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Thread: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

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    Default Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Obviously this is assuming Tyler will be back soon.

    But between Tyler, Josh, and Roy, which one least deserves to be starting right now? You have to say Roy, right?

    So why not let Tyler be your "let's try to score with a big" player, while Josh does everything Josh does best, and you also are a more mobile starting 5 with them sharing the front court.

    Do I wish we could have Roy's game? Sure, when he brings it, but right now he's not doing that nearly consistently enough, so I think it's time to get the most out of Josh and Tyler. Both of them are 'bringing it' more regularly than Roy is, and I like what they bring as a pair as well as individually.

    Let Roy come in a little later in the game to see if he can get it going against tired starters and their backups.

    Look, this isn't how I want things to be. I want Roy to deserve to be our staring center, but for now I think it needs to be different.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Jim will officially be the worst coach ever and not give a **** about winning if he benches either Josh or Tyler to still play James Posey.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    As we have learned...it doesn't matter who JO'B starts.....it matters who JO'B decides to close the game with.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    I'd like it if they'd at least try it.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    No. Tyler needs to come off the bench. Josh and Roy play well together.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    No. Tyler needs to come off the bench. Josh and Roy play well together.
    I would have thought that Roy's play against the Bulls put to rest the trend of pinning his terrible play on Tyler.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by judicata View Post
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    I would have thought that Roy's play against the Bulls put to rest the trend of pinning his terrible play on Tyler.
    He was 1-5, but he had 5 rebounds and 5 blocks, that's not so bad. The offense was also really moving well when he was in the game in the first.

    Regardless, Tyler, Josh, Foster, Hibbert needs to be our four post players..with Danny playing the PF if need be.

    No more Posey. And I don't care who starts, just so long as one of either Hibbert or Tyler is in the lineup at any given time. (For scoring purposes)

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Well Jim is either too stubborn or stupid to try that lineup so I highly doubt it will happen. I personally would love that lineup because Roy looks worse and worse every game. I don't understand why he can't look even a fraction of what he looked like even last year. That being said, why not start Josh at the 5 with Hans at the 4. Josh can make the defensive assignments while Tyler can score. Too bad Jim o' dumb*** doesn't think this would ever work.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by CircleCity3318 View Post
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    Well Jim is either too stubborn or stupid to try that lineup so I highly doubt it will happen. I personally would love that lineup because Roy looks worse and worse every game. I don't understand why he can't look even a fraction of what he looked like even last year. That being said, why not start Josh at the 5 with Hans at the 4. Josh can make the defensive assignments while Tyler can score. Too bad Jim o' dumb*** doesn't think this would ever work.
    Everyone is blowing this Roy thing way out of proportion. He can't look even a fraction of what he looked last year? Sure he is in a slump but he had five blocks tonight. In the game friday he went 7 - 12 for 20 points and 6 rebounds IN 25 MINUTES.

    Yes Roy is in a slump still. But he is still averaging around 12 and 8 on the year. Calm down.
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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    I'd like to see Roy still start to keep his confidence up, but I would love to see Josh and Tyler playing together every game. Put those guys in with Paul George and we have a very Feisty lineup.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    No. Tyler needs to come off the bench. Josh and Roy play well together.
    Well Tyler and Collison play very wel together. So I guess it depends what is more important.


    Hicks, I'm not sure what you are using as a guage as far as who should be playing. But if we are just looking at the here and now, Jeff Foster has been by far our best big guy over the past 4 or 5 weeks

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Trophy View Post
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    Jim will officially be the worst coach ever and not give a **** about winning if he benches either Josh or Tyler to still play James Posey.
    Sorry that has already happened!

    I'm a huge Hansbrough supporter, but I think he would be better coming off the bench and playing with the 2nd unit. I prefer Josh starting b/c he does so many of the intangibles well.

    You have Granger, Collison and Roy who can score the ball in that starting lineup, even Dunleavy, so Josh being the defender and passer that he is blends in well with that group.

    Tyler does as well, but he's more of a scorer and he could really bolster the 2nd unit, while usually getting a favorable match-up as well.

    It's true Tyler and Collison run the pick in roll well, but I think Price and Tyler could as well. Haven't really seen that since T.J has been getting backup minutes, but I think Price and Hansbrough could be a good combination.

    Sadly none of this matters

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by pwee31 View Post
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    You have Granger, Collison and Roy who can score the ball in that starting lineup, even Dunleavy, so Josh being the defender and passer that he is blends in well with that group.
    Good argument. Sounds fine to me.

    I think part of the "sadly none of this matters" issue is that the guys you tap here as the scorers are really dependable scorers night in and night our right now with the exception of Granger.
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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    What honks me off is that the Pacers haven't given BOTH of them significant minutes since November.

    In November, Josh got a ton of time prior to Jim attempting to convert him to Troy Murphy. Tyler got a little time too in November. The result was a competitive team.

    In December, Josh started shooting more threes, Tyler was benched and Roy lost confidence. Don't think these were related?

    In January, Josh gets benched and Jim wheels Tyler back out as the starter. Now Josh finally gets on the floor and looks like the best player out there...ONLY because Tyler is out.

    I don't care who starts. PLAY THEM BOTH JIM!

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    Well Tyler and Collison play very wel together. So I guess it depends what is more important.


