Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 54

Thread: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

  1. #1

    Post Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks
    Written by thunderbird1245

    Link

    Less than 100 hours away from NBA, I present the 10th write up in this 2011 draft series, and in depth profile of Providence high scoring wing man Marshon Brooks. Previously 9 deep analysis pieces have been written this year, among them Alec Burks, Tristan Thompson, Chris Singleton, and Marcus Morris…..you can read those articles plus the 5 additional breakdowns elsewhere on this site.

    Brooks has moved up draft boards during the workout season, after having a very good statistical year playing for the doormat of the Big East Conference, the Providence Friars. Certainly Brooks put up gaudy numbers, scoring huge amounts of points against some of the countries best teams….including scoring over 50 points in a 2 point loss the Mike Brey’s Notre Dame Fighting Irish.

    Measuring in at the NBA combine at 6’5″ 1/4, Brooks has legitimate NBA wing size, especially when you factor is his freakish wingspan of 7’1.* He weighs a rather spindly 195lbs, though he looked stronger just with the eye test than some of his other wing counterparts in this draft. Likely however he will need to gain a few pounds, and he appears to have a frame that will be able to do that as time goes on. Brooks clearly passes the eyeball test, and looks the part of an NBA basketball player.

    One interesting tidbit: To my knowledge, Brooks will be the only player in the NBA whose mother is a professional referee……his mother is a long time basketball official, now employed by the WNBA.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————— —-

    As the second leading scorer in NCAA basketball, Brooks clearly proved that in his senior season at Providence than he can score the ball, averaging 24.5 ppg. However, as with all scorers, it is important to breakdown just how those points were achieved, so we can try and figure out how his game will translate at the next level.

    Providence gave Brooks more responsibility and freedom on offense than any player I have ever broken down in my years of doing these draft profiles for Pacersdigest. Providence loved to just clear a side or the top, give Brooks the basketball, and spread the floor and let him do his thing. Certainly little to no complexity in the Friars attack, the just dumped the ball to Brooks and hoped for the best.

    That didn’t lead all that often to a “blow by” situation even at the college level. More often than not it led instead to some very difficult contested jump shots off the dribble, some of which Brooks made but more often than you’d like he would miss, as he actually didn’t seem to be that accurate off the dribble as a pull up shooter. His mechanics in this situations were somewhat amiss, as he had a very difficult time getting his upper body and lower body in synch with one another. That led to alot of spectacular looking makes but led to even more misses….and let me tell you, when Brooks missed he was missing badly. No player probably tossed up more bricks this season that Brooks. When he misses, he misses horribly. Yet, he does have a nice touch on his shot and a good high release, so the problem isnt isn’t upper shot form, instead it is a matter of really bad balance with his legs and the fact that he takes an extraordinarily high number of really bad shots that he never will be allowed to shoot at the NBA level. So clearly the way to guard Brooks was to force him outside his comfort zone, make him bounce it, then work hard to stay in front of him and make him take a tough pull up jumper…..which he was anxious to do. Those misses often led to fast break points the other way, as Providence was really bad defensively in transition and often had bad floor balance when Brooks would take all of those ill advised shots…..one of the main reasons that their coach got fired after going 4-14 in conference.

    Brooks has speed with the basketball in open court situations, but he isn’t quick or that explosive on his first step in an attack dribble move….he is like a car with really high top end speed but that takes a while to get started. That usually leads to not being able to clear his own man enough to get all the way by him, especially against high level athletes. And he is not a high flyer, we won’t be a guy who dunks alot or flies high above the rim on drives. Instead, he will have to rely on more savvy moves, being able to put up little floaters and off balance running shots to get by. He is good enough to make those shots at Providence, but can he make them at the NBA level? That will be the question.

    You rarely see Brooks coming off a hard cut to get the basketball, nor did you see him receiving alot of basic basketball screen actions….he wasn’t asked to come off pin downs, staggered screens, cross screens, flare screens, or anything else that would be considered basic basketball at most programs. And despite being considered a really good off the dribble player, you also rarely see Providence set any ball screens for their best player, an oddity considering that the ball screen has made a huge come back at the lower levels of basketball in the past few years. Now, despite getting fired, the Providence coaches had had success at other levels and at other schools, so they aren’t stupid people. I think the question has to be asked about why they used Brooks the way they did. It did help him put up good numbers, but it didn’t help them win……..so what were the reasons they used him so clearly as a pure isolation guy?

