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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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NFL, NBA Players poised to cut alimony making wives industry dispute victims

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  • NFL, NBA Players poised to cut alimony making wives industry dispute victims

    Yeah and wearing protection(on both sides) would've gone a long way ....

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-0...e-victims.html

    NFL Players Poised to Cut Alimony, Making Wives Industry Dispute Victims
    By Scott Soshnick - May 9, 2011 12:00 AM ET
    inShare.1More
    Business ExchangeBuzz up!DiggPrint Email . Attorney Howard Rudolph, of Rudolph & Associates LLP. Photographer: Chris Goodney/Bloomberg

    NFL and NBA players are lining up to get child support and alimony payments lowered to reflect what would be reduced incomes should their leagues shut down, said attorney Howard Rudolph of Rudolph & Associates LLP, pictured. Photographer: Chris Goodney/Bloomberg
    Tina Julian, a 33-year-old nurse in San Diego, says she may not be able to afford child care if National Football League owners and players can’t agree how to share more than $9 billion in annual revenue.

    Julian’s concern stems from the child support she gets from her 2-year-old son’s father, New York Jets defensive back Antonio Cromartie, who might be without a paycheck if a new labor contract isn’t reached.

    “The money I get from him is definitely important,” Julian said, declining to divulge how much she gets monthly from Cromartie, a free agent who was paid $1.7 million last season. “Something would have to change.”

    Cromartie, who according to the New York Post has nine children from eight women, is among the players who may be without work because of the NFL’s inability to reach a collective bargaining agreement with its union. National Basketball Association players may face a similar situation when their contract expires in two months.

    NFL and NBA players are lining up to get child support and alimony payments lowered to reflect what would be reduced incomes should their leagues shut down, said attorney Howard Rudolph of Rudolph & Associates LLP in West Palm Beach, Florida.

    Rudolph, whose office is decorated with sports memorabilia from his athlete clients, said he’s working on modification requests for NFL players that he wouldn’t identify. It’s the same move Wall Street executives made when they lost jobs or income during the recession, says Raoul Felder, a divorce lawyer whose clients have included former New York Mayor Rudy Giuliani and the ex-wife of basketball player Jason Kidd.

    “The NFL is an industry, and if the industry is in trouble, the men can’t meet their obligations,” Felder, 76, said in a telephone interview. “The only thing to do is file for modification.”

    Athletes, Bankers
    Cromartie’s agent, Jason Chinn, vice president of football operations at Westlake Village, California-based Pro Tect Management, didn’t return voice-mail messages left at his office or an e-mail received by Beth Acker, the company’s executive assistant. Julian said in an e-mail that Cromartie hasn’t mentioned the possibility of not being able to pay the support. Cromartie represented himself in Julian’s paternity case, according to court records. Julian’s attorney, Andy Cook, didn’t return messages left at his office.

    By Felder’s measure, a top-paid athlete is no different than George Zahringer, a former managing director at Bear Stearns Cos. After losing his job, Zahringer urged a judge in 2009 to cancel an order that increased his alimony to $87,000 a month from $25,000, including retroactive payments. Richard Albrecht, an attorney for Zahringer in the case, declined to comment.

    Lockout Picture
    The NFL in March locked out its players, who earn on average about $1.8 million a year. Billy Hunter, the executive director of the union that represents players in the NBA, where the average salary is almost $6 million, has said he expects owners to impose a lockout when their labor contract expires on June 30.

    Hunter’s union distributed a 56-page lockout survival guide to its more than 400 members that includes money- saving tips such as refinancing mortgages and turning off lights at home. Page 21 is devoted to alimony and child support, issues that affect as much as 80 percent of professional athletes, says Frank Brickowski, 51, a former NBA player and divorced father of one who is now a regional director for the National Basketball Players Association.

    Brickowski has urged active players to get prenuptial agreements so that child support and alimony don’t become issues. His campaign has been helped, Brickowski said, by the popularity of Kanye West’s “Gold Digger,” a song about the perils of relationships with women more interested in money than love.

    Kemp’s Kids
    Brickowski once was a teammate of Shawn Kemp, who was the subject of a Sports Illustrated cover story that said he had seven children with multiple women. According to Brickowski, on trips to Los Angeles there would be three women sitting behind the basket with children, all of them Kemp’s.

    Kemp’s agent, Tony Dutt, didn’t return phone calls and e-mails seeking comment. Colin Bryant, Dutt’s partner at Dutt Sports Services Inc., in a telephone interview said the two have recently discussed modification requests “extensively.”

    Kemp in 2005 told the Seattle Times that he never missed a child-support payment.

    Alimony Modification
    The National Center for Health Statistics said it doesn’t calculate a nationwide U.S. divorce rate.

    “I tell the players that in divorce, on average, the woman gets 70 percent of a man’s wealth,” Brickowski said, without giving a basis for the figure. “That gets their attention. But not as much as Kanye.”

    Keith Glass, 58, an agent whose clients have included seven-time NBA champion Robert Horry, said players aren’t the only ones who feel the financial blow of a labor stoppage. Contracts can’t be signed, preventing agents like Glass, who has divorced three times, from collecting commissions.

    Glass said he filed an alimony modification request for himself during the 1998-99 NBA lockout. He said he won a 40 percent reduction, while unable to recall the dollar amounts.

    “There will be filings, all right,” Glass said. “You can bet it’s already being done by agents.”

    First Paychecks
    Big money will be at stake for players like Cromartie. The 27-year-old got a $500,000 advance of his $1.7 million salary from the Jets to settle child-support matters. He has been among the players to criticize the NFL and players association for not reaching an agreement.

    “How abt the owners and the NFLPA get ur behinds back to the table and talk it out there,” he said on Twitter a week after the owners locked out players on March 12.

    None of the more than 15 NFL, NBA and National Hockey League agents contacted would say whether they were helping prepare, or had helped prepare, modification requests for clients.

    Under terms of their labor contracts, NFL players don’t receive their first paycheck for the 2011 season until September and NBA players until November. Rudolph said applications need to be made in advance to ensure that any change coincides with the income cutoff.

    Other Income
    Not all athletes consider modification. Oakland Raiders running back Darren McFadden, who has three children with three women, has enough money to pay his support even in the event of a lockout, said his agent, Ian Greengross. McFadden in 2008 signed a six-year, $60 million contract that included a guaranteed $26 million.

    “Unless they raise his child support to $20,000 a month per kid it won’t be a problem,” Greengross said in a telephone interview.

    Julie Hannaford, a Toronto-based attorney who represented the ex-wife of former NHL player Tie Domi in their divorce, says applying for modification doesn’t mean a reduction will be granted.

    Judges often first require the athlete to shed assets, including real estate, cars or even championship rings, she said. Canadian law says a divorced athlete with two children being paid $9 million a year would pay about $105,000 a month to his former wife, while one in the same situation earning $1 million would pay less than $12,000, she said.

    “Most players are so well managed that they’ve got enough money put away to shelter against lockout day,” Hannaford said.

    Health Insurance
    There’s more for a judge to consider than just no paychecks, says Peter Kuperstein, 41, a divorce lawyer and partner in the Boston-based firm of Prince Lobel, which has represented pro athletes he wouldn’t identify.

    An athlete’s out-of-pocket expenses for things such as health insurance rise during a lockout, since teams aren’t paying, Kuperstein said. According to the trade association representing NFL players, a player’s health insurance coverage can run more than $2,000 a month.

    “The likelihood is that a majority of these players are the ones maintaining health insurance for children and, potentially, their ex-wives,” Kuperstein said.

    While athletes have agents, lawyers and unions looking out for their financial well-being, the ex-wives and mothers might not. Any court-approved modification may have dire consequences for them, Felder said.

    “It falls like a ton of bricks,” he said.

    As for Julian, she’s been saving a portion of her paycheck and tax refund the past few years. There are any numbers of reasons why a child-support payment might not arrive when it’s supposed to, Julian said in a telephone interview.

    “It takes money to raise a kid,” she said.

  • #2
    Re: NFL, NBA Players poised to cut alimony making wives industry dispute victims

    I'm sure they get well more than enough to support their respective children. They don't like it? They can get a job like everyone else.

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