    Hicks, I'm not sure what you are using as a guage as far as who should be playing. But if we are just looking at the here and now, Jeff Foster has been by far our best big guy over the past 4 or 5 weeks
    So what is more important? Look at the team's record when Roy and McRoberts were playing significant minutes together. They were 9-7 at end of November when O'Brien started tinkering with the lineups.

    Roy and Josh were playing well as a front court tandem. Tyler was playing well off the bench as a scorer. They were playing their roles, and things were good.

    Now look at the Pacers' record with Hansbrough in the starting lineup. 2-8.

    Sure maybe Collison and Hansbrough have been playing well together off the pick-and-roll, but has it led to a better record? Nope.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    I'd like to see Tyler start and Josh get major minutes. I still believe in having a true center on the floor and niether Tyler of Josh can really play center. It's been obvious forever now that the odd men out of the 4/5 rotation should be Posey and Solo but JOB seems to want to keep at least 1 player in that rotation that sucks so someone who really contributes is just going to have to get a dnp.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    I don't care who starts as long as Josh, Tyler and Roy get playing time, I AM SICK AND TIRED OF JIM AND HIS JAMES POSEY MAN CRUSH.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    I don't know why we wouldn't go back to what has worked in the past. The offense is so much better when Josh is in the starting lineup. He just does more to help his teammates.

    Tyler is a better scorer, but that doesn't necessarily make him a better offensive player. Josh passes, moves without the ball, and sets better and more effective screens. Tyler gets the ball and gets tunnel vision. He can't do anything but score, so that's what he tries to do.

    That is his game. It is better suited coming off the bench.

    I've been saying it all year.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    Well Tyler and Collison play very wel together. So I guess it depends what is more important.


    Hicks, I'm not sure what you are using as a guage as far as who should be playing. But if we are just looking at the here and now, Jeff Foster has been by far our best big guy over the past 4 or 5 weeks
    We need a low post threat in the second unit though. Our second unit is going to continue to get creamed if it's essentially "Foster, Posey, George, X, Price" Particularly if X is Rush.

    That means we only have guys who can score on the perimter. I wouldn't be opposed to starting Tyler and Jeff, and bringing Hibbert and Josh in off the bench. We can go with Tyler and Josh, but I'd rather have Josh and Roy playing together.

    I thought it was ironic last night that it was Collison running the motion and Price running the "point guard dribbles the ball around trying to run off of PnRs" offense. Price would rather play the motion offense and Collison would rather go with the second. So play the guys with Price that can also run the motion offense (Josh, Roy, Dun) and play the guys with Collison that would rather be in the PnR (Hans, Foster, George)..Those have been our best big guys and our best shooting guard anyway, why wouldn't we start them?

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    No. Tyler needs to come off the bench. Josh and Roy play well together.
    You mean like those two points he had last night?

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Absolutely Roy needs to come off the bench for awhile; something needs to change with him. I love Roy, but he's rapidly plunged from MIP to "are we going to keep this guy around when his rookie deal is up?" I have faith in Roy that he can bounce back, but seriously, we could end up letting both Brandon and Roy go without seriously attempting to resign them. What a waste that draft would be.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    I don't know why we wouldn't go back to what has worked in the past. The offense is so much better when Josh is in the starting lineup. He just does more to help his teammates.

    Tyler is a better scorer, but that doesn't necessarily make him a better offensive player. Josh passes, moves without the ball, and sets better and more effective screens. Tyler gets the ball and gets tunnel vision. He can't do anything but score, so that's what he tries to do.

    That is his game. It is better suited coming off the bench.

    I've been saying it all year.
    One sentence about the topic at hand, the rest yet another 'Why I think Josh > Tyler' post.

    This is about putting them together. Let Tyler be your scorer instead of Roy, while Josh moves and sets screens and passes. They both do what they do more consistently than Roy does what he does. That's the whole point.

    I'm so sick of 'Josh vs. Tyler.'

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    You mean like those two points he had last night?
    Other than the two points I still think that Roy did a good job last night(compared to the last few games) even though his coach put him on a position were he was defending Boozer instead of the 100 years old KT.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    One sentence about the topic at hand, the rest yet another 'Why I think Josh > Tyler' post.

    This is about putting them together. Let Tyler be your scorer instead of Roy, while Josh moves and sets screens and passes. They both do what they do more consistently than Roy does what he does. That's the whole point.

    I'm so sick of 'Josh vs. Tyler.'
    The whole post was about the topic at hand. You play them together significant minutes every night, but you don't start them together.

    If this team is going to be successful, Roy needs to start playing well again. That isn't going to happen by benching him. He doesn't have the mentality to handle that kind of demotion. He's the single most important player in regards to the win/loss record. You gotta ride out the rough patch with him. This current rough patch has been excrutiatingly long and rough, but we haven't even tried to help him out of it.

    Put him back in the same position he was in before when he was successful. He really hasn't had a chance to do that since JOB tinkered with the rotation for no reason. I'm just saying, let's go back to what works. A three-man PF/C rotation is all we really used when things were going well, and that's all we really need.

    No more Posey or Foster in the regular rotation. If foul trouble necessitates that they need to play occasionally, so be it, but they don't need to play consistently.

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    Default Re: Honestly, shouldn't Tyler AND Josh be starting for now?

    Josh and Roy like playing together and have good chemistry. Foster and Tyler playing together works well because Tyler is a scorer and Foster doesn't need to shoot, and they both play scrappy with energy. There's your 4-man big rotation.

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