    Brooks clearly didn’t play well without the ball at all. He stood, failed to move, didn’t set up cuts well, and seemed to always read screens pretty poorly, on the rare occasion he received one. Providence also didn’t seem to run very many complex set plays in order to make Brooks harder to guard, or to try and improve his judgment or their floor balance or to get others involved.

    My theory is, and it is only a theory based on how they played on tape and how Brooks seemed to play in general, is that he has a tough time processing information, struggles to remember complex plays or systems, and basically isn’t an overly smart and savvy basketball player. Instead, I am guessing their coaches used him they way they did because after he had been on campus for 4 years, they knew that was the only way he’d be successful…..and as their best player they chose to plan around him rather that their younger guys….a decision that led them to last place and got them canned, though it also apparently will prepare Marshon Brooks to the first round of the NBA draft.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————— —–

    I would like to give you a breakdown of all of the great reads, great passes, or great decisions Marshon Brooks made that I saw on tape. However, the words “pass” and “Marshon Brooks”, don’t go together that well. When he drove, Brooks was going to take a shot of some kind, there was just no doubt about it. He was capable of getting incredibly hot at times, but for a guy who drove that often you’d think at least a few times he would’ve drawn defenders to him and dished to another player for an easy basket….but you certainly don’t see that on film. Now I realize Providence might not have been that good, but what I saw is a player with total tunnel vision with the basketball, who had a tough time seeing and planning for secondary defenders when they helped to him….a guy who didn’t understand where his teammates would be and how to get the ball to them. I don’t know if it was complete selfishness on his part, I just thought I saw someone who didn’t quite understand the best way to attack a defense in a 5 on 5 situation. Again, not saying Brooks wasn’t good enough to score anyway sometimes, because he did….but his missed horrible shots and bad decisions cost his team as many points going to the other end just as much as he scored himself. Brooks turned it over more than he assisted in college, and as scouting gets more intense and the defenders more athletic, I question whether that will improve any at the next level.

    I did like the short memory he had, and the willingness to always take shots no matter what had happened before. His self confidence oozes out of him, and he clearly is a kid who doesn’t get down on himself. But I didn’t see alot of togetherness on his college team, not alot of huddling or talking to his teammates or encouraging them or whatever, another symptom of a team who struggled. He wasn’t willing or didn’t seem capable of doing whatever it took to win a game, instead I saw a guy who much of the time played like “Me-Shon” instead of “Marshon”. Keep in mind that Brooks was a senior leader on this team, not a young freshman or sophomore…..and I do have to factor that in my evaluation.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————— –

    Brooks will need to make a major adjustment to his way of thinking and playing at the NBA level offensively, but he clearly has 2 major NBA ready skills.

    One his ability to catch and shoot in a spot up situations. Brooks was good in transition just rising up and taking the quick 3 point shot, and I also believe that if/when he plays with better talent that he can be a very good spot up guy in halfcourt draw and kick situations.* I don’t think he will be a player, despite all the reports we are reading, that you can ever run plays for to score…..I just don’t see the complexity in his reading screens, the ability to play the screen/roll game, and I have questions that his one on one game will be good enough at this level. But I do believe he can be a very good shooter for someone, as long as all he is asked to do is get in position and be ready to fire. To me he clearly needs a creator around him to help him get those type of shots more often. If he does, I think he can score in this league, but I don’t see him being to score points THE SAME WAY he did at Providence…..his game is going to need to morph into something else entirely. But his ability to shoot can’t be questioned….love the high release, footwork, and follow thru especially. Add those good fundamentals to a guy who clearly has no conscience and you might have something there eventually, as long as he plays within his own skill set.

