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Thread: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

  1. #126
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Well... I just saw the safety truck near miss at the beginning. Holy crap, how does THAT happen???

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sHuIb...&feature=share
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  2. #127
    A happy Roy is a good Roy DaveP63's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    There was a truck already parked in it's "hole" where he was supposed to park. Im sure TGBB was probably berating the drivers for something so he couldn't be bothered to actually look at the racing surface...LOL.
    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetimeís worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

  3. #128
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    There's some interesting comments in Miller's Mailbag (Speed.com) about race control this past weekend plus a story about Rahal and the truck is posted as well.

    They touched on this during the broadcast but Miller had more on the subject of Penske being told by TGBB that Helio was an innocent bystander and would not be penalized and lose his starting spot if he switched to a backup car. Cindric was quoted on all of this. Then after a period of time Blanchard came to tell him that Helio WOULD be penalized. The issue then became, based on the earlier info they didn't bother with trying to repair the other car since it was easier just to prepare the backup. But he says had they known they would've been penalized in the first place then they would've had time to repair the primary car. So then he goes to talk to TGBB who now tells him it's what is in the rulebook. Which I think we all know is true but Cindric thought he was using 'the chief steward's discretion'... which we all know TGBB does do. And of course that seemed to be the case with his earlier comments to Cindric. Team Penske made it's decision based on direct info from TGBB.

    Also, Briscoe's penalty... Apparently just 2 corners before the green race control told Briscoe he had to fall back and give up positions. Penske then pitted him under green (which allowed the cars around him to pass him obviously) but race control didn't like that so THAT is why we he then had to do a drive thru in the pits. The broadcast reported that the drivethru under green was his penalty after questioning why he was left toward the front in the lineup under yellow once they heard he'd be penalized for avoidable contact. I think I have that right...
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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  5. #129
    A happy Roy is a good Roy DaveP63's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Roger must have one hell of a lot of self control. Foyt would have went up to race control and they'd still be picking up pieces of TGBB off the ground...I have been around and part of a LOT of racing series over the years and USAC makes Indycar look like a bunch of dolts...And that's saying a lot coming from me. The best I've ever seen was IMSA.
    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetimeís worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

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  7. #130
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    The Captain doesn't need to go to Race Control to raise Hell. He does it behind the scenes!
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
    Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca

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  9. #131
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    And Francrybaby may have just shot himself in the foot in Motegi! He better get penalized for punting Briscoe!

    We're going to see us a whine tonight!

    Moving to the back of the line? That's not a penalty! He was already at the back of the line!

    And TK gets a drive through for speeding in the pits. Thats a whole lot worse than punting 3 other cars...... /sar
    Last edited by Sandman21; 09-18-2011 at 01:48 AM.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
    Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca

  10. #132
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Helio got moved from 7th to 22nd for passing in a yellow corner at the end of the race. Reports say he isn't happy....
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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  12. #133
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Poor Helio... not. Fact is he passed under yellow, but I can sure understand why he isn't happy, and I hope Penske raises some Hell with Race Control after that gift they gave Princess Francrybaby.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
    Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca

  13. #134
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    I didn't actually see Helio's move so I don't know how blatant or unsafe it was. Assuming it wasn't much of either then I'd think requiring him to give back the spot would be plenty of punishment. That late in the race inserting him to the back of the pack is a mighty steep penalty.

    It seems like every week we're on here talking about some penalty that was issued or wondering why a penalty wasn't issued. And the penalties all affect the racing outcome. I don't think that is good for casual fans or sponsors.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  14. #135
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Anti-confidence in Barnhart editorial-
    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe...2171432/page1/

    What I come away with regarding TGBB is that I don't have a problem with the rulebook granting the chief steward discretion... I even think it's necessary for when extraordinary circumstances occur. I just don't trust TGBB to use that discretion properly.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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  16. #136
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    I was just looking at pics and reading Randy Bernhard's comments on the new 2012 Dallara. It made it's debut on the IMS oval this week.

    Man... that thing is butt ugly. It looks like a flying saucer with a nosecone and wheels. I need to go back and look at the roadcourse look. It didn't look that ugly to me. I SO wish they hadn't postponed the aero-kits. I wouldn't mind a couple of ugly ducklings if they could kick azz but 33 of these? Hmmmmm

    The next comment I have is about Bernhard hoping the new car can again challenge for speed records at Indy. Well, how hard would that be?? You could drag out 16 year old car next year if the rules allowed it and challenge for speed records. IOW, we've been there and done that. We don't need to reinvent the wheel in order for Indycar technology to show us those speeds. The template is already there. It shouldn't have been hard to put that into the equation if they really wanted it.

