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Thread: why does everyone want a new pf?

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    Default why does everyone want a new pf?

    I think Tyler hansbrough will be an upper tier pf (top 10) in the league for the next 10 years. Hes tough, can score, makes the right pass, knocks his free throws down and is a team first guy. I think after we see him for a full season people may get excited to have him.

    I could see him being a career 17 ppg, 7 rpg guy.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Volmancagle17 View Post
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    I think Tyler hansbrough will be an upper tier pf (top 10) in the league for the next 10 years. Hes tough, can score, makes the right pass, knocks his free throws down and is a team first guy. I think after we see him for a full season people may get excited to have him.

    I could see him being a career 17 ppg, 7 rpg guy.


    he is a poor defender and only 6'8(if that) and a black hole and a average to poor re bounder. He is a great backup but not a very good starter IMO.
    Last edited by pacer4ever; 06-30-2011 at 11:50 PM.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    he is a poor defender and only 6"8 and a black hole and a average to poor re bounder. He is a great backup but not a very good starter IMO.
    I agree 100%.

    I like Tyler a lot and he's a great backup and best suited to be our 6th man for the future.

    We need his energy off the bench and he'll be a very important piece to our core.

    For the type of player he is, starting is too much for him. Between his height and difficulty playing defense at the pro level.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trophy View Post
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    I agree 100%.

    I like Tyler a lot and he's a great backup and best suited to be our 6th man for the future.

    For the type of player he is, starting is too much for him. Between his height and difficulty playing defense at the pro level.
    he was our 2nd best player the 2nd half of the season. Carl landry and milsap aren't much bigger than 6'8. there's a reason he's one of the most successful college players of all time.
    he reminds me of tebow in that while people doubt him, his work ethic will make him the player we want him to be. he's a freak.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Tyler is my favorite Pacer, and we definitely need another PF. Even if he was top 10 (which he never will be) we still need another PF.
    Last edited by ECKrueger; 06-30-2011 at 11:54 PM.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trophy View Post
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    I agree 100%.

    I like Tyler a lot and he's a great backup and best suited to be our 6th man for the future.

    We need his energy off the bench and he'll be a very important piece to our core.

    For the type of player he is, starting is too much for him. Between his height and difficulty playing defense at the pro level.
    if we get nene or david west then we see tyler off the bench... other than that he starts imo.... just think about this.... if we get nene or west this year and eric gordon next year here is a look at our lineups.

    Starting 5

    DC
    Gordon
    Granger
    Nene or West
    Hibbert

    First off the bench
    Hill
    George
    Hans

    Thats damn good

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Volmancagle17 View Post
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    he was our 2nd best player the 2nd half of the season. Carl landry and milsap aren't much bigger than 6'8. there's a reason he's one of the most successful college players of all time.
    he reminds me of tebow in that while people doubt him, his work ethic will make him the player we want him to be. he's a freak.
    I'm in no way saying he's not.

    Look at my avatar. I like Tyler a lot and being a 6th man doesn't mean you aren't valuable or a top player on the team.

    At times he can definitely play above his 6-9 or whatever height specifically offensively and getting to the line, but defensively we need it more consistently.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Because there is a perception that power forward is our biggest weakness, which I don't agree with at all.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Until he shows me otherwise, I will view him as a "very solid Backup PF that can be a decent short-term Emergency Starting PF".

    As some have said before....I'd prefer that he play an "intense/high energy" 24 mpg against the 2nd unit of most Teams while mixing it up with Starting PFs from time to time to change the pace of the game.

    IMHO.....he'd be far more effective as a Backup PF then he would be a Starting PF.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    I really hope Tyler becomes the player you think he is going to be. But right now we need an upgrade at the PF spot. Ideally that guy would be able to play C as well, so we can have a 3 man rotation of Hibbert, new PF/C (Nene ), and Tyler. This way Tyler would still get starter minutes or close to it. If we go the way of another smaller PF like Milsap, Tyler would just have to share time with that player. Either way I don't think it as much of as people not liking Tyler as we are needing 2 strong PF's (one hopefuuly who can play center too).

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Tyler is 6'9.5 ……he is taller than both Millsap(6'7.5) & West(6'9.25) Millsap is the last thing that I think we need, a truly undersized PF and West would have been great 3 years younger but your talking about a guy who is probably 32 once the lockout is finished……Im still miffed at why s many people think West is the answer….if we sign West we still aren't a contender…..he couldn't contend with Chris Paul….much less our current group. So if we are either A - waiting for a young guy to have a coming out party or B - 2012 FA to sign the last piece to the puzzle West is on the decline……hell even 3 years ago the guy really doesn't fit as a starter next to Roy…..I hope to God we don't sign him. That said I do prefer the idea of Tyler coming off the bench as a super sub with George Hill, so Im not saying I disagree with needed another PF…..I just don't feel that West or Millsap are guys we should be targeting…..even Nene has been an underachiever in my eye…

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    I think Hansbrough is already a solid player and a serviceable starter.. He has some things he has to work on like every other player in the NBA but from what I have seen so far there is no reason to think he isnt going to improve in those areas.

