Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 51 to 73 of 73

Thread: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

  1. #51
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    By the way, how many teams were in the NBA the year they made the playoffs a 16-team competition?

    What would the equivalent (or closest to) number of playoff teams be today now that there are 30 franchises?

  2. #52
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,603

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    STRONGLY disagree.

    We're teetering dangerously on the precipice of a league of half a dozen "super teams" while the other 24 franchises flounder in perpetual mediocrity, some to the point of contraction.

    The new CBA will be CRITICAL for owners and small markets. The inmates are currently running the asylum.
    But here is the question - would a league of half a dozen super teams be better for the NBA as a whole?

    For all that we hate the outcome, there's no question that the Miami Heat Basketball Association has more viewers and more league-wide profits than it has in many years. Putting Miami on national TV for every game has been hugely successful.

    Just because we would be one of the teams that would be losing money and mired in perpetual mediocrity doesn't mean our experience is the experience at the league level.

    Bottom line is that WWE style entertainment seems to make more money for the NBA than a competitive sports league. I fear that we'll see the NBA turn into that in the next decade.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  3. #53
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,755

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    By the way, how many teams were in the NBA the year they made the playoffs a 16-team competition?

    What would the equivalent (or closest to) number of playoff teams be today now that there are 30 franchises?


    1984 was the first year of the 16 game format. There were 23 teams in the league, so only 7 of them missed the playoffs, i.e. 70% of the league made it. That would be equivalent to 21 teams making it today (or 20 or 22 if you want an even number).

  4. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Sollozzo For This Useful Post:


  5. #54
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adam1987 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    1984 was the first year of the 16 game format. There were 23 teams in the league, so only 7 of them missed the playoffs, i.e. 70% of the league made it. That would be equivalent to 21 teams making it today (or 20 or 22 if you want an even number).
    I think they should adjust and go with either 20 or 22 teams.

    Self-described 'purists' would object, but I think it could help the league. Gives 4-6 more fanbases more of a reason to give a **** when things aren't going so well. At least those teams have a puncher's chance at making some noise. It's the NBA. Even the worst team can beat the best team occasionally. I'm not saying it'll become like the NCAA tournament, but it would be more interesting than the way things are now. Less lottery teams are a good thing IMO.

    A side-effect for the current NBA is some of those West teams would stop getting screwed by the current formatting.

  6. #55
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    20,120

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think they should adjust and go with either 20 or 22 teams.

    Self-described 'purists' would object, but I think it could help the league. Gives 4-6 more fanbases more of a reason to give a **** when things aren't going so well. At least those teams have a puncher's chance at making some noise. It's the NBA. Even the worst team can beat the best team occasionally. I'm not saying it'll become like the NCAA tournament, but it would be more interesting than the way things are now. Less lottery teams are a good thing IMO.

    A side-effect for the current NBA is some of those West teams would stop getting screwed by the current formatting.
    On first thought at least I like the idea of more playoff teams... with this caveat- Add a round of playoffs. Give the top teams a bye. Then let the bottom teams that made the playoffs play a best of 3 or best of 5 series. If you add one round then you could add 4 teams. Then the 2 winners advance to play the #1 seeds in the next round.

    That way fans have some hope of their low seeded team actually advancing a bit.

    I like the idea of giving teams a little more hope... And I wonder if a shot at the playoffs would help both fans and players stay energized longer if they aren't out of the equation too soon. And this might actually make a difference in the tank or playoffs debate. Even change how some teams attack rebuilding.

    I haven't put a whole lot of thought into this but the idea intrigues me considering some of the alternatives.

    Ideally I'd like to see the regular season shortened. If expanded playoffs could also do that... sign me up!
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Bball For This Useful Post:


  8. #56
    Release Psycho T pwee31's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    7,170

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    You know I would hate to not be able to watch the NBA, but I think a lockout would be a good reality check for the owners and players.

    They need each other, but the players are starting to forget it's a privilege to be in the NBA and making millions of dollars for a living, not a right. While the owners need to realize these players are making them millions of dollars as well.

    I think a lockout would allow both parties to see what they're missing

  9. #57
    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Age
    36
    Posts
    44,287

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    But here is the question - would a league of half a dozen super teams be better for the NBA as a whole?

    For all that we hate the outcome, there's no question that the Miami Heat Basketball Association has more viewers and more league-wide profits than it has in many years. Putting Miami on national TV for every game has been hugely successful.

    Just because we would be one of the teams that would be losing money and mired in perpetual mediocrity doesn't mean our experience is the experience at the league level.

    Bottom line is that WWE style entertainment seems to make more money for the NBA than a competitive sports league. I fear that we'll see the NBA turn into that in the next decade.
    I think you're underestimating the influence of fans who have local NBA teams. As those teams begin to lose money and eventually fold, the league as a whole will be hurt badly, as most fans will just walk away rather than adopt a new team. Short-term gain, long-term loss.

  10. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Shade For This Useful Post:


  11. #58

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    It surprises me that nba fans are willing to put up with the same teams year in and out in the finals--Boston and LA for the most part with San Antonio as an outlier. Also amazing why fans knowing their teams won't win are still fans. Not so in the NFL nearly as much where the superbowl champs often crash and burn the following years.