    I think that's one of the biggest problems with Indycar losing the imagination of the general public- It's no longer the cutting edge of racing technology and there's no way to even market it as that as long as the current crop of cars can't match the speeds of 16 years ago.

    So if they want them to challenge for records at IMS... that shouldn't be hard... and it shouldn't be hard with what's been learned about safety.... it shouldn't be a question mark. If it is, that doesn't speak well for what they've learned these past 16 years. Or the lines of communication between marketing types, engineering types, and racing types....
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  17. #137
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Little Al... tsk tsk tsk....

    DUI... Drag Racing...

    Suspended from Indycar pending review.

    I don't know what to say.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  18. #138
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Two time 500 champ turned drunk drag racer. Sad.

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  20. #139
    A happy Roy is a good Roy DaveP63's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Anti-confidence in Barnhart editorial-
    http://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe...2171432/page1/

    What I come away with regarding TGBB is that I don't have a problem with the rulebook granting the chief steward discretion... I even think it's necessary for when extraordinary circumstances occur. I just don't trust TGBB to use that discretion properly.
    The Rule Book is supposed to be under revision and taking out a lot of "at the discretion of the chief steward". Since his discretion can be...interesting.

    I was afraid this would go bad for Little Al since he's been getting some heat by product from the TGBB saga. I'd drink too...

    That is not the most flattering angle for the new car. I am not a huge fan either, but it's better for the driver and I look for there to be some revisions before it becomes final. It just seems to me like it's got a fat ***...
    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetimeís worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

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  22. #140
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    ED FREAKING CARPENTER!!

    WHAT A FINISH!
    Last edited by Sandman21; 10-02-2011 at 04:39 PM.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
    Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca

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  24. #141
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    OK... So that could've been the last Kentucky Speedway Indycar race. I wasn't at this one so I guess I'm part of the problem this year but I think I've been to all but maybe 1 or 2 of the races there before today's race. I had nobody to go with me and I didn't want to go by myself. The people that normally would've went had commitments. BUT.... was an October Sunday date really anything but a suicidal date anyway? Not only competing with the NFL and Nascar on TV but also the Bengals in person. And if it was an annual date the Colts could've been in that mix too.

    Indycar has proven this year that it's far from 'must-see' viewing on the ovals for fans. I'm still at a loss for the continued decline at all ovals (except Indy that seems to have stemmed the bleeding). Something needs looked at because clearly the series is missing something in the equation.

    Is it the lack of American drivers that fans can relate to and follow their careers from grassroots to Indycar? Is Indycar just doing a bad job of promoting its drivers?

    Does the series need to get more involved with promotion at the individual venues in order to see that the series and each event is promoted properly? Is Indycar more interested in the sanctioning fee versus the bigger picture and sustainability of the ovals and their health?

    I'm not thrilled with the 8 year old cars and their detuned engines but is that really that much of a turn-off for the general public? Have they simply lost the imagination of the general public and hardcore racing fans as well?

    How much of this is due to the inconsistency in race control and more importantly the public perception of the inconsistency in race control?

    Has the Penske-Ganassi dominance hurt the series that badly?

    Are the oval races too short and not providing enough bang for the buck? You go to a Nascar race and it fills an afternoon or evening. You go to local short tracks and you have a night full of hotlaps, q's, heats, consies, and feature. Sometimes multiples of those with different cars. Indycar, except for Indy is pretty much wham-bam-thank you mam. If it wasn't for the stupidly overly long yellows the races would be lucky to last 90mins. Should Indycar look to lengthen oval races and/or condense weekend schedules to just one day of quals and racing in order to give fans a longer time at the track?

    Are prices too high at the track? Ticket pricing seems OK to me but since the stands are empty... maybe they need to be adjusted to find a better pricepoint. What about concessions? Concessions are always a rip-off so maybe that just is piling on to other problems?

    Has something happened that has made the twisties more appealing to Americans than they used to be? Nascar overload? Growing up on Playstation and X box racing?

    Has the push for more and more seats for Nascar during its hey day created a lot of empty aluminum for Indycar at ovals that has helped with the perception the events aren't drawing well... which has created a vicious cycle where the perception becomes reality and ends up a huge buzz kill?

