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The Rules of Pacers Digest

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Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Vogel interviewed by Rockets (Update post #91 - Vogel no longer a candidate

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  • #46
    Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

    Just to reiterate what has been said a couple times, Frank Vogel is not the greatest thing since sliced bread. He seems like he could be a very promising coach. But, this guy hasn't even coached a full season!! If some other team offers him a job right away and we don't get him? So be it! We cannot afford to blindly hire a former assistance who coached barely over 40 games, esp. since the prior coach was so terrible, my mother could have coached that team.

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    • #47
      Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

      Originally posted by mattie View Post
      Just to reiterate what has been said a couple times, Frank Vogel is not the greatest thing since sliced bread. He seems like he could be a very promising coach. But, this guy hasn't even coached a full season!! If some other team offers him a job right away and we don't get him? So be it! We cannot afford to blindly hire a former assistance who coached barely over 40 games, esp. since the prior coach was so terrible, my mother could have coached that team.
      All this talk of a full season. You think a guy who had a 20-18 half season record and coached a troubled Indiana team, who were supposed to been blown OUT in 4 games I might add, to scare the #1 team in the league and their fans to death won't deliver? I have more faith than that.

      Statement: I'm still unsure about hiring him, he hasn't even coached a full season!

      Solution: Let him coach one.
      Last edited by Constellations; 05-06-2011, 06:44 AM.
      Follow me at @Bluejbgold

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      • #48
        Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

        Originally posted by pacer4ever View Post
        extending Vogel before the lockout to me is stupid just kind of a waste of money if we are locked out.

        Of all the possibly scenerios what you have outlined is the absolute worst. "Waiting until after the lockout" to do anything that can be done now is a horrible idea. I trust the pacers have zero intentions of waiting until the lockout is over to do anything

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        • #49
          Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

          Originally posted by mellifluous View Post
          Am I the only one who's first thought was "good for Frank"?
          That was my reaction exactly.

          I will say this, I believe Frank will make an excellent representation of himself in an interview. Would not be surprised if he moves up into the top 3 or 4 - and is on the Rockets short list

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          • #50
            Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

            Originally posted by Will Galen View Post
            A lot of you guys should join an old women's knitting bee, you'd be right at home repeating gossip, and saying "Oh my god," on hearing the latest rumor.
            That is Pacers Digest in a nutshell. Well done, sir.
            "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

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            • #51
              Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

              It's kinda spooky that I agree with everything Wil Galen said.



              Ya gotta have your coach and everything in order if there is a lockout because when it ends you'd better be running when you hit the ground. There will not be time to look for a coach when any lockout ends.
              Ever notice how friendly folks are at a shootin' range??.

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              • #52
                Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                For those that are saying Frank is not a coach in the mold of Jim...

                Frank might not have the same personality and approach with the players that Jim had, but he most certainly is a follower of Jim's strategy, and both of them are Rick Patino proteges. Frank has been mentoring under Jim since he was a senior in college. If anyone can be called Jim's protege, Frank can.

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                • #53
                  Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                  Originally posted by Will Galen
                  The way I feel is this, I would like to see Vogel back as coach, but just on a one year contract. I want to see how he handles himself over a full year.
                  I've seen this sentiment a lot... It just isn't very realistic. The most common "short contract" NOT EXTENSION is usually at least 2 years with an option for a 3rd, but commonly it's 3 years with a optional 4th.

                  As Unclebuck said in another thread.... If you are only looking to give him a one year deal, you don't need to hire him in the first place.

                  Nothing says, "We have faith in you and we've got your back" like a one year deal. Some of us already believe he's gonna be "green" about putting out locker room situations. Expecting "any" coach to put out locker room fires on a one year deal would be the equivalent of Barney Fife running around with his one bullet in his shirt pocket!
                  Last edited by Roaming Gnome; 05-06-2011, 08:53 AM.
                  ...Still "flying casual"
                  @roaminggnome74

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                  • #54
                    Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                    If I were Vogel and the Pacers offered me a one year deal I would laugh and say no thanks and I would make sure that leaked to all the media - Pacers organization would be castigated throughout the NBA.

                    I think if the Pacers aren't willing to offer him a 3 year guaranteed deal they obviously don't have much faith in him and they should hire someone else.

                    2 years is borderline slap in the face, if I were Frank I might consider a two year deal if the $$ per year is really good.

                    And I'm not taking into account that next season might be shortened at the very least.

                    3 years is pretty standard. Not sure how many coaches over the past ten years have received a two year deal (to start with) I'm sure there have been a few, but I bet it is less than 7 or 8 over the past decade
                    Last edited by Unclebuck; 05-06-2011, 08:54 AM.

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                    • #55
                      Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                      Originally posted by Roaming Gnome View Post
                      I've seen this sentiment a lot... It just isn't very realistic. The most common "short contract" NOT EXTENSION is usually at least 2 years with an option for a 3rd, but commonly it's 3 years with a optional 4th.

                      As Unclebuck said in another thread.... If you are only looking to give him a one year deal, you don't need to him in the first place.

                      Nothing says, "We have faith in you and we've got your back" like a one year deal.
                      I thought of suggesting a two year contract because we will probably have a long lockout. It really doesn't matter to me though, the people in charge have more, and better information than we do so I'll go along with what they decide. (GRIN, not that I have a choice in the matter.)

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                      • #56
                        Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                        Looking up how long coaches contracts are. A lot of coaches will get a two year extension or a one year extension. But when they are first hired is what I'm looking at.

                        Hawks hired Larry Drew to a two year deal a year ago
                        http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/376541...ts/player_news

                        Also John Kuester signed a two year deal with a team option for a third

                        http://www.aolnews.com/2010/04/25/nba-coach-tracker/
                        Last edited by Unclebuck; 05-06-2011, 09:18 AM.

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                        • #57
                          Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                          Originally posted by Will Galen View Post
                          I thought of suggesting a two year contract because we will probably have a long lockout. It really doesn't matter to me though, the people in charge have more, and better information than we do so I'll go along with what they decide. (GRIN, not that I have a choice in the matter.)
                          I'm sure the FO has a heck of a lot more material to base a decision on than any of us.... (You've already covered that!), and need to just treat this coach as any other coach interviewing for the job. If you have faith that he is deserving of the job AHEAD of the other candidates.... Hire him for a STANDARD term. If the FO doesn't feel that they can't trust him with the STANDARD term.... Hire someone else!


                          No need for half steppin' because that is just a waste of time for all parties involved!
                          ...Still "flying casual"
                          @roaminggnome74

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                          • #58
                            Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                            Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
                            Of all the possibly scenerios what you have outlined is the absolute worst. "Waiting until after the lockout" to do anything that can be done now is a horrible idea. I trust the pacers have zero intentions of waiting until the lockout is over to do anything
                            So if it was your money you would just throw it away and give it to a guy to sit on his *** for a year during the lockout? If I was in charge I might sign Vogel to a one year 50k deal and have incetives in it that say if basketball is played he will get another 450K. I honestly dont think b ball will be played next year it is gonna be super ugly especially if the Heat win.

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                            • #59
                              Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                              Originally posted by Roaming Gnome View Post
                              I've seen this sentiment a lot... It just isn't very realistic. The most common "short contract" NOT EXTENSION is usually at least 2 years with an option for a 3rd, but commonly it's 3 years with a optional 4th.

                              As Unclebuck said in another thread.... If you are only looking to give him a one year deal, you don't need to hire him in the first place.

                              Nothing says, "We have faith in you and we've got your back" like a one year deal. Some of us already believe he's gonna be "green" about putting out locker room situations. Expecting "any" coach to put out locker room fires on a one year deal would be the equivalent of Barney Fife running around with his one bullet in his shirt pocket!
                              You don't have to have a 4-year deal to motivate you. I work in an industry where I'm lucky to get a 6-month deal. You just get used to it. It keeps you motivated. I don't expect people to say hey, we have little history with you ---- here's a nice 4-year lucrative deal to show that "we've got your back." Just doesn't work that way. Any contract like that would be one that I have to earn, and that goes beyond a 4 month-stint of impressive work. I'm also an employer, so I also see things from the *other* side, too... I think this is part of the problem with today's sports is these huge, long unwarranted contracts that frequently seem to bite employer's in the butt. Look how many contracts now the Pacers have been shedding that ended up being too much and has moved them out of position to make moves that would improve their business. It's now status quo to give some unproven guy a 4-year multi-million dollar deal because "that's just how it goes these days".
                              Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 05-06-2011, 09:35 AM.
                              There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

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                              • #60
                                Re: Vogel interviewed by Houston Rockets

                                Originally posted by pacer4ever View Post
                                So if it was your money you would just throw it away and give it to a guy to sit on his *** for a year during the lockout? If I was in charge I might sign Vogel to a one year 50k deal and have incetives in it that say if basketball is played he will get another 450K. I honestly dont think b ball will be played next year it is gonna be super ugly especially if the Heat win.

                                All I know is the lockout is going to be settled at some point. The players will cave long before the season is lost especially since I think the owners will be reasonable.

                                But once the lockout is settled (assuming it will be during when the regular season is supposed to be going on) there will be a mad dash to start playing games, short preseason, no time to digest the new CBA - there will be no time to hire a coach. back in 1999 there were no teams without coaches when the lockout ended.

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