    The other skill that is NBA ready I think is his ability to rebound from the wing position, IF he dedicates himself to being that good at that in the league. He has really good hands, and his amazing length should make him a very good defensive rebounder for his position in the future. Now keep in mind that his numbers are somewhat inflated at Providence, due to the lack of any one else they had with any talent, and also the fact that their pace of play was so really fast. There were more rebound chances and opportunities in a Providence College game than 95% of the teams you’d see play. Still, his gifts are too good to be ignored on the glass, and as long as his effort level stays the same on the boards when he doesn’t get to dominate the ball offensively, then he should be above average as a rebound guy for a “2″ in this league.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————— —-

    Was Brooks a lockdown defender at Providence? Clearly not. But he does have enough athletic gifts that he should be better than he has proven so far. Providence played little defense in general, and when they did you saw alot of attempted full court pressure and halfcourt zone defense. So they clearly played a style that wasn’t conducive to winning.

    I saw a guy in Brooks who has really good top end speed, but not super great lateral quickness. Can he be improved in that area, time will tell. My guess is that Brooks will do fine defending the ball when his man isolates against him, but will struggle to get around screens, struggle in help defense and in more complex defensive systems. He will be a guy who gambles alot and gets some steals, and his length should let him be above league positional average in blocks per minutes. I can see him having some good stats, but when digging deeper I am not sure I see the consistent effort or aptitude to make his team any better defensively when he is on the floor. He really seemed to struggle to “defend his gap”, and screens really bothered him. And when his man screened someone else, Brooks didn’t show any real energy or desire to hedge out, bump cutters, or do anything but play individual defense. Whether that shows a lack of effort or lack of sheer basketball understanding (that is my guess from afar) is hard to say.

    —————————————————————————————————————————————

    So what do we have in Marshon Brooks?

    What I think we have is a player with a scorer’s mentality, who takes bad shots and doesn’t always play the game with intelligence and savvy. But he also plays with a striking self confidence and short memory, which is appealing in its own right. I think we see a player who will have one of the bigger learning curves and adjustments to the league than the other perimeter players likely to be drafted in the first round. I think we have a kid whose main strengths won’t be as good with the upgrade in competition, but who has enough talent and charisma to re invent himself in the right situation as a creative second unit scorer, scoring in a multitude of ways if he is willing to put the work in and change his game somewhat.* I severely* question his overall basketball IQ and vision/awareness levels, and the fact that he put up alot of numbers as a chucker on a bad team goes against him in my scouting mind….especially when he did it as a senior playing against mostly underclassmen. I see a guy who has some serious adjustments to make in his level of concentration and in his preparation and overall knowledge of how to play and win and be a professional. When you listen to an interview and hear him constantly refer to himself in the third person ( a trait I absolutely hate when people do it), I wonder if he will ever “get it”.

    The big scouting debate you hear going on right now is the huge battle between players who play the same position…guys like Alec Burks, Klay Thompson, and Marshon Brooks. Rumor is that Brooks is killing those other 2 in workouts in each city, a major reason why his stock is rising all over the league.

    But to me, those 1 on 1, 2 on 2, or 3 on 3 workouts are very misleading. I don’t have much doubt that in a scrimmage situation where there is no crowd, no teamwork, no plays to remember, no scouting reports, and no referees that Brooks likely is the more impressive player than Burks or Thompson. He is more athletic and more aggressive than both of them at this point. But while I believe those 2 kids can play the same style of basketball they played in college (and just need to improve their weaknesses and get stronger), Brooks will need to be much more adaptable than they will. I just don’t see that as anywhere near as likely to happen.Plus, when you consider that he is quite a bit older than those 2 players, to me picking Burks or Thompson over him seems to be a no brainer.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————— ——

    So what will Indiana do at #15 with Marshon Brooks?

    Despite what the pundits are reporting, I believe Indiana will pass on Marshon Brooks. I just have a hard time believing that one of the most savvy, intelligent, best passers, and player with maybe thew best anticipation and court vision of any player in the history of the game will select a player like Marshon Brooks. Brooks has talent and I think he will stick in the league for a few years, but I think Indiana should and will pass. We will find out if I am correct on Thursday night. Of course, in the unlikely event that every other single player I like better is gone, then I’d go ahead and take him…..but I think there will players in this draft available that I like better when we are on the clock.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————— —

    So where does Brooks end up instead?

    To me, he would fit best in the high tempo, open court style of play. That to me is just screaming 2 locations for him to be selected, which are Minnesota at #20 and Denver at #22.* I think Chicago at #28 would love to have him as well, and might even package #28 and #30 to move up a little bit to try and snag him. My guess is he ends up with one of those 3 teams.

    ————————————————————————————————————————————— —

    Current NBA comparable: slightly bigger and longer armed Jodie Meeks

    Past NBA comparable : Any thoughts?

    As always, the above is just my opinion.

    Tbird


  2. The Following 16 Users Say Thank You to RoboHicks For This Useful Post:

    + Show/Hide list of the thanked


  3. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    In a Gym
    Age
    21
    Posts
    16,852
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    I agree i do not want Brooks he reminds me to much of Flip Murry or JR Smith. Doesn't play good defense is actually poor from everything i hear. The key point is he needs the ball in his hands to be successful i don't want that type of guy unless he is an excellent defender.

    Pass
    Last edited by pacer4ever; 06-19-2011 at 04:06 PM.

  4. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to pacer4ever For This Useful Post:


  5. #3
    I have a Member xBulletproof's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    4,671

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    I think Brooks is the decoy this year. Just my feeling.

    That said, I have NO CLUE who he could be a decoy for. I usually have a guess, but I can't even think of one now. I think we may trade back for Rick Jackson, but that's not based on anything except a hunch. We'll see.

  6. The Following User Says Thank You to xBulletproof For This Useful Post:


  7. #4
    Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    In a Gym
    Age
    21
    Posts
    16,852
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by xBulletproof View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think Brooks is the decoy this year. Just my feeling.

    That said, I have NO CLUE who he could be a decoy for. I usually have a guess, but I can't even think of one now. I think we may trade back for Rick Jackson, but that's not based on anything except a hunch. We'll see.
    Rick should be there in the 2nd round he might even go undrafted

  8. #5

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by xBulletproof View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think Brooks is the decoy this year. Just my feeling.

    That said, I have NO CLUE who he could be a decoy for. I usually have a guess, but I can't even think of one now. I think we may trade back for Rick Jackson, but that's not based on anything except a hunch. We'll see.
    I am trying to remember the last time we used a decoy and I can't come up with anything. Certainly they like to keep things under raps but Bird did say he's tartgeting 3 players at 15 and I would have to think Brooks is on of them along with Jimmer. If anything I think Jimmer is the decoy.

  9. #6

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    I go back and forth on Brooks. I have no strong opinion of him because I haven't seen him play, but I love his stat efficiency in the given situations. Not many chuckers shoot that well, especially when asked to do all of the shot creation.

    I agree that his stock's rising because the workouts cater to his strengths. And the Pacers need someone that can create their own shot. I'd argue that he'll be able to do it in the NBA if he's using his craftiness to get shots. It's like Kevin Love; different position and type of craftiness but he wasn't getting by on his size or athleticism in college either.

    I think I'd pass but I think there's a 70% chance we pick him. Bird picked Hansbrough, who isn't exactly the most aware player on the court. He also traded for Collison, so I wouldn't put a scorer like Brooks past him.

  10. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to imawhat For This Useful Post:


  11. #7
    I have a Member xBulletproof's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    4,671

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Rick should be there in the 2nd round he might even go undrafted
    Holy cow. Im shocked to see that he isn't on some mocks. I swear I saw him in some early 2nds for a while. Granted I don't watch them that closely.

  12. #8

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    If anything I think Jimmer is the decoy.
    He was given a promise by Utah at #12. There's nothing for us to decoy.

  13. #9
    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    The Sprawl
    Age
    29
    Posts
    17,103

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    He was given a promise by Utah at #12. There's nothing for us to decoy.
    Where are you getting that information from?

  14. #10

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Where are you getting that information from?
    It was on twitter from unknown sources on Hoophypes rumor page which could or could not be true. Sources also said that they wouldn't take 2 guards in the first round so I think we will all know by the 3rd pick what Utah will do with the 12th.