  12. #59

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by pwee31 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    You know I would hate to not be able to watch the NBA, but I think a lockout would be a good reality check for the owners and players.

    They need each other, but the players are starting to forget it's a privilege to be in the NBA and making millions of dollars for a living, not a right. While the owners need to realize these players are making them millions of dollars as well.

    I think a lockout would allow both parties to see what they're missing
    I think a simultaneous lockout in the nba and nfl will be required to change things.

  13. #60
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,603

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think you're underestimating the influence of fans who have local NBA teams. As those teams begin to lose money and eventually fold, the league as a whole will be hurt badly, as most fans will just walk away rather than adopt a new team. Short-term gain, long-term loss.
    I would hope they would see it that way. However, I think the league already thinks that the vast majority (as in 80%-90%) of people who watch the NBA (notice I avoid the word "fan") are doing so to watch the so-called "best player(s)" and don't care about a team.

    That would mean that, in their eyes, the most they would lose would be the 10%-20% who only watch out of loyalty to a team, and if they can gain more by having superstar teams that are on TV every single night and getting sellouts when they tour to a city, they'll do it.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  14. #61
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,755

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think they should adjust and go with either 20 or 22 teams.

    Self-described 'purists' would object, but I think it could help the league. Gives 4-6 more fanbases more of a reason to give a **** when things aren't going so well. At least those teams have a puncher's chance at making some noise. It's the NBA. Even the worst team can beat the best team occasionally. I'm not saying it'll become like the NCAA tournament, but it would be more interesting than the way things are now. Less lottery teams are a good thing IMO.

    A side-effect for the current NBA is some of those West teams would stop getting screwed by the current formatting.


    I would gladly be in-favor of an extended playoffs along with chipping away at the 82 game regular season. More playoff games + less regular season games would be a good thing I think.

  15. The Following User Says Thank You to Sollozzo For This Useful Post:


  16. #62
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,767

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Adam1987 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    It's not just Indianapolis. It's Detroit (they fill to the same capacity as us). It's Philly. It's Sacramento, Memphis, Atlanta, Minnesota, Washington, etc etc etc.

    The NBA is in great shape if you're looking at the Lakers, Celtics, Bulls, Knicks, Heat, Mavericks etc. Unfortunately, there are 30 teams in the league, many of whom are struggling. The NBA is a very top-heavy league. Yes, the NBA has a good mix of old and young stars who are very popular right now along with some very exciting elite teams, and yes, things are gravy if you're one of the fortunate ones. But there are too many teams in the NBA and way too many cellar dwellers who have no fan interest in the places they play in.
    It has always been that way

  17. #63
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,767

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    TV ratings for the NBA are the best they have been since Michael Jordan and in some cases they are better than they have ever been.

    I link this because this IMO shows that it just isn't the Heat on TV all the time, or the Lakers. This shows the general overall interest in the NBA right now is as high as it has ever been.

    http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/201...-for-tnt/83283


    In preliminary numbers, NBA All-Star Saturday Night on TNT scored record numbers in preliminary Nielsen data, averaging 8.1 million viewers. That’s the best showing in for TNT in 26 years of covering The Event, easily topping topping the previous record in 2009 by 23% and up 49% versus last year’s coverage that went up against the Olympics. It also topped the October 26 season opener between the Miami Heat and Boston Celtics that scored 7.43 million viewers for TNT.

    With adults 18-49 The Event scored a 3.7 rating (4.85 million adults 18-49), easily the highest-rated program in the adult demo on Saturday night.



    http://www.sportsmediawatch.net/2011...star.html#more

    Boosted By Griffin, NBA All-Star Saturday Night Soars on TNT


    NBA All-Star Saturday night earned cable's largest NBA audience, excluding playoffs, in seven years.

    TNT earned a 4.4 U.S. rating and 8.090 million viewers for NBA All-Star Saturday night, according to Nielsen fast-nationals, the largest audience in the 26-year history of the event.

    Saturday's telecast was up 42% in ratings and 49% in viewership from last year (3.1, 5.441M), and up 13% and 23%, respectively, from the previous record set in 2009 (3.9, 6.554M).

    Viewership peaked from 10:30-11 PM ET, as 10.4 million viewers tuned into the NBA Slam-Dunk Contest. Clippers F Blake Griffin won the dunk contest, after a crowd (and advertiser) pleasing dunk over the official car of the NBA.

    This marks the fourth time in five years that NBA All-Star Saturday Night has attracted a record audience. The lone exception was last year, when the event aired opposite NBC's coverage of the Winter Olympics.

    For some perspective, All-Star Saturday Night outdrew the 2009 MLB Home Run Derby on ESPN (4.0, 6.418M) and the 2010 NHL SuperSkills Competition on Versus (0.7, 1.183M).