    People are quick to say he is weak on defense but I dont see it. He has improved his perimeter D noticeably and is strong in the post even though he tries to anticipate sometimes which gets him in trouble.

    If the Pacers can get Nene then I am ok with Tyler coming off the bench but if not then Tyler should remain the starter IMO.

    As Tyler Hansbrough has said " People can say whatever they want to say ".

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    he is a poor defender and only 6'8(if that) and a black hole and a average to poor re bounder. He is a great backup but not a very good starter IMO.
    Okay I could see the black hole tag or the average to poor rebounder thing, but a poor defender? Murphy was a poor defender at the 4, not Tyler. Sometimes I think you just watch the game but you don't completely understand it. Or you just really think all the Pacers are below average and we suck. You definitely would have been on "the least talented team in the NBA" bandwagon about a year ago and you still probably think we are bottom 5.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Midcoasted View Post
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    Okay I could see the black hole tag or the average to poor rebounder thing, but a poor defender? Murphy was a poor defender at the 4, not Tyler. Sometimes I think you just watch the game but you don't completely understand it. Or you just really think all the Pacers are below average and we suck. You definitely would have been on "the least talented team in the NBA" bandwagon about a year ago and you still probably think we are bottom 5.
    he is a good defender for his size but he is limited due to his size. I mean he isn't Carlos Boozer or Murphy but he is overall a below average defender IMO. I mean most PF's can just shoot over him. He is a better defender than David West though Tyler is very active and that helps make up for his size a little. David West is a poor to average defender but he is a beast offensively and makes up for it that way. If Tyler could pass and rebound better I would be fine with him as our starting 4. Because in the right system scheme you can hide his defensive faults.


    EDIT: But i want to make this clear I don't want to spend big money on a PF this off season. If I was in charge I would add a roster filler type guy or a good vet to a 1 yr deal and see how Tyler can play under a full season of Vogel and the staff. But even if i came to the conclusion Tyler is the guy i want at the PF(which would take a lot ). I would add a PF in 2012 a guy like Jordan Hill(just a name I would aim higher but a defensive minded big PF to go with Tyler). I think going out and signing West would be a massive mistake.

    And ideal if Tyler is a starter i would want his minutes limited to around 25-28mpg. He is way more effective fresh. So regardless if he turns into a "starter material" we need another defensive big at the PF IMO.

    Final EDIT: and being called a poor defender isnt that big of a knock. I Mean in the NBA the rules are set to benefit the offense and it is almost impossible to play good defense. He is in with the majority of players who are just average to poor defenders.

    don't understand the game? please basketball is my life I fully understand the game. I never said we are a bottom 5 talent team. But we are not nearly as talent as some people say on here and we aren't gonna compete for an NBA title any time soon. We need a top tier talent and IMO we don't have one. You don't have to agree with me that's fine it is just my opinion that we don't have great talent we have mediocre to good talent.
    Last edited by pacer4ever; 07-01-2011 at 04:06 AM.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Tyler H is nothing more than an energy guy. He's a good one,but that's it.

    Also,the Pacers' rebounding has to improve. Hans and Hibb aren't cutting it together. Need someone else.
    Pacers,baby!

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    I just wanna add that I think hansbrough was one of, if not the best player we had in the playoffs this year. He shows up for big games unlike others

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  26. #17

    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    You guys understand, he just finished his second year, right?

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by granger33 View Post
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    I just wanna add that I think hansbrough was one of, if not the best player we had in the playoffs this year. He shows up for big games unlike others
    IIRC, he was our best player the first game of the playoffs. He didn't do so well after that.

    But as I noted elsewhere, he got elbowed in the head at the end of game 1, which may explain the mediocre performance thereafter.

    Offensively, he clearly did not do well in games 2-5.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Some players get better as the pressure builds and the moment arrives. I still think Tyler may be one of those type guys, although this past playoff performance was a mixed bag.

    Roy, however, is looking more and more like a guy who does the opposite and shrinks in big moments. And it is really a big concern for me, Roy lover that I am. It's made me open to trading him or finding someone else to close games for us.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Some players get better as the pressure builds and the moment arrives. I still think Tyler may be one of those type guys, although this past playoff performance was a mixed bag.

    Roy, however, is looking more and more like a guy who does the opposite and shrinks in big moments. And it is really a big concern for me, Roy lover that I am. It's made me open to trading him or finding someone else to close games for us.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    IIRC, he was our best player the first game of the playoffs. He didn't do so well after that.

    But as I noted elsewhere, he got elbowed in the head at the end of game 1, which may explain the mediocre performance thereafter.

    Offensively, he clearly did not do well in games 2-5.
    True. But game 1 of the playoffs was truley an amazing performance by Tyler. I'm sure there are plenty of more games like that to come.

    I hate when my friends check box score and say "hansbrough played terrible, he was 3-10" Tyler is a player that can influence the game huge without eye drawing stats.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    I'm torn.

