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Thread: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

  1. #1

    Default Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    I'm not here to demean Danny Granger. He's been a great player for us, and clearly our best player over a certain period of years. I just don't think I can stand to see us go to him one more game in a row for that last shot. The definition of insanity is to keep trying something different and expecting a different result.

    In game one, Psycho T was unconscious and playing with a mis-match. And rather than keep going to what was working, we inexplicably changed things around. I'm not saying we ice him forever, but continuing to have him lose at the end is only going to make things more uncomfortable for him and put more pressure on him.

    Anyway, the one coaching suggestion I would make to Vogel is to stick with the hot hand.
    “Seventy percent of me talking on the court is personally for me to get me
    motivated and going. Thirty percent is to see if I can get into the opponent’s head.”
    Reggie Miller

  2. #2
    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by brichard View Post
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    I'm not here to demean Danny Granger.
    Then why start the unphteenth thread complaining about him!

  3. #3

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Come on...if he can get a good look, then why not let him take it? He needs a good look. That's all any player can hope for.

  4. #4

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by brichard View Post
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    The definition of insanity is to keep trying something different and expecting a different result
    in·san·i·ty
    noun /inˈsanitē/ 
    insanities, plural

    The state of being seriously mentally ill; madness
    - he suffered from bouts of insanity
    - he attempted to plead insanity

    Extreme foolishness or irrationality
    - it might be pure insanity to take this loan
    - the insanities of our time

  5. #5
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Danny was clutch Thursday night. Collison messed up not getting him the ball when he flashed to the key wide open on the second to last possession.

    On the last possession, I agree. They all know it's going to Danny (Even Deng, in an interview, said, "We knew Granger wouldn't pass it once he got it.") We need to get more creative with our end of game plays. Danny iso isn't working.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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  7. #6

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    Then why start the unphteenth thread complaining about him!
    Hmmm... did you read my post? We've lost at least 2 games giving it to him in the last seconds of a ball game, and I don't want to watch it again. I'm not saying he sucks or ship him away. It is really a very objective post and more critical of Vogel's play design in the last seconds of a game than anything.
    “Seventy percent of me talking on the court is personally for me to get me
    motivated and going. Thirty percent is to see if I can get into the opponent’s head.”
    Reggie Miller

  8. #7

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by smj887 View Post
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    in·san·i·ty
    noun /inˈsanitē/ 
    insanities, plural

    The state of being seriously mentally ill; madness
    - he suffered from bouts of insanity
    - he attempted to plead insanity

    Extreme foolishness or irrationality
    - it might be pure insanity to take this loan
    - the insanities of our time
    My definition is a famous quote from Albert Einstein.
    “Seventy percent of me talking on the court is personally for me to get me
    motivated and going. Thirty percent is to see if I can get into the opponent’s head.”
    Reggie Miller

  9. #8

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by joeyd View Post
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    Come on...if he can get a good look, then why not let him take it? He needs a good look. That's all any player can hope for.
    Well, and that is part of the problem, he isn't going to get a good look b/c everybody in the building knows he is going to shoot it. And with a very good defensive team, I'm not surprised that he hasn't been successful. There are certain guys who just seem to have ice in their veins when it is on the line (Horry, Billups, Reggie, etc.)

    If you don't have that, you need to go with the hot hand or use a little deception to get somebody open. But I'm telling you, for the sake of Danny Granger and his confidence, having him miss one more shot like that isn't going to be great for him.
    “Seventy percent of me talking on the court is personally for me to get me
    motivated and going. Thirty percent is to see if I can get into the opponent’s head.”
    Reggie Miller

  10. #9

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by brichard View Post
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    Well, and that is part of the problem, he isn't going to get a good look b/c everybody in the building knows he is going to shoot it.
    It was the same on numerous occassions with Reggie, but his teammates learned how to free him up.

  11. #10

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by joeyd View Post
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    It was the same on numerous occassions with Reggie, but his teammates learned how to free him up.
    I don't think you can put Reggie Miller and Danny Granger in the same breath. Did everybody know Jordan or Bird were shooting the last shot? Sure, but they each had an uncanny ability to hit some pretty unbelievable shots with great consistency. Part of that is a numbers game, you shoot enough and you will win some games.

    If Danny shows the ability to be as clutch as Reggie, I got no problem with giving it to him and everybody being aware. But that is a pretty rare group of players you are talking about.
    “Seventy percent of me talking on the court is personally for me to get me
    motivated and going. Thirty percent is to see if I can get into the opponent’s head.”
    Reggie Miller

  12. #11
    Member ilive4sports's Avatar
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Who should be taking this final shot?

    And you say we should stay with the hot hand, well Danny had the hot hand. He was the only guy all game that did. He had a great fourth quarter and kept us in the game.

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  14. #12

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    Who should be taking this final shot?

    And you say we should stay with the hot hand, well Danny had the hot hand. He was the only guy all game that did. He had a great fourth quarter and kept us in the game.
    Well I'm talking about a series of games. Danny gets the ball whether he has the hot hand or not.
    “Seventy percent of me talking on the court is personally for me to get me
    motivated and going. Thirty percent is to see if I can get into the opponent’s head.”
    Reggie Miller

  15. #13
    Member Eleazar's Avatar
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    Who should be taking this final shot?

    And you say we should stay with the hot hand, well Danny had the hot hand. He was the only guy all game that did. He had a great fourth quarter and kept us in the game.
    Price, Dunleavy, George, Rush, hell I would put that line-up in plus Foster for a last second put back and we have a better shot at hitting a game winner or tieing shot than relying on Granger to get off a good shot. Make it so the other team has no idea who is going to shoot the ball.

  16. #14
    crazy shinaniganz BringJackBack's Avatar
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Is that not what Danny did in game 2? He drove and kicked out to Price who, I believe, hit the three in crunch time.

  17. #15
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    On the last possession, I agree. They all know it's going to Danny (Even Deng, in an interview, said, "We knew Granger wouldn't pass it once he got it.") We need to get more creative with our end of game plays. Danny iso isn't working.
    That's the problem. While Danny has played well in this series offensively we need him to give the ball up to get others involved. The team as a whole is not sharing the ball very much. Actually, the best offenses are when the players pass the ball crisply and don't care who gets the open shot. I wish it were that way with the Pacers. Until that happens, we are not going to be that good because we don't have anything close to a mega-star who can get his own shot anytime.

  18. #16

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    I was thinking Jeff Foster should take the last shot.
    In 49 states it's just basketball, but this is Indiana!

  19. #17
    Member presto123's Avatar
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Easy. Mike Dunleavy. The inbounder can get the ball back because of the focus on Granger. And if Mike is open I'm more confident in him shooting than anybody.

  20. #18

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scot Pollard View Post
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    I was thinking Jeff Foster should take the last shot.
    Don't laugh. He actually hasn't been half bad with his jump shot lately; that is, when he doesn't have to shoot after getting the pass with about 1 second left.

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  22. #19

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by joeyd View Post
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    Don't laugh. He actually hasn't been half bad with his jump shot lately; that is, when he doesn't have to shoot after getting the pass with about 1 second left.
    I loved that swish from last night.

    I love his shooting form. It's like "ah **** it I can't seem to find anyone open so I'll take it"
    In 49 states it's just basketball, but this is Indiana!

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  24. #20
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    I don't really remember Reggie getting the ball and then dribbling or holding the ball looking for a shot. We ran Reggie off of picks and always seemed to get him the ball coming off a screen.

    Yes, the other team knew Reggie was going to get the ball but they had to chase him while his teammates set solid screens and while Reggie used them expertly.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  26. #21
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scot Pollard View Post
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    I was thinking Jeff Foster should take the last shot.
    This is it.

    Foster is shooting 67% from the floor during the series. He can do that because he's always wide open. This is precisely why you want to move the ball around. It doesn't make sense to have Foster shoot the ball until you look at the big picture. The game changes when you share the ball more...and is why teams like the Pistons were so good.

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  28. #22

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Hey Bball and BlueNGold can you be in the mood for something else?

    I remember Bball saying an admin had to do it.

    Hicks removed that mood.
    In 49 states it's just basketball, but this is Indiana!

  29. #23

    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    More like, please have a play that works well enough for Granger to get open.

  30. #24
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    I don't really remember Reggie getting the ball and then dribbling or holding the ball looking for a shot. We ran Reggie off of picks and always seemed to get him the ball coming off a screen.

    Yes, the other team knew Reggie was going to get the ball but they had to chase him while his teammates set solid screens and while Reggie used them expertly.
    Yep, very different situation. Reggie had a rare talent with his ability to sprint and immediately put up a 30 foot shot. There was a strategy albeit a simple one. It did require a crisp pass and picks. It was not the same as an iso or one-on-one game...which is usually not effective.

  31. #25
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    Default Re: Please have somebody other than Granger shoot the last shot.

    Quote Originally Posted by Scot Pollard View Post
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    Hey Bball and BlueNGold can you be in the mood for something else?

    I remember Bball saying an admin had to do it.

    Hicks removed that mood.
    I've asked an admin once or twice to do it. I think they want me to keep it. That's fine. It's probably still my mood....

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