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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

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  • #16
    Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

    i don't think it is time to change lineups.

    the starting lineup is not the best lineup right now, i get that. and agree. but the starting lineup is the kids. the guys the pacers will be using going forward with whatever additions get done this summer. these guys need to learn to play together nicely. learn where each other is on the court. learn how to maximize their collective strengths etc. that process is starting now.

    plus the front office needs to see if there are guys that cannot work together. if so, then trades need to be made. i do not think that the case myself. i think these guys can learn to work together. but they still need some time to figure it out. maybe that time is now and maybe next season. but the starters are the core guys going forward and need to get their collective together.

    on the subject of lineups, i like the group that played the passing game late in the NOH game. the old guys + AJ. thought it worked well together. would like to see more of it. and the collison + foster + 3 shooters lineup. like to see more of it also.

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    • #17
      Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

      I really think that this is a case of knee-jerk/overreacting. We have, I think, 5 games to go in the season and the eighth spot has our name on it. We currently have a team with Danny, Roy, Collison, and 12 other guys that can be moved, switched around, or whatever and it won't make a difference in the win/loss column.

      The only thing that I don't want to see are the vets (Besides Jeff or Mike because they are productive) dominating the playing time. George, Josh, Tyler, DC, AJ, Roy, and even Lance are getting that time and a couple of months ago a lot of those guys weren't.

      Ultimately, DC/Mike/Granger/Josh/Hibbert won't win us or lose us any more games than DC/George/Granger/Tyler/Hibbert will.

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      • #18
        Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

        If the original lineup of DC/Dunleavy/Granger/McBob/Hibbert truly is the best offensive lineup that we have....then I'm okay with seeing the return of the Goon Squad.

        I recall several times where the Goon Squad was able to clamp down defensively against the other Team while either regaining a lead and/or even extending a lead significantly.
        Last edited by CableKC; 04-05-2011, 07:33 PM.
        Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

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        • #19
          Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

          Charlotte gonna lose this game

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          • #20
            Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

            Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
            Can Dunleavy guard the Bulls starting shooting guard? Who is their starting shooting guard? I guess it is Bogans. Mike can start against him, so I would move Mike into the starting lineup now assuming he is OK physically.
            I think the SG rotation for the Bulls is made up of some combination of Kieth Bogans, Kyle Korver, CJ Watson and Ronnie Brewer ).

            CJ Watson and Keith Bogans are the type of SGs that can easily put up a lot of points in a short amount of time. If Dunleavy is struggling against either of them....then bring in BRush.

            Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
            Is Josh or Tyler a better defender against Boozer - or really who can better defend Boozer in the pick and rolls because that is where Boozer gets the majority of his offense.
            That is the concern....which is the best Pick and Roll Defender that we have?

            Although it's near impossible to defend against DRose, I'm as concerned about how to properly defend the frontcourt of Boozer and Taj Gibson.
            Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

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            • #21
              Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

              Originally posted by BringJackBack View Post
              I really think that this is a case of knee-jerk/overreacting.
              It really isn't. The knee-jerk overreaction was the last time we changed the lineup. This discussion is just a correction of that mistake.

              I'm not going to discuss the shooting guard position, because Dunleavy's injury forced that change. He probably never would have lost his spot. I will discuss the power forward position however.

              I think it is fair to say that if the play of Roy Hibbert isn't the most important factor relative to the team's success, it is certainly very close to the top of the list.

              Roy plays better when he's paired with Josh in the front court, than he does with Tyler. He did under O'Brien, and he has under Vogel.

              Under O'Brien:

              With Josh starting, the Pacers were 14-18 (.438)
              With Josh and Roy starting, the Pacers were 14-17 (.451)

              During those games with both Josh and Roy in the lineup, and O'Brien as coach, Roy averaged:

              13.7 points per game
              7.6 rebounds per game
              2.4 assists per game
              1.6 blocks per game

              With Tyler starting, the Pacers were 2-8 (.200)
              With Tyler and Roy starting, the Pacers were 2-7 (.222)

              During those games with both Tyler and Roy in the lineup, and O'Brien as coach, Roy averaged:

              6.8 points per game
              6.5 rebounds per game
              1.1 assists per game
              1.1 blocks per game

              Under Vogel:

              With Josh starting, the Pacers were 10-9 (.526)

              During those games with both Josh and Roy in the lineup, and Vogel as coach, Roy averaged:

              14.9 points per game
              7.7 rebounds per game
              1.8 assists per game
              1.9 blocks per game

              With Tyler starting, the Pacers are 8-7 (.533)

              During those games with both Tyler and Roy in the lineup, and Vogel as coach, Roy averaged:

              11.4 points per game
              6.7 rebounds per game
              1.7 assists per game
              1.9 blocks per game

              There are several other factors that contribute to these numbers, both from Roy and in the win-loss ratio. I'm not saying that Josh is better than Tyler, but I will say that it makes the team better to have Josh playing with Roy, because it makes Roy better.

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              • #22
                Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

                Again, like I said in another thread, you can switch SG's and PF's all you want but as long as your "small 3" (Danny,DC and Roy) keep taking games off nothing is going to change.
                @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

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                • #23
                  Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

                  I am not against lineup change since we are yet to see what really is the most effective starting lineup.

                  But I would suggest, as an immediate/trial solution, is to remove the offensive anchor to Hibbert at the starting lineup. When he's making shots, we're hard to stop. But when he's missing a lot, which happens most of the time, we're losing so bad. We have set the offense around Danny, or to move it to Tyler, or run cuts and screens for George. Let Hibbert and Collison facilitate. You see Hibbert become more effective wqhen Tyler attracts double teams. Collison's PnP is also effective around Tyler. And George can be effective when he's moving around rather that being passive around the corner.

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                  • #24
                    Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

                    Originally posted by vnzla81 View Post
                    Again, like I said in another thread, you can switch SG's and PF's all you want but as long as your "small 3" (Danny,DC and Roy) keep taking games off nothing is going to change.
                    This it ultimately what matters. I've come around again to preferring Josh be with the starters, but I still don't believe that would make a whole lot of difference right now.

                    We'll still feed the post, where Roy will or won't struggle in the low block, Danny's still going to play his offense the same way, and so will DC. What would likely change most with Josh in there is that those three might get an extra clean look on occasion, which is fine and good, but it still comes down to those three hitting their shots. Until Roy and DC become more consistent, we're still going to be rocky.

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                    • #25
                      Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

                      Originally posted by Hicks View Post
                      Until Roy and DC become more consistent, we're still going to be rocky.
                      What about Granger? He isn't exactly a model of consistency.

                      His efficiency has also taken a turn for the worse since Tyler's inclusion in the starting lineup.

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                      • #26
                        Re: readjusting lineups (should we bring back the goon squad?)

                        Originally posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
                        This thought had crossed my mind. Someone can look up the numbers, but I thought someone had pointed out the Collison/Dun/Granger/Mcbob/Hibbert lineup had been our most successful this year.

                        Mcroberts has great chemistry with both Dunleavy and Hibbert, so it makes some sense. I would still play Tyler big minutes and possibly finish games (depending on who has it going)
                        According to the website, 82games.com, you are correct! Collison, Dunleavy, Granger, McRoberts and Hibbert has been our best starting lineup with a record of 21-10 (67.7%). Our best reserve squad that doesn't include any of the starters listed above has been Price, Danhtey, Paul George, Hansborough and Foster scoring at .467, +3 in turnovers and +22 FTA and 63% rebounding, 12.5% higher than our best starting unit!

                        Despite these statistics, I wouldn't change the starting lineup again just yet. Since the adjustments Vogel has made has proven to be somewhat effective and especially since Dunleavy recently returned from his thumb injury, I'd say it's too much of a risk making any lineup changes right now short of another injury. All Vogel has to do is shorten his rotation times as has been suggested and they should be fine. Once the regular season ends, I'd go back to what had been working w/Dunleavy and Jmac starting and Hans and PG coming off the bench. I'd also get Dahntey's minutes back up. Since Vogel took over as head coach, Dahntey's game has really impressed me.

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