    NBA All-Star Saturday night drew the largest audience for any non-playoff NBA telecast on cable since the 2004 NBA All-Star Game (8.190M). In other words, Saturday's festivities drew more viewers than each of the last six actual NBA All-Star Games.



    http://www.sportsmediawatch.net/2011...p-35.html#more

    NBA All-Star Game Overnight Up 35%

    Overnight ratings for the 2011 NBA All-Star Game increased by over a third.

    TNT earned a 6.2 overnight rating for Sunday's All-Star Game, up 35% from last year.

    The 6.2 is the highest of the season for an NBA game on cable, topping Heat/Celtics on Opening Night.
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 02-21-2011 at 12:59 PM.

  18. #64
    Member Since86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Muncie
    Posts
    21,090

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    And yet the league continues to lose money, as a whole. I don't know what else to say.

    When you're getting your best ratings, and most of your teams are losing money, you got a problem.

  19. The Following User Says Thank You to Since86 For This Useful Post:


  20. #65
    Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2006
    Age
    29
    Posts
    5,941

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    It has always been that way
    Just because you have always done something does not mean it is right......

  21. #66
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,767

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    And yet the league continues to lose money, as a whole. I don't know what else to say.

    When you're getting your best ratings, and most of your teams are losing money, you got a problem.
    The economy is a factor here. Most teams have lowered and or discounted their ticket prices.

    Also even if TV ratings went up for 1000% that doesn't mean the TV contracts the NBA has with TNT, ESPN/ABS changes - so NBA teams don't see any increase in national TV money until they sign the next contract.

  22. #67
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,767

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by vapacersfan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Just because you have always done something does not mean it is right......
    My point was that is just the nature of the NBA - 1 great player can make a huge difference and typically as long as that one great player is on a certain team that team will continue to be near the top of the NBA. No doubt the NBA is the most difficult sport to move up or move down - teams get locked in - unless you lose or acquire a Lebron James type player

  23. #68
    Member Since86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Muncie
    Posts
    21,090

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The economy is a factor here. Most teams have lowered and or discounted their ticket prices.
    Which also explains how Vancover folded so quickly? Or why Seattle lost a team. Or why Charlotte lost a team. Etc.

    That's way too easy of an answer. The problem has been there for years and years, prior to the economy tanking.

    I'm not saying it's not part of the problem, but let's not act like the Pacers were turning a profit before the economy went south.

    EDIT: Also, the NFL is making money left and right in this economy.
    Last edited by Since86; 02-21-2011 at 03:54 PM.

  24. #69
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,767

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Which also explains how Vancover folded so quickly? Or why Seattle lost a team. Or why Charlotte lost a team. Etc.

    That's way too easy of an answer. The problem has been there for years and years, prior to the economy tanking.

    I'm not saying it's not part of the problem, but let's not act like the Pacers were turning a profit before the economy went south.

    EDIT: Also, the NFL is making money left and right in this economy.
    You changed the discussion. I thouight we were talking about why teams were losing money right now even if the TV ratings are very high.

  25. #70
    The Dude Abides MrSparko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Fort Wayne, Indiana
    Age
    24
    Posts
    1,371

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    It's not fair to compare any other sport league to the behemoth that is the NFL in America.
    Report: 82% Of Wiseguys Think They're Real Funny

  26. The Following User Says Thank You to MrSparko For This Useful Post:


  27. #71
    Member Since86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Muncie
    Posts
    21,090

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    You changed the discussion. I thouight we were talking about why teams were losing money right now even if the TV ratings are very high.
    I'm talking about why teams are losing money, period.

    They've been losing money before the economy. That's my point. The economy has just taken a bad situation and turned it worse.

  28. #72
    Member Since86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Muncie
    Posts
    21,090

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by MrSparko View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    It's not fair to compare any other sport league to the behemoth that is the NFL in America.
    Shouldn't related fields, like sport associations, try and follow the NFL gameplan?

    When one sport is going through the roof with their system, while you're league is wading through red ink, why wouldn't you try to become more like them?

    This isn't the second grade where "copycats" are frowned upon.

    I'm not saying that the NBA should just adopt the NFL system, clearly it has it's own problems, but some of it should be part of the NBA system.

    Like franchise tags, or a hard salary cap. Other solutions are out there, and have been proven to work. The foolish thing to do is ignore them.

  29. #73
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,755

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: NBA Owners, Union: unified they aren't.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    It has always been that way


    Yes and no. There have always been cellar dwellers, but the excess in expansion means there are far more now than there were 25 years ago.

    Expanding to Toronto and Vancouver. Dumb dumb dumb. Giving Charlotte a franchise a mere two years after the Hornets left? Completely unnecessary.

Similar Threads

  1. Granger looks on as Indiana tries to keep pace with big markets
    By indianapolismarkus in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 81
    Last Post: 01-06-2011, 10:05 AM
  2. Looking for team owners for ABA Keeper league
    By Skaut_Ech in forum Sports.ws Fantasy Basketball
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 02-10-2010, 08:29 PM
  3. NBA aims to crush union in labor battle
    By vnzla81 in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 30
    Last Post: 02-08-2010, 05:30 PM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 02-07-2010, 03:20 PM
  5. The latest on the labor situation
    By Unclebuck in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 15
    Last Post: 05-28-2005, 11:13 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •