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Thread: Buying a Draft Pick?

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    Default Buying a Draft Pick?

    Does anyone know what the Pacers would have to do in order to "buy" a draft pick from another team. There has been a lot of talk about teams under the cap being able to do that but I am not aware of the specifics needed to get it done.
    Also, what teams are possible "sellers" anyway? Could this be a less expensive route to building a roster?

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    There are a couple of different ways to do it.

    There is the traditional route where a team "trades" it's first round pick for "cash considerations". The going rate the past few years has been about $3 million for a 1st round pick.

    There is also a way to "buy" a pick by taking on a player. Say Boston decides they don't want to pay the $6 million they stupidly gave Jermaine O'Neal to play for them next year. They could draft a player for a team (like the Pacers) who is under the cap. Then they trade Jermaine O'Neal + whomever they draft to the Pacers once the lockout is over. This way we "buy" the pick by agreeing to pay J.O.'s salary for the year.
    "A man with no belly has no appetite for life."

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by mellifluous View Post
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    There are a couple of different ways to do it.

    There is the traditional route where a team "trades" it's first round pick for "cash considerations". The going rate the past few years has been about $3 million for a 1st round pick.

    There is also a way to "buy" a pick by taking on a player. Say Boston decides they don't want to pay the $6 million they stupidly gave Jermaine O'Neal to play for them next year. They could draft a player for a team (like the Pacers) who is under the cap. Then they trade Jermaine O'Neal + whomever they draft to the Pacers once the lockout is over. This way we "buy" the pick by agreeing to pay J.O.'s salary for the year.
    Thanks! I was aware of the second way in which someone would send us a player and a pick for taking him (this was done a lot last year). What I did not know was the going rate for a pick. Are all picks worth the same? Can anyone purchase one that is for sale or does the team have to be under the cap?

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    Does anyone know what the Pacers would have to do in order to "buy" a draft pick from another team. There has been a lot of talk about teams under the cap being able to do that but I am not aware of the specifics needed to get it done.
    Also, what teams are possible "sellers" anyway? Could this be a less expensive route to building a roster?


    Just approach another team and ask them if they are interested in selling their pick. Cap has nothing to do with buying a pick. 1st round picks can be sold for up to 3 mil. The money an owner spends for a pick comes straight out of his pocket like Paul Allen has done.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    I'd be up for getting an extra pick this year. I know it's a weak draft, but I think we could grab a pretty decent player with an extra pick.

    I'm thinking of someone like Reggie Jackson, JaJuan Johnson (definitely not a homer pick; I am an alum of IU-Bloomington), or Jeremy Tyler with a late 1st or early 2nd round pick. If scouting thinks a player will be a good long-term prospect, the low price of the rookie contract helps offset the cost of acquring the extra pick somewhat.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    With our team's financial situation, I'd be incredibly shocked to see us "buy" a pick in this draft.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    With our team's financial situation, I'd be incredibly shocked to see us "buy" a pick in this draft.
    Why is that? They will be several millions under the cap. They purchase the pick and take the cost off of what they were going to spend. In other words, if they targeted a payroll next year of 60mill, just spend 57 mill and the pick is paid for right away. There are numerous ways to do things like this. How do you think the Simons got so rich?

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    Why is that? They will be several millions under the cap. They purchase the pick and take the cost off of what they were going to spend. In other words, if they targeted a payroll next year of 60mill, just spend 57 mill and the pick is paid for right away. There are numerous ways to do things like this. How do you think the Simons got so rich?
    Not by buying late first round picks in crappy drafts for a team that doesn't need any more young players.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Not by buying late first round picks in crappy drafts for a team that doesn't need any more young players.
    The end of the first round will not be crappy. The only crappy part of the draft will be the lottery. There will be significant value in the bottom half of the draft. Josh Shelby, JuJuan Johnson, Kenneth Faried will be terrific picks in the second half of the first round.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    The end of the first round will not be crappy. The only crappy part of the draft will be the lottery. There will be significant value in the bottom half of the draft. Josh Shelby, JuJuan Johnson, Kenneth Faried will be terrific picks in the second half of the first round.
    The draft is a very weak one. If the new CBA still includes guaranteed contracts for first round selections, then purchasing a late first round draft choice might be considered a "crappy decision", since late first round choices in a weak draft are not even certain to make a roster, let alone become rotational players.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by beast23 View Post
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    The draft is a very weak one. If the new CBA still includes guaranteed contracts for first round selections, then purchasing a late first round draft choice might be considered a "crappy decision", since late first round choices in a weak draft are not even certain to make a roster, let alone become rotational players.
    You have to do more research about a draft than just reading that it's weak. As Troy said in the post you quoted, the lottery is weak. There's good value in the 2nd half of the first round this year.

    That said, I'd be surprised if we bought a pick too.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by CooperManning View Post
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    You have to do more research about a draft than just reading that it's weak. As Troy said in the post you quoted, the lottery is weak. There's good value in the 2nd half of the first round this year.

    That said, I'd be surprised if we bought a pick too.
    10-30 has good value IMO then a drop off


    the reason it is considered so weak is no clear cut tier 1 type guy. But there is a lot of decent players.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    I agree that there is good value for guys late in the first round, but if you buy a pick for the going rate of $3 million, then sign the guy to the guaranteed contract, you are putting a pretty big investment in him. You better be damn sure he is going to contribute. We are a small market team that hemorrhages money, that type of investment in a player is big. It's not like uberbillionaire Paul Allen dipping into his penny jar to buy a draft pick.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    10-30 has good value IMO then a drop off


    the reason it is considered so weak is no clear cut tier 1 type guy. But there is a lot of decent players.
    That is pretty much what I have been hearing all along. This draft will probably end up having more players who actually contribute than most drafts of recent memory. It is full of quality players in the first round. All I hear is how there are no potential superstars. Well, how often do you get one of those in the last half of the 1st rd anyway. Buying a pick in the 2nd half would seem to be the least expensive way to go about it.

  18. #15

    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    That is pretty much what I have been hearing all along. This draft will probably end up having more players who actually contribute than most drafts of recent memory. It is full of quality players in the first round. All I hear is how there are no potential superstars. Well, how often do you get one of those in the last half of the 1st rd anyway. Buying a pick in the 2nd half would seem to be the least expensive way to go about it.


    Herb Simon to my knowledge has never put out money to buy a pick, so why now? I believe you have a better chance tonight of winning Mega Millions, if you bought a ticket than Herb Simon spending 3 mil on a bottom 3rd pick.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    I agree that there is good value for guys late in the first round, but if you buy a pick for the going rate of $3 million, then sign the guy to the guaranteed contract, you are putting a pretty big investment in him. You better be damn sure he is going to contribute. We are a small market team that hemorrhages money, that type of investment in a player is big. It's not like uberbillionaire Paul Allen dipping into his penny jar to buy a draft pick.
    Any other year I'd be 100% sure we're not buying a pick, this year I'm just like 95% sure. I think the slight chance could be if Bird really pushes for it and says, "Hey Herb, you're not going to be shelling out any cash for Tinsley, Dunleavy, or TJ Ford this year and we just made the playoffs but we need to get better. Hook it up."

    $3 mil is a hefty price for the pick, but the contract really isn't adding much. Say we buy the 25 pick, last year's 25 pick (Dominique Jones) made $1.11 mil his rookie year, $1.19 mil second year, then two team option years. Say that's taking the roster spot of a guy who would otherwise have made $800,000, then that means (with the $3 mil fee) it'd be an extra $3.7 mil over two years. A good chunk, but well worth it if we were to find a quality role player (/attractive trade chip down the road).

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    Herb Simon to my knowledge has never put out money to buy a pick, so why now? I believe you have a better chance tonight of winning Mega Millions, if you bought a ticket than Herb Simon spending 3 mil on a bottom 3rd pick.
    If you understand how finances work, you will agree that Herb doesnt have to be out one penny for the pick. He tells Bird to take whatever the pick costs off the team payroll next year. Period! The pick will in essence be free. The only question will be does Bird see a player he likes enough to agree not to spend the cash he paid for the pick?
    BTW - the asking price for a bottom of round one pick is not necessarily $3mill. The lower the pick, the lower the cost.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    If you understand how finances work, you will agree that Herb doesnt have to be out one penny for the pick. He tells Bird to take whatever the pick costs off the team payroll next year. Period! The pick will in essence be free. The only question will be does Bird see a player he likes enough to agree not to spend the cash he paid for the pick?
    BTW - the asking price for a bottom of round one pick is not necessarily $3mill. The lower the pick, the lower the cost.

    But that 3 mil for a 25-30 pick could come back and bite Bird b/c he doesn't have enough salary left to get another player that comes available later. Is that pick going to be worth 4-5 mil in overall salary next season? That same money can be used on acquiring a good player with experience who can help the team immediately.

    What team in the last 4 years has paid less than 3 mil for a 1st round pick? It's a sellers market. You want my pick you pay my price.

    I just don't see Bird or Simon buying a pick. Even after saying that, I'm not against it in theory. The player being picked has to be worth what's being spent. If not, it's a waste of money/salary that could be used better elsewhere.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    I'd be up for buying a pick. It seems like every year the Pacers are too, they just seem to come up short on these trades for whatever reasons.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    But that 3 mil for a 25-30 pick could come back and bite Bird b/c he doesn't have enough salary left to get another player that comes available later. Is that pick going to be worth 4-5 mil in overall salary next season? That same money can be used on acquiring a good player with experience who can help the team immediately.

    What team in the last 4 years has paid less than 3 mil for a 1st round pick? It's a sellers market. You want my pick you pay my price.

    I just don't see Bird or Simon buying a pick. Even after saying that, I'm not against it in theory. The player being picked has to be worth what's being spent. If not, it's a waste of money/salary that could be used better elsewhere.
    I dont see anyway that the Pacers will spend all of their cap money this year. With all the young talent they have, it is not imperitive that they pick up all the pieces this year. Partly, because not all the pieces are available. There is plenty of money to play with. Buying a pick is one, taking on a big contract from another team could net them a pic for nothing as well. I am not suggesting this is necessary but it is possible.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by PR07 View Post
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    I'd be up for buying a pick. It seems like every year the Pacers are too, they just seem to come up short on these trades for whatever reasons.
    I am an IU fan, but would still love to see them acquire a lower pick in order to get JuJuan Johnson. I think he will be a solid pro! Great kid, great work ethic, and he is 6"10 on top of that.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    I would love to get JaJuan in the 20's somewhere.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by troyc11a View Post
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    Why is that? They will be several millions under the cap. They purchase the pick and take the cost off of what they were going to spend. In other words, if they targeted a payroll next year of 60mill, just spend 57 mill and the pick is paid for right away. There are numerous ways to do things like this. How do you think the Simons got so rich?
    The Simon's got rich by building shopping malls, not by owning an NBA team.
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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?...26id%3d6672205

    can someone post this article?


    it is suppose to have trade rumors and Reggie Jackson news.
    Last edited by pacer4ever; 06-18-2011 at 02:19 PM.

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    Default Re: Buying a Draft Pick?

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    Herb Simon to my knowledge has never put out money to buy a pick, so why now?
    Remember that one of the conditions of Bird's return was that Simon allow him to actually spend this season (and presumably, the following ones until a championship team is found). That would probably include buying draft picks as necessary, if they happen to bring us viable roster pieces.
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