure about Burke), and in Shaws case, by the biggest names. I do not think coaching can get you very far, but this staff has the potential to take us as far as a staff can. We are really only a few pieces a way from being a great team thanks to this. Pritchard will help, too.


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