    Has DanicaMania actually turned more people off than it's brought to the track? Has it deligitamized the series with her unable to live up to the hype? I admit, it's turned me off. If it was that wouldn't it hurt twisties as well as ovals?

    Is there something that makes some of these a problem for ovals but doesn't affect road and street courses?
    Last edited by Bball; 10-03-2011 at 04:25 AM.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  25. #142
    A happy Roy is a good Roy DaveP63's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Way to go Dead Ed!!! Congrats to Sara as well! Going head to head with the NFL is not a good idea, IMO. I'm not sure what the answer to that one is. Either end the season earlier or maybe Saturdays? Friday night? Don't know. I'll have to think on that one for a while...
    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetimeís worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

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  27. #143
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    I think Saturday races would be best, especially for traveling fans who have to work on Monday.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
    Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca

  28. #144
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Are the oval races too short and not providing enough bang for the buck? You go to a Nascar race and it fills an afternoon or evening. You go to local short tracks and you have a night full of hotlaps, q's, heats, consies, and feature. Sometimes multiples of those with different cars. Indycar, except for Indy is pretty much wham-bam-thank you mam. If it wasn't for the stupidly overly long yellows the races would be lucky to last 90mins. Should Indycar look to lengthen oval races and/or condense weekend schedules to just one day of quals and racing in order to give fans a longer time at the track?
    The condensed schedule has a lot of merit. Somewhere along the line, we went from show up on Friday, Saturday practice and qualify and race Sunday. Don't know why we need to show up on Wednesday or Thursday and have two days of practice on a track we've been to every year. I see no reason why you couldn't practice on Saturday, qualify Sunday AM and race in the afternoon. Or do it all in one day. You don't need the extra time if you don't crash
    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetimeís worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

  29. #145
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    OK... So that could've been the last Kentucky Speedway Indycar race. I wasn't at this one so I guess I'm part of the problem this year but I think I've been to all but maybe 1 or 2 of the races there before today's race. I had nobody to go with me and I didn't want to go by myself. The people that normally would've went had commitments. BUT.... was an October Sunday date really anything but a suicidal date anyway? Not only competing with the NFL and Nascar on TV but also the Bengals in person. And if it was an annual date the Colts could've been in that mix too...
    You could've went with us...

    Last year and previous years this race was held on a Saturday evening or night. In 2007 (My first time at KY Speedway) it was held in early August. (Ideal) Last year it was held around this time, but it was a night race, and a great race all together. That and the seats we paid $25 for last year were $50 this year. That's nonsense. Luckily we got in for $20 since someone in our group was a retiree from the armed forces.

    This is actually one of IndyCar's best events from a competition standpoint. (Plus it's very close to home. It only took a quarter of a tank of gas from Sparta, KY. to home in Bedford.)

    A lot of grumblings from the garages pointed in the direction of Bruton Smith this weekend when people were commenting on the lack of fan support for this race. Apparently, which is a surprise to me is that a lot of people shrugged this race off because of the way the Cup race in July was handled by the track. I understand the fans' frustration, but I don't think it should've been carried over to IndyCar. No way.

    I hope 2012 sees a Kentucky race. There are only a few races each year that I can attend, and Kentucky is always my #2 behind Indy.

    Now Iowa? We might make the trek over there next summer. That was a great race.

    __________________________________________________ ___________

    On the way home from the race I got this email from Joel Berkemeier..

    Let's pair together some news articles with the conversation I had with Kentucky Speedway president Mark Simendinger yesterday.

    I asked Simendinger what time frame would work for an INDYCAR event in 2012. He told me that between the Kentucky Derby and the Indy 500. The month of May is pretty much out for a race at his track. June is the buildup for the NASCAR Sprint Cup race, while July would be needed for time between the events, marketing another event, and generally giving fans a break.

    So that was a lot of words to say that, basically, the date the track would prefer is the same one they have in 2011. Sure, it's cold this weekend, but temperatures are usually in the lower 70's, which is definitely tolerable if not pleasant.

    However, it would appear that the track is planning on life without the IZOD IndyCar Series.

    From the Cincinnati Enquirer, we have the news that Kentucky Speedway is trying to pair the Nationwide Series with the Camping World Trucks for a race in late September or early October. (http://cincinnati.com/blogs/shifting...e-series-date/)

    What does that mean for INDYCAR? Well, according to Robin Miller, it means that without title sponsors or some kind of financial assistance (ex. reduced sanctioning fees), INDYCAR won't be back to either Kentucky or Loudon. Bruton Smith was here yesterday and met with Randy Bernard as he tried to find a way past the impasse.

    Curt Cavin got a number out of Randy Bernard - they're looking for a title sponsor of between a quarter and a half million dollars. (http://www.indystar.com/article/2011.../1052/SPORTS01)

    A few folks have told me that they think the issue stems from what Bernard did at Las Vegas - which was rent the track out and promote his own race. And, yes, while I get why people think Bernard has undercut himself and reduced his ability to charge decent sanctioning fees on the ovals, the Las Vegas race only works because it's Las Vegas. The same thing would be hard, if not impossible, to pull off anywhere else in America.

    Some other tidbits from Miller's article:
    - Bernard has asked for changes at Mid-Ohio and Infineon to improve the show
    - Porto Alegre has "fallen through"
    - INDYCAR owners were not fans of the idea of the Iowa doubleheader
    - A street circuit / oval doubleheader in Las Vegas is on hold until someone finds the $9 million it would take to pull off.

    Miller also offers his guess at the schedule, which doesn't seem too unreasonable given what we know. http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/artic...dule-revealed/ for that article.

    A few more topics also came up with Mark Simendinger. He's hoping for a crowd of 30-35,000 today, which may be optimistic given how poorly attended the NASCAR Truck race was last night. (The race was won by Ron Hornaday for his 50th career Truck win.)

    A revamp of the garages here was in the cards for this offseason until the parking issues came up after the inaugural Sprint Cup date. Once the parking issues are resolved, the garages will be re-done as Bruton Smith does not care for them. Once the parking is resolved and the garages are done, that should be it as far as major capital projects here in the short term.

    Simendinger is still happy with how great his Sprint Cup date is, saying he faces very little competition in the local sports market for the race. In comparison, trying to sell this race faced resistance from not only the Cincinnati Bengals, but also college football. It makes it that much harder for he and the Speedway to get the word out. That said, a local reporter told us that promotion for this race was light compared to previous years and only started a few weeks ago.
    Last edited by duke dynamite; 10-04-2011 at 10:13 AM.

  30. #146
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Duke,
    Last year it was held on Labor Day weekend. Previously it had been either the first or 2nd weekend in August. This year was a month later than it's ever been. I know there were some question marks from some about the Labor Day weekend date due to something with the Reds. ... but Bruton thought the weekend would be big with people camping at the track. ...Or so he said...

    But the October date adds the potential for cold weather to the event and pits it against Nascar AND the NFL, including the potential of having the Bengals and Colts playing in their home stadiums (which would both be considered markets that the KY track would hope to draw from). The Oct date is just absolutely suicidal IMHO.
    Last edited by Bball; 10-04-2011 at 11:58 AM.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  31. #147
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Duke,
    Last year it was held on Labor Day weekend. Previously it had been either the first or 2nd weekend in August. This year was a month later than it's ever been. I know there were some question marks from some about the Labor Day weekend date due to something with the Reds. ... but Bruton thought the weekend would be big with people camping at the track. ...Or so he said...

    But the October date adds the potential for cold weather to the event and pits it against Nascar AND the NFL, including the potential of having the Bengals and Colts playing in their home stadiums (which would both be considered markets that the KY track would hope to draw from). The Oct date is just absolutely suicidal IMHO.
    I said close to this time!

  32. #148
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Quote Originally Posted by duke dynamite View Post
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    I said close to this time!
    Ok... if a month later is close to the same time... I didn't know we were playing horseshoes...
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  33. #149
    RING THE BELL! Sandman21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    Great nod from Indycar:

    RBINDYCAR Randy Bernard
    @IndyCar will honor #ironmanmike at IZOD INDYCAR world championships with #ironmanmike logo painted on grass infield
    21 minutes ago

    For those who aren't aware, Mike is the kid of the Ganassi Engineer who's been in pretty rough shape lately.
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
    Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca

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  35. #150
    RING THE BELL! Sandman21's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bball's 2011 Indy500 pics and comments

    And it all comes down to this. Great promotion work in Vegas, now time to see who takes it home today!
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
    Want your own "Just Say No to Kamen" from @mkroeger pic? http://twitpic.com/a3hmca

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