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Thread: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    Yes, Golden State is still happy they stole Alford from the Pacers.
    Thats a real bad example, Alford's game just isn't suited for the pro's, last time I checked Alford wasn't 6-8.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

  2. #27
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    I miss Sarunas.

  3. #28
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    It is true that only buying a ticket to 1 game is a lot easier than a full season, but I'd imagine that some of the people who bought a ticket to see him would consider it.

    The posted attendance of that game was 16,205. The average attendance on the season has been 13,458.

    From being there, I'd say it was in the top 5 biggest crowds of the season. Unlike the average, which is probably actually much lower, I'd say that single game was pretty close to the actual number of seats filled. Keep in mind, that was a Jazz team that had just traded its best player, so it wasn't like that would be a hot ticket normally.

    Many, many of those people who showed up that night were there to see Hayward. Did you go to that game by any chance?
    I did, infact that game was the main reason I picked the ticket package we got. I chose to suffer through Washing Wizards and Sacramento Kings so I could watch Gordon Hayward play.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

  4. #29
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    I look forward to having this discussion, again, when Matt Howard is picked one pick before the Pacers in the 2nd round this year.

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  6. #30
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    It is true that only buying a ticket to 1 game is a lot easier than a full season, but I'd imagine that some of the people who bought a ticket to see him would consider it.

    The posted attendance of that game was 16,205. The average attendance on the season has been 13,458.

    From being there, I'd say it was in the top 5 biggest crowds of the season. Unlike the average, which is probably actually much lower, I'd say that single game was pretty close to the actual number of seats filled. Keep in mind, that was a Jazz team that had just traded its best player, so it wasn't like that would be a hot ticket normally.

    I would have been more impressed if that many people showed on January 31st - night 1 of the ice storm.

    Many, many of those people who showed up that night were there to see Hayward. Did you go to that game by any chance?

    I stand corrected.

    I went back and looked at attendance for every home Friday night game. The only 3 Friday night games that got a higher number were the two Bulls games the the OKC game the day after Thanksgiving.

    Although I do wonder if that was a Marsh Family night which draw pretty well, plus the end of February is going to draw well as it is before the college and HS turnaments and the weather is not as cold.

    In early January the pacers played the Rockets at home and got 14440 for a Friday night game. That is pretty much the average for Friday night games for the season. So OK I'll go so far as to say 1800-2000 people came to the Utah game just because of Hayward.

    Although I would have been really impressed if that many people showed up On January 31st - the first night of the ice storm.
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 04-06-2011 at 10:59 AM.

  7. #31

    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    [QUOTE=bhaas0532;1208148]

    because Gordon is emerging as a player. scoring 22 against the defending champs as a rookie is impressive. /QUOTE]


    BRush looked good the last 15 games or so of his 1st 2 seasons, so I wouldn't put much stock in a few good games at seasons end unless you think Hayward's end quality is that of Rush.

  8. #32

    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    I look forward to having this discussion, again, when Matt Howard is picked one pick before the Pacers in the 2nd round this year.

    KUDOS!

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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    Yeah the guy was impressive last night, he looked good as the point forward and Utah was playing a weird line up with Millsap at the 3 Favors at the 4 and Al at the 5. Like somebody else already said, is just one game and even Adam Morrison had his nights, I wouldn't trade PG for him unless Utah is willing to pay top value, Hayward has the potential to be a bust or Mike Dunleavy(he plays the same way) when PG's ceiling at least I think is way higher.
    http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/...VpzUp7MQ2kvLYF

    it isn't just "one game" in which Gordon has done well. If you check his game log, when he gets minutes he tends to produce. he actually has fantasy value right now.

  10. #34
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    My only question marks about Hayward were his outside shooting and his lateral quickness. His outside shot has been improving and he is a better athlete than I thought he was. I am happy he is doing well and agree that Paul George is overvalued by certain members on this board.

    Hayward was drafted 9th overall and the Pacers had the 10th pick. It would be great to see Gordon Hayward and Matt Howard going head 2 head in the Rookie/Soph game next season. But Good Things are worth wating for.

  11. #35
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    I think people overestimate the power of a local player to drive huge increases in attendance.

    At an extreme you are probably talking an increase due to that player of 500 per game. While not a spit in the bucket, that won't single-handedly save the franchise.

    And suppose the local player turns out to be a bust? You wasted the pick AND you can't play him so the attendance doesn't show up. Or, do you give starter's minutes to a crappy player just because he's local?
    BillS

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  13. #36
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Still think Paul George will be better in the long run, but Hayward will be a solid pro. However, I am very fond of Utah's big men. Favors, Millsap and Jefferson is very impressive. If we could nab one of them that would be awesome
    Murph

  14. #37

    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    This happens when the Pacers are less than contenders. People start calling for local guys. Back when Larry Brown's team was in decline before Bird took over, I remember reading letters in the Star saying we should have drafted Calbert Chaney and Greg Graham.

    People who demand local guys annoy me. It betrays a very narrow view of basketball and suggests Indiana fans will only root for a certain type of player.

    Again, I like Hayward, he's from my hometown of Brownsburg. But I don't buy him as better than George right now, forget down the road.
    Last edited by Ransom; 04-06-2011 at 11:33 AM.

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  16. #38
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
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    This happens when the Pacers are less than contenders. People start calling for local guys. Back when Larry Brown's team was in decline before Bird took over, I remember reading letters in the Star saying we should have drafted Calbert Chaney and Greg Graham.

    People who demand local guys annoy me. It betrays a very narrow view of basketball and suggests Indiana fans will only root for a certain type of player.

    Again, I like Hayward, he's from my hometown of Brownsburg. But I don't buy him as better than George right now, forget down the road.
    Any draft pick regardless of who it is or where he is from could be a wasted pick. I agree with you in saying that they shouldn't be going after a local player who just isn't that much of a talent. But Gordon Hayward has talent.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Keep in mind Utah is playing for nothing so the pressure on Hayward is most likely minimal. On the other hand, the Pacers are fighting for their playoff lives so the pressure on George is most likely just the opposite.

  18. #40
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    theres a real goofy picture of him on the front page of NBA .com right now...


    its like "hey mom, i had this dream last night that I was in the NBA and dunked on the lakers, and kobe and d-fish and andrew bynum couldnt stop me and were just watching me in awe!"

  19. #41
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    Any draft pick regardless of who it is or where he is from could be a wasted pick. I agree with you in saying that they shouldn't be going after a local player who just isn't that much of a talent. But I have... err I mean Gordon Hayward has talent.
    Fixed

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  21. #42
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    ^aha! we should check if graphic-er posts during Jazz games!!!

    (just bustin your balls)

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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?





    (Side note: is it just me, or does the 50 Cent GIF look different? IDK, it looks faster/more fluid/higher quality. Or maybe I'm just losing it?)
    Last edited by Day-V; 04-06-2011 at 12:44 PM.

  23. #44
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    I hate that I can't just enjoy Indiana boys having success. That I have to admit some deep seeded doubt that I've been proven wrong on. Can't I wonder if a guy is good enough, but then also root for him to be really good?

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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    I hate that I can't just enjoy Indiana boys having success. That I have to admit some deep seeded doubt that I've been proven wrong on. Can't I wonder if a guy is good enough, but then also root for him to be really good?
    its okay to admit if you might have been wrong about something. i have said some really stupid things about Tyler Hansbrough and Brandon Rush in the past. i thought Tyler was a bird blunder, but now he is my favorite on the team. i thought Rush was another bust, but i now see that he is a solid rotational player. No point in being stubborn if you had an opinion on a certain player that has changed.

  25. #46
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
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    This happens when the Pacers are less than contenders. People start calling for local guys. Back when Larry Brown's team was in decline before Bird took over, I remember reading letters in the Star saying we should have drafted Calbert Chaney and Greg Graham.

    People who demand local guys annoy me. It betrays a very narrow view of basketball and suggests Indiana fans will only root for a certain type of player.

    Again, I like Hayward, he's from my hometown of Brownsburg. But I don't buy him as better than George right now, forget down the road.

    You should have seen it in the 80's and early 90's. It was soooo much worse

  26. #47

    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    How much has hometown McBob done with selling of tickets? I'm sure he has hometown fans that come to games to see him play, but does it really impact the amount of tickets sold? My guess you could have a roster full of hometown or Indiana players, and it wouldn't impact ticket sales that much. Winning plays more importance in selling tickets than Hayward and McBob would.

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  28. #48
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Josh didn't go to college in Indiana, and that has a huge impact on whether or not people follow them.

    I'm not saying that Gordon would bring a lot of people in, I think it would be a small bump, but there is a huge difference between Josh and Gordon.

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  30. #49
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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    no, I still prefer Paul George

    edit: its not like it really matters anyways. we didn't have a shot at haywood as he was drafted before our pick.
    Last edited by BornReady; 04-06-2011 at 01:28 PM. Reason: more things to say!

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    Default Re: Still doubting Gordon Hayward?

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    debate settled.

    Honestly Hayward has proven to be a very good pick at 9th. Sure he has his moments where he looks really bad just like all rookies. Right now I think he is head and shoulders above George. He defended Kobe really well to close out the game last night. Kobe lost the ball there at the end, but Gordon got in good position to pressure the ball, force an off balanced attempt for Kobe, that's about all you can do. That's a player using his length right there.
    graphic-er, I respect your opinion ( even if it is clearly biased ) and agree that Hayward can be a solid NBA Player in the future.....while I myself don't see the "all-star" potential of PG that most here see ( many of which are biased themselves when it comes to PG ).....I fail to see how you can come to the conclusion that Hayward is "heads and shoulders" above George right now.

    What has Hayward done that has put him "heads and shoulders" over PG?

    IMHO...there is not enough data to say that one Player is "heads and shoulders" above the other right now. In the best case scenario....I can possibly see that the both of them are on equal footing....but neither is "so much better than the other" that one can suggest what you are suggesting.

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    As for George I can only hope he gets it together, has clearly hit the rookie wall, cause he looks terrible on Defense, slow to react, looks terrible trying to get his own shot on offense, and seemingly is only interested in bombing wide open 3pters instead of pump faking it to get open for an easy mid range shot. He also takes the most unorthodox layup attempts when he gets in the paint to try and finish.
    I agree that PG has likely hit the rookie wall.....but if you look at the number of minutes that PG has played since January compared to Hayward since the start of February ( roughly the same time that JO'B and Sloan left the Team ). Although both Players have played roughly the same amount of Total minutes throughout the season ( Hayward with 1073 total minutes and PG with 1178 total minutes ), PG has logged more minutes since the beginning of February ( 774 minutes ) then Hayward has ( 595 minutes ). Frankly, I can see why PG hit the Rookie Wall at this point in the season.
    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    As for Indiana not having the opportunity to draft Hayward, they could of pulled off a trade to move up a couple of spots to get him if they really wanted him. I think those picks were up for trade if someone was willing to bite. I kept thinking that we could have swapped picks with LAC.
    Sorry, but despite seeing an uptick in minutes since Sloan left and the Jazz have been bounced from the Playoffs....I simply don't see anything that Hayward has done to warrant paying whatever price it would have cost the Pacers to pay to jump a few spots to make a run for Hayward over PG. I'm not saying that PG is better then Hayward...I'm saying that the cost to jump a few spots to get Hayward isn't worth it IMHO. We're not talking about the difference between drafting someone like Greg Monroe over someone like PG or Hayward to jump a few spots....we're talking about the difference between 2 rookie Players that haven't truly distinguised themselves from the rest of the rookies drafted below them.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

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