    The team needs another upper echelon player, a 1A/1B and PF seems like a position it could come at, if its not there, then where is it.

    At times, I think lets roll with this group and see how each players ceiling starts to look like. DC, Tyler, Roy, Paul, George Hill, and even Lance. I just don't know where they'll be in 3 years, yet.

    Other times, I think the Pacers have unprecendented cap room, they need to strike before the other youngsters need extended. This is a small window to add an injection of talent via trade or FA signing.

    Lastly, everytime we talk about adding a PF, we talk about how they'll fit with Roy. I start to wonder if, at times, if limiting yourself to that prerequisite is telling in what you have with Roy. I love Roy, but if I'm constantly asking will a player fit with Roy, maybe its Roy's value/position, who we need to think about.

    Ideal situation is Paul George is that 1A/1B and the rest takes care of itself. You sign a rebounding/defensive 4/5 and you are good. As much as I hope/think Paul is the guy, we have to be realistic and the facts are he was an 8 and 3 guy as a Rookie. You just don't know for sure.

    Worse scenario. You try to sign a 1A/1B Power Forward and you stunt Hansbroughs growth while over spending for a non missing piece. This gets you back to the Muprhy/Dunleavy scenario where you have overpaid players again who eliminate your chance to make improvements very easily due to the amount of cap space they eat up.
    Last edited by Speed; 07-01-2011 at 07:56 AM.

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by granger33 View Post
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    True. But game 1 of the playoffs was truley an amazing performance by Tyler. I'm sure there are plenty of more games like that to come.

    I hate when my friends check box score and say "hansbrough played terrible, he was 3-10" Tyler is a player that can influence the game huge without eye drawing stats.
    All true, and remember, Tyler averaged 16/8 in February and 14/6 as a starter. He is on the rise. When he starts to get a little bit of respect from the officals, he could put up monstrous numbers. How many times does Tyler take it to the hoop and get hammered to the floor and no call is made? If a Danny made that play he would be at the line and so will Tyler later on.
    I would like to see a backup PF who can play D, rebound, and block shots. I am not as concerned about offense. Tyler is my PF going forward!

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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    true he was clutch in the playoffs
    Tyler's per 36 minutes:

    Pts:
    Regular Season: 18.0
    Playoffs: 12.3

    Reb:
    Regular Season: 8.6
    Playoffs: 5.9

    Ast:
    Regular Season: 1.0
    Playoffs: 1.1

    Blk:
    Regular Season: 0.4
    Playoffs: 0.0

    Stl:
    Regular Season: 0.9
    Playoffs: 1.3

    PER:
    Regular Season: 16.4
    Playoffs: 8.9

    And that includes his truly fantastic second half of game 1.

    As I've pointed out numerous times in the past, taking anything from that 5 game sample is absolutely ludicrous, good or bad. But the perception of the situation is not the reality.
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    Default Re: why does everyone want a new pf?

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    I'm torn.

    The team needs another upper echelon player, a 1A/1B and PF seems like a position it could come at, if its not there, then where is it.

    At times, I think lets roll with this group and see how each players ceiling starts to look like. DC, Tyler, Roy, Paul, George Hill, and even Lance. I just don't know where they'll be in 3 years, yet.

    Other times, I think the Pacers have unprecendented cap room, they need to strike before the other youngsters need extended. This is a small window to add an injection of talent via trade or FA signing.

    Lastly, everytime we talk about adding a PF, we talk about how they'll fit with Roy. I start to wonder if, at times, if limiting yourself to that prerequisite is telling in what you have with Roy. I love Roy, but if I'm constantly asking will a player fit with Roy, maybe its Roy's value/position, who we need to think about.

    Ideal situation is Paul George is that 1A/1B and the rest takes care of itself. You sign a rebounding/defensive 4/5 and you are good. As much as I hope/think Paul is the guy, we have to be realistic and the facts are he was an 8 and 3 guy as a Rookie. You just don't know for sure.

    Worse scenario. You try to sign a 1A/1B Power Forward and you stunt Hansbroughs growth while over spending for a non missing piece. This gets you back to the Muprhy/Dunleavy scenario where you have overpaid players again who eliminate your chance to make improvements very easily due to the amount of cap space they eat up.
    It would be great to get a real star but do you really think that is going to happen? I dont see one coming here. What I do see is a team that can be the deepest in the league that can surround the "core" of DC, Hill, PG, DG, Tyler, and Roy with some accomplished vets who know their role.
    Guys like Foster, Kirilenko, Chuck Hayes, and other proven vets could really bolster this team and add to their "Smashmouth" brand that Frank Vogel has created. Also, if they give a huge contract to any of the big FA's, then the ability to keep the core intact will be greatly hindered.
    How would you like to see Roy, Tyler, and George turn into strong contributors only to have to make a decision on which one to keep and which two is let go? That could happen if Bird gives a big contract to West or a guy like him.
    Besides, Tyler could very easily out perform him next year anyway as West is on the downside of his career, especially since tearing his ACL.

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