View Poll Results: Trade now or wait for a new CBA.

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  • Trade now, we don't want to miss out on a deal.

    19 48.72%
  • Wait it out, the new CBA will make our cap space worth even more

    20 51.28%
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Thread: Trade now or wait

  1. #1
    Member pacers74's Avatar
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    Default Trade now or wait

    We can make a trade now, but after the CBA expires we are stuck with all of our cap space and will have to sit on it until a deal is worked out.

    Thought #1. Now is the time for us to try and do a deal. If this CBA ends in a lockout we might not be able to get anything done.

    Thought #2. Wait it out and hope the new deal works out better for us and teams have to dump salary and we make it like bandits.

    I would have to make a deal now if the right one came along.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    I voted to wait. In spite of potential salary rollbacks and amnesty waived players, I still see any kind of low hard cap a something that will add leverage and value to our cap space. Very few teams would be helped enough by these things to put them under the cap and I think some teams will be put in a postition where they can't afford to offer fair value to their current restricted free agents.
    There are exceptions to this however if we're looking at an offer that's too good to turn down and it doesn't hurt our cap space.

  3. #3
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    all depends on what is offered.

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  5. #4

    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Assuming that any trade we make would be favorable, I like Larry's orientation to trade now ... which then clarifies our strategy for the FA market when the time comes.

  6. #5
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Assuming the trade would be done before the new CBA that would be interesting, because we would be signing 2 top 5 picks with a new cba and possibly new contract requirements for those two picks.. just something to throw in there

  7. #6
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    If we can get a deal like the one that is rumored right now, take it. But I wouldn't trade our young guys (Hibbert, Tyler, George).

  8. #7
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Trade now or wait? Totally irrelevant.

    The Pacers will continue inquiring about other players, just as other teams will inquire regarding the Pacers' players. If something is suggested that would result in an improvement to our roster that is a good deal, then the Pacers will probably jump at it... and it doesn't matter if it is before or after a new CBA becomes law.

  9. #8
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Whatever the new CBA is, I have a feeling it's not going to force teams to shed salaries this season. It's probably also going to have an "Allan Houston" clause that allows teams to get rid of a bad contract or two. My guess is that our cap space will be less of an asset after the new CBA, so trade away.
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  10. #9

    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    I voted for the wait until the CBA is settled, then deal.

    That doesn't mean not make a deal now if it is offered, but it would have to be a lopsided deal. If the CBA has a hard cap of anything less than $60M, there will be plenty of teams trying to cut salary, and lots of good players on the market. IT will be a buyers market for teams with cap space.

    The lakers have $90M cap number next year with only 10 guys. Almost $60M of that is Kobe, Pau Gasol and Andrew Bynum. At least one of those guys will be on the market. Probably both Gasol and Bynum if they keep Kobe.

    While LAL is the worst case, lots of teams are in the same kind of fix.

    ATL has 8 guys and a $66M cap number. They can cut Marvin Williams, but they still have to get 6 vet min contracts to fill out the roster. That keeps them at about the same cap number. They are still going to have to trade one or two of their good guys unless they can find a taker for Joe Johnson's contract.

    BOS has 8 guys and a $73M cap number
    CHI has 9 guys and a $62M cap number.
    CLE has 10 guys and a $59M cap number. They can cut Baron Davis and save $13M, so they are probably OK, but just barely.
    DAL has 8 guys and a $60M cap number. But that does not count Caron Butler and Tyson Chandler.
    MIA has 11 guys and a $67M cap number.
    NYK have 8 guys and a $60M cap number.
    ORL has 10 guys and a $78M cap number. They can save $19 by cutting Gilbert Arenas, so they are probably ok.
    PHI has 8 guys and a $55M cap number. But that doesn't include Thad Young.
    POR has 11 guys and a $67M cap number. But that doesn't include Andre Miller or Greg Oden.
    SAS have 8 guys and a $70M cap number.
    UTH has 8 guys and a $60M cap number.

    Not all my numbers are exactly correct, but my point is . . . after the CBA is settled, the salary cap will be much lower. and some good players will be available. Not waiting until then seems silly, absent a really really good deal right now.

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  12. #10
    #RiseOfTheKing imbtyler's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Quote Originally Posted by xIndyFan;
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    but my point is . . . after the CBA is settled, the salary cap will be much lower. and some good players will be available. Not waiting until then seems silly, absent a really really good deal right now.
    This. And it just makes sense to wait and see who will be cut from teams. In addition to that, we'll be able to offer them less money, as will other teams, but we'll be able to offer just enough more that we'll achieve easy top bids.
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  13. #11
    Rooting My Family 2 Glory CooperManning's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Quote Originally Posted by xIndyFan View Post
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    I voted for the wait until the CBA is settled, then deal.

    That doesn't mean not make a deal now if it is offered, but it would have to be a lopsided deal. If the CBA has a hard cap of anything less than $60M, there will be plenty of teams trying to cut salary, and lots of good players on the market. IT will be a buyers market for teams with cap space.

    The lakers have $90M cap number next year with only 10 guys. Almost $60M of that is Kobe, Pau Gasol and Andrew Bynum. At least one of those guys will be on the market. Probably both Gasol and Bynum if they keep Kobe.

    While LAL is the worst case, lots of teams are in the same kind of fix.

    ATL has 8 guys and a $66M cap number. They can cut Marvin Williams, but they still have to get 6 vet min contracts to fill out the roster. That keeps them at about the same cap number. They are still going to have to trade one or two of their good guys unless they can find a taker for Joe Johnson's contract.

    BOS has 8 guys and a $73M cap number
    CHI has 9 guys and a $62M cap number.
    CLE has 10 guys and a $59M cap number. They can cut Baron Davis and save $13M, so they are probably OK, but just barely.
    DAL has 8 guys and a $60M cap number. But that does not count Caron Butler and Tyson Chandler.
    MIA has 11 guys and a $67M cap number.
    NYK have 8 guys and a $60M cap number.
    ORL has 10 guys and a $78M cap number. They can save $19 by cutting Gilbert Arenas, so they are probably ok.
    PHI has 8 guys and a $55M cap number. But that doesn't include Thad Young.
    POR has 11 guys and a $67M cap number. But that doesn't include Andre Miller or Greg Oden.
    SAS have 8 guys and a $70M cap number.
    UTH has 8 guys and a $60M cap number.

    Not all my numbers are exactly correct, but my point is . . . after the CBA is settled, the salary cap will be much lower. and some good players will be available. Not waiting until then seems silly, absent a really really good deal right now.
    Good job with the numbers, but players like Baron Davis, Marvin Williams, and Arenas can't be cut. Well, they could, but their salary would still count against the cap. Arenas still has three years on his deal, with a player option after next season...which he'll be picking up.

  14. #12

    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Quote Originally Posted by CooperManning View Post
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    Good job with the numbers, but players like Baron Davis, Marvin Williams, and Arenas can't be cut. Well, they could, but their salary would still count against the cap. Arenas still has three years on his deal, with a player option after next season...which he'll be picking up.
    Orlando really tied their hands with that Arenas deal. He may be the most overpaid player to ever step on the court lol. If I was Howard I'd be wanting out of that mess.

  15. #13
    Artificial Intelligence wintermute's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Quote Originally Posted by xIndyFan View Post
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    Not all my numbers are exactly correct, but my point is . . . after the CBA is settled, the salary cap will be much lower. and some good players will be available. Not waiting until then seems silly, absent a really really good deal right now.
    If the salary cap becomes much lower, that also means we'll have much less salary cap space too. Obviously we won't know all the implications for sure until the final CBA is negotiated, but according to the initial proposals, the combination of salary rollbacks, amnesty, and low hard cap means that other teams get to keep their good players while the Pacers' cap space becomes devalued.

    Quote Originally Posted by CooperManning View Post
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    Good job with the numbers, but players like Baron Davis, Marvin Williams, and Arenas can't be cut. Well, they could, but their salary would still count against the cap. Arenas still has three years on his deal, with a player option after next season...which he'll be picking up.
    There's talk of an amnesty provision. The players who get amnestied will still get paid, but their contracts get taken off the cap. Furthermore the owners want to reduce guarantees on contracts, including existing contracts, so cutting players might end up cheaper than you'd think. Basically the owners are proposing a whole host of get-out-of-jail-free cards for teams that have made bad decisions. If these proposals pass, the Pacers who have toiled long and hard to clean up their payroll the old fashioned way won't even get the chance to benefit from their hard work.

  16. #14
    Member Speed's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    I'm not hoping for this, but this thought crossed my mind.

    1.) Stay the course, no big moves, let this current group get another year under their belts of development/increase market value.

    2.) Miss the playoffs due to injuries with Danny being out a big chunk of the year.

    3.) Win the lottery or a top 3 pick in a really really strong draft.

    4a.) Invoke the Spurs plan (Duncan/Robinson year) Keep the top 3 pick as a franchise type player and now you have a developed young group, Danny Granger, & money for a big Free agent.

    4b.) Invoke the Celtics Plan (Garnett for Al Jefferson/#5 for Ray Allen year) Trade the top 3 pick for player one of the big 3, trade some of your developed young players for player two of the big 3. Using your money available to make the moves happen for the big salaries you are taking on.

    Sure its a huge reach, and again I don't hope for it, in any way.

    However, this potentially puts you in contender status, by sacrificing one year.

    Its not something you can "do", actually, but it could work out that way.

  17. #15

    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Quote Originally Posted by CooperManning View Post
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    Good job with the numbers, but players like Baron Davis, Marvin Williams, and Arenas can't be cut. Well, they could, but their salary would still count against the cap. Arenas still has three years on his deal, with a player option after next season...which he'll be picking up.
    sorry for not making it clear. it appears the new CBA will have some kind of 'Allan Houton Rule'. Allowing teams to cut guys and not keep the salary on the books. those were the cuts i referred to.
    Last edited by xIndyFan; 05-24-2011 at 09:24 AM.

  18. #16
    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Depends. Is Lance the one being traded?



    Seriously, I guess it's better to wait. Sure, going off '99, we'll only have a couple weeks to get stuff together, but the trading deadline should still be a ways into the season. If it's like '99, the season is just a waste of space, anyway, so better to take your time and look towards the future.

    That said, it would certainly be nice if we did something before the lockout, if only it gave us something to talk about.
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  19. #17

    Default Re: Trade now or wait

    Quote Originally Posted by CooperManning View Post
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    Good job with the numbers, but players like Baron Davis, Marvin Williams, and Arenas can't be cut. Well, they could, but their salary would still count against the cap. Arenas still has three years on his deal, with a player option after next season...which he'll be picking up.

    Orlando would love to be able to cut Arenas. I caught the error on Arenas, but not the other 2. You can best bet if the NBA allows 1 player to be cut with the salary not counted against the cap, you can color Arenas gone.

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