  15. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Location
    Fort Wayne, IN
    Posts
    684

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    I like Brooks better for AND1. I like Burks better for the NBA, as he has potential to help make his teammates better and can pass the ball around. I don't care much for Brooks and haven't understood the love affair some around here seem to have with him.

  16. #12
    Undefeated
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Carmel
    Age
    37
    Posts
    988

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    I got really carried away by the Brooks hype, but the closer we get to the draft the less I want him, especially after reading this review. I just think there are other players who will help the team more.
    Danger Zone

  17. #13
    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Age
    36
    Posts
    44,233

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Marshon is a high-risk, high-reward pick. If he pans out, he'll provide us with a lot of the qualities we need in a SG right now. I mean, why trade for a Crawford-level player when we can just draft him? Worst-case, I take him for trade bait to upgrade the SG position now by giving back a potentially excellent one in return.

    Brooks is basically the anti-Rush. Take that for what you will.

  18. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Shade For This Useful Post:


  19. #14
    '12 PD Sunshiner awardee Kemo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    A-Town , Indiana
    Age
    39
    Posts
    4,979

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Marshon is a high-risk, high-reward pick. If he pans out, he'll provide us with a lot of the qualities we need in a SG right now. I mean, why trade for a Crawford-level player when we can just draft him? Worst-case, I take him for trade bait to upgrade the SG position now by giving back a potentially excellent one in return.

    Brooks is basically the anti-Rush. Take that for what you will.
    Speaking of Jamaal Crawford , all indications point to Atlanta letting him walk to become a free agent..



    .
    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Plumlee reminds me of a young Dale Davis. Good rebounding and he contests shots well on defense and his offensive game is very raw just like DD's was coming out of college.
    "If my answers frighten you, then you should cease asking scary questions."

  20. #15
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    41
    Posts
    24,561

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I agree i do not want Brooks he reminds me to much of Flip Murry or JR Smith. Doesn't play good defense is actually poor from everything i hear. The key point is he needs the ball in his hands to be successful i don't want that type of guy unless he is an excellent defender.

    Pass
    I totally agree here on the comparison to Flip Murray when it comes to dominating the ball.....I just kept on remembering that once Flip got the ball......he kept it and you pretty much knew that he would try to score the ball on his own.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  21. #16
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    41
    Posts
    24,561

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    I had Brooks listed as my 1B choice in the other "Who do I want in the draft" thread.......mainly because I am sure that his ability to score was the one "sure thing" that he was more then capable of doing. However, I have had concerns about his ability to "play off the ball" and be effective without the ball in his hands since he was such a ball dominant Player....but after reading TBird's analysis....he pretty much confirmed my concerns about him and pushed him further down my list of Players to draft.

    I do not doubt his ability to score....but I'm really concerned about his ability to learn to play "we ball" ( which he doesn't appear to be good at ) as opposed to "me ball" ( which he appears to be good at ).
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  22. #17
    Member owl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    4,201

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Marshon is a high-risk, high-reward pick. If he pans out, he'll provide us with a lot of the qualities we need in a SG right now. I mean, why trade for a Crawford-level player when we can just draft him? Worst-case, I take him for trade bait to upgrade the SG position now by giving back a potentially excellent one in return.

    Brooks is basically the anti-Rush. Take that for what you will.
    I don't think he will have to be encouraged to try and score. :-)
    Getting him to submit to what is best for the team will be the challenge.
    {o,o}
    |)__)
    -"-"-

  23. #18
    Member Speed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Brownsburg
    Posts
    8,525

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Man I'm kind of at a loss on who could even be a solid rotation guy at #15, now. Burks can't shoot, Jimmer can't guard, Morris' aren't very big, Singleton is offense limited, Klay isn't athletic, Biyombo is horrific offensively, Tristan Thompson is bad offensively, Tobias Harris who is 'good' at most things, great at none, Faried is the size of a shortish, strong Small Forward, basically. I just can't think of where they should go.

    I'm guessing Singleton would be who I'd want, who won't even be there. Side note, I saw an article where Singleton was measured 6'7" then a few months later I guess, 6'8 1/2" IIRC.

    I still wonder if Jonas will get an out to his contract, if he doesn't it'll be hard for teams to take him with the Rubio deal so fresh in peoples minds.

    I suppose the Pacers will do what Bird tried to do back in Feb, trade the #15 pick.

    Side Note: Morway was on a couple of Sunday night local sports deals and said they have a couple of deals in front of them to consider. Also, he said he didn't expect Jimmer to be there at #15.
    Last edited by Speed; 06-20-2011 at 12:24 PM.

  24. #19
    Pacer Pride, Colts Strong Kid Minneapolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4,419

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    To everyone who reads these analyses, I just want to make a comment, I'm sure TBird would agree with what I'm about to say:

    The important thing to remember after reading these analyses is the last statement: "As always, the above is just my opinion."

    TBird, I know your analysis is sorta taken as gospel around here, so I don't want you to think this is any disrespect to you, I appreciate your effort that you give.

    A lot of verbiage don't make a truth, it's still an opinion. Don't get caught up in the fact that a post is a mile long, and take it as "this must be the truth". It's someone's opinion. Just like TBird himself admitted in a recent post, he completely neglected to give thorough analyzation on Tyler Hansbrough after running out a bunch of analysis on other guys. That's not to discredit the analysis he did on other players, but even TBird is making an educated guess. It's an imperfect art.

    Too many people flip-flop too easily based off the most recent article they just read. You gotta keep an even keel to this. You can't expect a perfect player at 15 in a relatively weak draft. If you overanalyze *anyone* you're going to find a bunch of negatives about them. Finding negatives about a player doesn't mean they should not be selected.

    There are a lot of things about Brooks that TBird did not mention in his analysis, like intangibles... the fact that he improved significantly each year, the fact that he's known as a extremely hard, Kobe-like worker off-the-court. The fact that he *was* able to take on multiple defenders in defenses built entirely to stop him and he was still able to get his shot off or get someone else a shot, to a somewhat surprising amount of success. That is extremely crucial in the NBA. It's something this current Pacer team lacks sorely.

    The negatives that were focused on were things that *we don't need*. We have versatility on this team. We have spot-up shooters. We have rebounders. We have defensive guys. What we *don't* have is a killer-instinct, isolation offensive player that we can dump the ball off to and get us a bucket against a tough defense as the game is on the line. It was the most glaring weakness this team had in the playoffs... as evidenced by the fact that we dominated the Bulls for the first 3 quarters of almost every single game, and lost it in the fourth quarter (to, you guessed it, a guy who could isolate and more importantly, draw additional defenders) when we couldn't generate a bucket within our team offense. I know people frown upon isolation plays as selfish, but it's a very necessary part of the game to incorporate in spots. The problem occurs when you *depend* on it. But you don't want to ignore it completely, either.

    This draft isn't terribly strong, and we're not drafting terribly high. The expectation of getting a starter from this draft isn't likely. We're likely going to get a situational player. The situation we struggle at most, imo, is isolation. That's why I advocate getting someone like Brooks.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 06-20-2011 at 11:51 AM.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

  25. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Kid Minneapolis For This Useful Post:


  26. #20

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    This draft isn't terribly strong, and we're not drafting terribly high. The expectation of getting a starter from this draft isn't likely. We're likely going to get a situational player. The situation we struggle at most, imo, is isolation. That's why I advocate getting someone like Brooks.
    Given those situations I really don't want to watch a rookie try to learn the NBA game. Isolations are important and I personally would rather sign a vet like Crawford than watch Brooks try to get his own shot in an important game like the playoffs in 2012.

    I like Brooks over Klay because I want a better defender at the 2 but I would rather trade back and get Selby at 17 if thats an option. With this much money I would rather us sign FAs/trade and rely on them than drafting ones to fullfill a role that you suggest.

  27. #21
    Pacer Pride, Colts Strong Kid Minneapolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4,419

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    1) Brooks is cheaper.
    2) Crawford is 31 and likely not going to be reproducing his past performances on a regular basis.

    I daresay that Brooks has a better isolation game now than Crawford anyway. Crawford does a lot of deep shots 1-on-1, almost like desperation hail mary's (which he's pretty good at, but they are becoming a lot less frequent than a few years ago). Brooks works anywhere on the court, against any # of defenders, scoring anywhere from the rim to out past the 3-point line.

    Brooks is a 4-year player, so it's not like he's 18 and fragile, mentally. He's not a raw guy who needs a ton of development as say, Biyombo. He has a polished and versatile offensive repertoire. I understand that Brooks likely won't be winning us any championships this year, but next year, the year after, he could be a real isolation force. And whos to say that he wouldn't be a significant playoff contributor, anyway? Would anyone have imagined that Paul George (mostly unknown and with a lot of question marks, but a lot of "upside" that needed to be developed) would be "locking down" Derrick Rose in his rookie season playoff run? You just never know.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 06-20-2011 at 12:15 PM.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

  28. #22

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Man I'm kind of at a loss on who could even be a solid rotation guy at #15, now. Burks can't shoot, Jimmer can't guard, Morris' aren't very big, Singleton is offense limited, Klay isn't athletic, Biyombo is horrific offensively, Tristan Thompson is bad offensively, Tobias Harris who is 'good' at most things, great at none, Faried is the size of a shortish, strong Small Forward, basically. I just can't think of where they should go.

    I'm guessing Singleton would be who I'd want, who won't even be there. Side note, I saw an article where Singleton was measured 6'7" then a few months later I guess, 6'8 1/2" IIRC.

    I still wonder if Jonas will get an out to his contract, if he doesn't it'll be hard for teams to take him with the Rubio deal so fresh in peoples minds.

    I suppose the Pacers will do what Bird tried to due back in Feb, trade the #15 pick.

    Side Note: Morway was on a couple of Sunday night local sports deals and said they have a couple of deals in front of them to consider. Also, he said he didn't expect Jimmer to be there at #15.
    Love this post, Speed! I've been on the same wave length (but didn't hear Morway, so thanks) and am currently thinking trade down. There are half a dozen players I'd love to have in the 20s (e.g., Vucevic, Shumpert/Jackson). If we can get a veteran and one of them, then much better than what we may be looking at with #15.
    Last edited by DrFife; 06-20-2011 at 12:21 PM.

  29. The Following User Says Thank You to DrFife For This Useful Post:


  30. #23
    Member PR07's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    4,957

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    I did like the short memory he had, and the willingness to always take shots no matter what had happened before. His self confidence oozes out of him, and he clearly is a kid who doesn’t get down on himself.
    I think this is one reason Bird may very well like him. Bird tends to like players who can bring some swagger and attitude.

  31. #24

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    1) Brooks is cheaper.
    2) Crawford is 31 and likely not going to be reproducing his past performances on a regular basis.
    Ya I still would rather go the veteran route than rely on a young iso talent. With 4 seconds left on the clock Crawford is still making around 44% of his shots.

    Quote Originally Posted by PR07 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think this is one reason Bird may very well like him. Bird tends to like players who can bring some swagger and attitude.
    Lance being the most recent example.

  32. #25
    Member troy_225's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Ft. Wayne, IN
    Posts
    17

    Default Re: Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #10: Marshon Brooks

    this is off topic but its not letting me post a new thread, did the pacers print a 2010-11media guide this year? ive been trying to get one and can't find one. i've looked on ebay, amazon and the pacers homecourt 1 and 2, please help

Similar Threads

  1. Chad Fords Mock Draft 4.0
    By Speed in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 129
    Last Post: 06-15-2011, 01:49 PM
  2. Tbird 2011 NBA draft analysis #5: Marcus Morris
    By RoboHicks in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 06-05-2011, 04:40 PM
  3. Chad Ford's Draft Grades
    By 1984 in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 06-25-2010, 03:30 PM
  4. Mock Draft Version 7.0: Picks 1-30
    By drewdawg in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 19
    Last Post: 06-24-2010, 03:20 PM
  5. Official 2009 NBA Draft Recruiting Center
    By OakMoses in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 1872
    Last Post: 06-25-2009, 03:14 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •