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Thread: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shabazz View Post
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    Do you really think you would have been that close to beating the Spurs, the team with the best record in the league, if McRoberts had been your starting PF?
    Nope. With Josh starting the only games you can win are against the Lakers in LA or the Heat in Miami.

    But home with 4 days off and the Spurs on their 3rd game that week of a East road trip...clearly your only hope is to bench Josh and take Tyler from 0 mpg to 36.


    This post is irrational and IMO blatantly anti-Josh, possibly out of the irrational POV that being pro-Tyler means you have to be anti-Josh or vice versa.

    I was anti-drafting Tyler and big on playing Josh and I have been converted to playing Tyler also. There is no good reason for this to be an "either or". None of the results suggest that Josh has been anything less than Tyler this year.

    He's shot better, rebounded nearly as well (yes, the numbers say he has), passed very well (he's the top Assist guy p36 after the 3 PGs), gets more steals and blocks than Tyler...but somehow a person can see this and say "Tyler is a must play, Josh is ruining the team". That's not rational and the facts do not support it.

    Tyler and Josh have both been able to add something to the game with very similar results via different methods.


    By the way, if Tyler was the savior then why didn't they almost beat the Hawks? Oh yeah, because CIRCUMSTANCES of the schedule weren't so favorable last night.

    This stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    My belief on Josh is that he does not have significant upside offensively. I think Josh "is what he is" if you can pardon the expression. He can become a little more efficient, but I think that's about all he's going to gain. But, that's probably okay considering his role as a facilitator.
    Tyler is older. Tyler played heavy minutes at UNC still learning the game while Josh mistakingly came out too early and got stuck getting almost no PT or development the last 3 years. Tyler was on his way to being handed a lot more minutes than Josh last year even while he was shooting sub 40% from the PF position, making him one of the worst (maybe THE worst) shooting PF in the NBA (Tyler I mean).

    So frankly I don't see where the upside is in favor of Tyler. I put this out pre-draft, statistically Tyler DID NOT CHANGE his final 3 years at UNC. His rebounding went down his senior year.

    At the time I contrasted this with guys like Duncan or Griffin who did show increases when they stayed. They didn't just keep doing more of the same. They were learning and improving.

    Now I didn't make Josh leave Duke and it's not just hindsight to say that's a dumb thing to do IMO. I'm always pro-stay in college for all but the most polished and ready players. You'll get more PT and time to mature playing against other KIDS rather than 30 year old men.

    Being 20 in a rich man's world with the partying and attitudes is not conducive to growth. Neither is not getting quality minutes of highly competitive basketball, especially at a program like Duke.

    But that's in the past, and I'd say it indicates that it's Josh that's more likely to mature his game than Tyler. Tyler stayed at UNC to become what he is. His success even seems to be coming in the same form that he had it in college - high motor, hustle, draw tons of FTAs.



    In all honesty, I don't believe either player is going to be our long-term starting PF. More than likely, they are both stop gaps until we find that player. But, if I had to say which one is more likely to become a true starting PF, I would have to go with Tyler, even though he would have to absorb part of Josh's fundamental traits to become that player.
    Going backward I still wouldn't have drafted Tyler simply because I would have let Josh fill that role (backup PF) and traded down. Holiday, Chase, Sam Young, and definitely Blair "for free in the 2nd round" were all targets I would have gone for in that draft, just due to the roster situation.

    I also wouldn't have gone with George with Rush and Danny here, but Bird did.

    So with George on the team and showing pretty solid athletic promise, it would be very tempting to move Danny for Kevin Love as the PF solution. Or if I thought we could trust his attitude I'd be all for making Zach Randolph the FA signing next year.

    But somehow it would all seem like a bit of a waste to not take advantage of getting Josh as a throw-in, allowing you to do something else with your next picks/cap space. You'd have to trade Tyler or Josh, and by not SHOWCASING JOSH with 36 mpg (or have I misunderstood the insane pro-Tyler/Ford PT arguments) you don't get a lot of trade value with Josh.

    In short, I'm not adverse to upgrading at PF, but I this is tricky given the current situation. Plus I'm one of those guys in the "let's not make moves till we try this with another coach" camp. I mean what if Coach X is brought in, uses the roster in the ways that most of us suggest, and we have nice results from it? Then we'd be glad we didn't pull the trigger prematurely, especially when we'd be dealing from a position of weakness in terms of trade chips (other than Danny).
    Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 01-09-2011 at 02:44 PM.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by hoops_guy View Post
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    Of course he didn't complain about how James Posey got sodomized by Josh Smith on offense.
    I forgot about this. To illustrate this I went to the play by play, because I remembered exactly when it happened, because I was complaining about it to a buddy.

    From the play by play:

    Smith Rebound (Off:3 Def:6) 02:54
    Smith Putback Slam Dunk Shot: Made 02:54
    Smith Running Layup Shot: Made 02:21
    Smith Free Throw 1 of 1 (22 PTS) 02:21
    Smith 3pt Shot: Made 01:51
    Smith Jump Shot: Made 01:10
    The result was bad, and it looked bad. 10 points in 2 minutes. Hilarious.

    .
    Last edited by xBulletproof; 01-09-2011 at 03:08 PM.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Assuming Tyler can stay relatively consistent (and that goes for more than a few games, I'm talking 10+ games), I agree with this.

    I'd even say use Jeff and Josh at the backup 5, even when Josh is playing backup 4. He should play often.
    I've always liked both of these players (Josh and Tyler). But Tyler can take over a game...at both ends of the floor. Not just once a year, but maybe once a week...and not just on offense. Dude has quick hands and rips the ball away from players...and as he has gotten smarter, I've seen he can carve out space and grab tough boards. There are a lot of little things that Tyler can do because he plays with force.

    ....so yes, I am hoping Josh is the backup...not because I don't like Josh...but because I am also hoping that Tyler becomes more consistent with more minutes.

    Have a couple other comments too. I stated that I thought Tyler blocked shots about as well as Josh. I think I'll take that one back. I think Tyler's a lot more effective defensively, including blocking shots, than most people may have expected....and I perhaps got carried away a bit on that point. The short of it is, I think Tyler is a lot better defensively than I expected to go along with a more explosive offensive game.

    The other issue that has been raised is about potential and improvement. Some think Josh has more room to improve. I think in theory he does, but I don't see as much natural skill, other than passing the ball. I see an athlete who may become a solid defender and a good facilitator on offense. With Tyler, I see a guy who has dramatically improved his game from just last year. The knock on him last year was FG%. He has improved that nearly 10% simply from playing much smarter basketball. It's really been a phenomenal adjustment IMO.

    At bottom, I think Tyler's defense + offense has more potential to be greater than Josh's...but the jury is still out on this one.
    Last edited by BlueNGold; 01-09-2011 at 03:37 PM.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Where does McRoberts fit in, if Tyler starts?

    Apparently he doesn't, since he instantly goes from starting to 13th man and possibly never playing again........ or til @sshat decides on a new brilliant strategy.
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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Given his post count and timing of his visit to our boards This guy seems to be more of a Tyler fan than a pacers fan. I wouldn't bother trying to persuade him about whats good for the team. He reminds me a lot of the poster Phsyco T. (who isn't here anymore). Also the NC/ Duke thing needs to be differentiated from the nba Josh and Tyler comparisons because the college fans turn this debate into one big cluster____.

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    Nope. With Josh starting the only games you can win are against the Lakers in LA or the Heat in Miami.

    But home with 4 days off and the Spurs on their 3rd game that week of a East road trip...clearly your only hope is to bench Josh and take Tyler from 0 mpg to 36.


    This post is irrational and IMO blatantly anti-Josh, possibly out of the irrational POV that being pro-Tyler means you have to be anti-Josh or vice versa.

    I was anti-drafting Tyler and big on playing Josh and I have been converted to playing Tyler also. There is no good reason for this to be an "either or". None of the results suggest that Josh has been anything less than Tyler this year.

    He's shot better, rebounded nearly as well (yes, the numbers say he has), passed very well (he's the top Assist guy p36 after the 3 PGs), gets more steals and blocks than Tyler...but somehow a person can see this and say "Tyler is a must play, Josh is ruining the team". That's not rational and the facts do not support it.

    Tyler and Josh have both been able to add something to the game with very similar results via different methods.


    By the way, if Tyler was the savior then why didn't they almost beat the Hawks? Oh yeah, because CIRCUMSTANCES of the schedule weren't so favorable last night.

    This stuff doesn't happen in a vacuum.
    Last edited by spazzxb; 01-09-2011 at 04:32 PM.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Shabazz View Post
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    I don't know what to think about McRoberts. Hansbrough owned McRoberts every single time they played in college. McRoberts has never been a very physical player and was bit of a basket case when I watched him play. It seems like he has matured a lot since then.

    But he should have never been starting at PF while the better player sat at the end of the bench.
    I think it depends on what your definition of a better player is. I think it's a no brainer that Hansbrough looked better in college and certainly if they're both the #1 option on their team (which they were for mcroberts 2nd year).

    Hansbrough's strength is the mid range jumper and giving him the ball in a face up situation. But, should he be a high option on offense on a decent team? My answer would be no.

    McRoberts is a better athlete, shot blocker, passer, long range shooter, and probably a better defender in most situations. I think they're close in rebounding. You certainly don't want to give him the ball in isolation and say 'go make something happen' because he can't create for himself and he's a good passer from the high post/3 point line, but not off the dribble.

    So, if you have better options on offense than throwing the ball to Tyler, then I think you're better served with McRoberts, who can give you more things without being an option on offense. Then have Tyler come in as a guy off the bench to give you energy and offense against bench players where he's going to be more effective.

    But, there's only 1 ball, do you want to throw it to Tyler over Granger, Hibbert, Dunleavy/Rush, Collison?

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    I'm starting to think McRoberts may not be on the team next season. If Jim isn't retained, I don't see anything other than dunking that would qualify McRoberts to be on an NBA roster, unless he starts shooting the three better.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by flox View Post
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    I'm starting to think McRoberts may not be on the team next season. If Jim isn't retained, I don't see anything other than dunking that would qualify McRoberts to be on an NBA roster, unless he starts shooting the three better.
    I'll let Seth expand on this....but my initial response is that he has some solid passing skills for a Big Man and good offensive awareness. To me, he is a good enough Player to be considered IMHO a "1st Big Man off the Bench / Emergency Starter" on any Team...essentially a 7th/8th Man rotational Player.
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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    i think flox is right. josh was given the first third of the season to show his stuff, it appears that it is now tyler's turn. but pacers big rotation is so weak, he will probably get another shot at it when tyler or jeff plays poorly.

    but it looks like solo and josh are the 'in case of fire break glass' club.

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    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I'll let Seth expand on this....but my initial response is that he has some solid passing skills for a Big Man and good offensive awareness. To me, he is a good enough Player to be considered IMHO a "1st Big Man off the Bench / Emergency Starter" on any Team...essentially a 7th/8th Man rotational Player.
    I agree. If anyone thinks McRoberts is not in the NBA in 5 years, they will be proven wrong. I see him as at least a 7-10 guy on a .500 team.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I'll let Seth expand on this....but my initial response is that he has some solid passing skills for a Big Man and good offensive awareness. To me, he is a good enough Player to be considered IMHO a "1st Big Man off the Bench / Emergency Starter" on any Team...essentially a 7th/8th Man rotational Player.
    josh does lots of things ok. but nothing really good. until he is a good defender and rebounder, he will have trouble cracking any decent NBA rotation.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    I agree. If anyone thinks McRoberts is not in the NBA in 5 years, they will be proven wrong. I see him as at least a 7-10 guy on a .500 team.
    Don't get me wrong....I don't think that he's anywhere near the "Legend of McBob" that we all wish that he would be....but to say that he's one doesn't "see anything other than dunking that would qualify McRoberts to be on an NBA roster" is short-sighted.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    I'll let Seth expand on this....but my initial response is that he has some solid passing skills for a Big Man and good offensive awareness. To me, he is a good enough Player to be considered IMHO a "1st Big Man off the Bench / Emergency Starter" on any Team...essentially a 7th/8th Man rotational Player.
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    I agree. If anyone thinks McRoberts is not in the NBA in 5 years, they will be proven wrong. I see him as at least a 7-10 guy on a .500 team.
    He might catch with another team running some sort of passing offense, if more of those guys get hired in the league.

    But I don't think a lot of teams would put a premium on a big man who's best attributes are dunking, passing, and awareness.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    I put this out pre-draft, statistically Tyler DID NOT CHANGE his final 3 years at UNC. His rebounding went down his senior year.
    This was factually inaccurate when you arguing it 18 months ago and remains so now. Which is one of the reasons why this argument goes no where.

    Is any one else having trouble following these rules?

    1) College is irrelevant, unless you are pointing out statistical decline.

    2) Being older with less professional experience is clearly more advantageous than being younger with more professional experience.

    3) Your statistics when you are injured and have missed training camp are relevant. Your statistics when you are riding the pine and only getting 8 minutes a game unfairly represent you as a player.

    4) Passing, dunks, and handling skills are critical intangibles for your 4 to possess. Toughness, strength, and power are not.

    Honestly, I'm mostly disappointed in myself for getting sucked back into this conversation 18 months later.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Simply put the positive impact that Tyler had on the Spurs game was far superior to anything Josh is capable of doing.

    We can spend forever disecting stats ever since Josh and Tyler were born, but if it isn't obvious by just watching the games, then I have no way to convince you
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 01-09-2011 at 08:16 PM.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Josh suffers from lack of game definition. And with a coach who lacks consistent role definitions, this is even more disruptive to Josh's development.

    And yes a player like Josh needs development. He didn't come out of the womb ready to contribute. And you can show me the flawed per36 stats all you want.
    Last edited by Major Cold; 01-10-2011 at 11:29 AM.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    Simply put the positive impact that Tyler had on the Spurs game was far superior to anything Josh is capable of doing.

    We can spend forever disecting stats ever since Josh and Tyler were born, but if it isn't obvious by just watching the games, then I have no way to convince you
    Tyler played great in that game. That is indisputable. Really made Jim look foolish.

    He was put in the lineup to improve the offense. The Pacers scored 87 points. I wouldn't call that a huge improvement. He got buckets, which the team needs, but he really doesn't add anything that improves the offense. To say simply that Tyler has a superior impact to Josh based on one game would be misleading.

    Tyler scores, but he doesn't do anything to help his teammates. He is the ideal player to bring off the bench when Hibbert, Granger, and Collison are struggling offensively. They have struggled offensively for a month, and O'Brien made the mistake of scapegoating Josh for those struggles. He had Hansbrough on the bench, and should have been using him to supplement his team's struggling offense. It worked in November, but he never thought to try in December. It is entirely perplexing. Then in January, he decided to take a guy he never played, for no reason, and throw him into the starting lineup. He took the starter, and for no reason, decided to nail him down to the bench. Another classic example of Jim O'Brien throwing **** against the wall to see what sticks.

    There is no method to the madness.

    Tyler played 36 minutes and took 19 shots. Josh has never played more than 30 and has only taken double digit shots twice, his most attempts being 12. They aren't the same players. They don't have the same roles. You should not act like they do.

    Tyler had more plays run for him in the Spurs game than Josh has had run for him all season. The truth is, Josh has probably not had a single play run for him. There is no reason for O'Brien to be unable to find a place, on this team, for both Josh and Tyler. The fact that he is not capable of that is a major black mark on his resume. They both should be getting at least
    25-30 minutes every single night. The only reason they aren't is because JOB in incapable of putting this roster in the best position to be most successful.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    I don't see what the big deal is Josh was only holding down the spot until Tyler got healthy and up to speed. Don't get me wrong he should dress and play some but I honestly can't see how anyone thinks he's better than Tyler and JMac would never even got any real burn here if Tyler didn't have so many things happen to him since getting drafted in the first place.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
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    He was put in the lineup to improve the offense. The Pacers scored 87 points. I wouldn't call that a huge improvement. He got buckets, which the team needs, but he really doesn't add anything that improves the offense. To say simply that Tyler has a superior impact to Josh based on one game would be misleading.

    Tyler played 36 minutes and took 19 shots. Josh has never played more than 30 and has only taken double digit shots twice, his most attempts being 12. They aren't the same players. They don't have the same roles. You should not act like they do.
    I wasn't the one in this thread who started the comparison between Josh and Tyler, I was just responding to it.

    I fuind your comment about Tyler not adding anything to the offense a little off base. How about his offensive rebounding, and the fact that teams will start to cover Tyler a lot closer than they would have. Another big thing teams know they have to have size on Tyler so maybe that might allow Roy to play against a smaller guy

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I wasn't the one in this thread who started the comparison between Josh and Tyler, I was just responding to it.

    I fuind your comment about Tyler not adding anything to the offense a little off base. How about his offensive rebounding, and the fact that teams will start to cover Tyler a lot closer than they would have. Another big thing teams know they have to have size on Tyler so maybe that might allow Roy to play against a smaller guy
    I'd like to add onto this and say Tyler's help defense against the Spurs was very good. I believe he took at least one charge, maybe two. He also altered several shots after Manu beat his man. I did not watch the Atlanta game, so I cannot comment there.

    I believe Larry needs to add a starting PF with size, who can play minutes at the 5. We can then essentially run a 3 man frontcourt rotation with that player, Roy, and Hans. If the Melo deal goes through, Nene comes to mind.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by purdue101 View Post
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    I'd like to add onto this and say Tyler's help defense against the Spurs was very good. I believe he took at least one charge, maybe two. He also altered several shots after Manu beat his man. I did not watch the Atlanta game, so I cannot comment there.

    I believe Larry needs to add a starting PF with size, who can play minutes at the 5. We can then essentially run a 3 man frontcourt rotation with that player, Roy, and Hans. If the Melo deal goes through, Nene comes to mind.
    i totally agree. especially the bolded parts. nene looks to be a guy that might fit the pacer needs and is available.

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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I wasn't the one in this thread who started the comparison between Josh and Tyler, I was just responding to it.

    I fuind your comment about Tyler not adding anything to the offense a little off base. How about his offensive rebounding, and the fact that teams will start to cover Tyler a lot closer than they would have. Another big thing teams know they have to have size on Tyler so maybe that might allow Roy to play against a smaller guy
    I don't think he really adds much of anything to the offense with the starters. He just changes it. He gets shots up like they are going out of the style, so I suppose it is just a matter of preference. Do you want Granger, Hibbert, and Collison being the main offensive threats and shot takers? That is my preference, but if not, then do you want Hansbrough being the main shot taker?

    Because when he is on the floor, he has to be the main offensive option in order to be effective. Other than scoring for himself, he doesn't contribute enough offensively in other areas. He can't and doesn't pass, he can't and doesn't dribble, he doesn't try to set up his teammates through screens. He sets screens to try to free himself up for a shot. I don't think it is an issue of selfishness, I think that's just the only way he knows.

    He does get offensive rebounds. Many of them come off of his own misses and blocked attempts when under the basket, but he gets them nonetheless.

    When McRoberts was not being asked to float along the three-point line like Troy Murphy 2.0, he was getting offensive rebounds at a very high rate. Probably too high of a rate for him to be able to maintain it over a full season, but that dimension of his game was there, and was taken away from him when O'Brien changed strategy out of the blue.

    Dejuan Blair is one of the few guys in the league that is an ideal matchup for Hansbrough, and he took advantage of his opportunity. Boozer in Chicago, Millsap in Utah, also immediately come to mind. I don't think he can be as successful against the taller, longer, more athletic players that are on a majority of the teams, but we are going to get a chance to find out. I have not yet watched the Hawks game, but I don't think he matches up well with Josh Smith at all, so I'm curious to see how he does. I've checked the box score, but I don't believe that you can ever truly judge a player by numbers alone. I have it recorded and will try to watch it tonight after work.

    In the first game of the season against the Spurs, McRoberts had 11 points on 6 shots, and 6 rebounds in 24 minutes as the Pacers scored 109 points. On Friday night, Hansbrough had 23 points on 19 shots, and 12 rebounds in 36 minutes as the Pacers scored 87 points. Give McRoberts a full quarter more of playing time, and triple his shots, and who is to say that he doesn't come close to equaling the numbers that Hansbrough produced? There is no way to know, because he has never had that opportunity.

    Regardless, I think McRoberts' skills as a passer, ball handler, and screener offensively, are a better fit as a member of the starting lineup. Hansbrough is the ideal scoring punch to bring off the bench. It worked in November, and I still can't understand why O'Brien decided he needed to change things up in December, but he did. He dug himself into a hole by making that move, and now I think he is just digging himself deeper with this January change.

    Right now, we are 14-20. There are 11 games to go in January, 5 at home and 6 on the road. If we win more than 3 games this month, I will be pleasantly surprised. We could easily be looking at 17-28, or worse, by the time the calendar flips, and becomes time for O'Brien to make another mystery change. If, we do indeed, slip more than 10 games below .500, will O'Brien make the same mistake he made before and scapegoat Hansbrough as the reason for the problem? Then what? Does Posey become the starter? Does he decide to permanently shift Granger to PF? Do Hansbrough and McRoberts both end up in suits behind the bench? Where does it end?

    Since December 1st, and the strategy change, we have played 18 games. We have lost 13 of them. The only teams we have beaten? Toronto, Charlotte, Cleveland, New Orleans, and Washington, all of them at home. That isn't exactly a Murderer's Row of opponents. Things have been ugly, but they are likely to get much worse. The only consolation to all this losing would be a change at the top. That is unlikely to happen, so I hope everybody is prepared for a lot of disappointment.

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  31. #74
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by spazzxb View Post
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    Given his post count and timing of his visit to our boards This guy seems to be more of a Tyler fan than a pacers fan. I wouldn't bother trying to persuade him about whats good for the team. He reminds me a lot of the poster Phsyco T. (who isn't here anymore). Also the NC/ Duke thing needs to be differentiated from the nba Josh and Tyler comparisons because the college fans turn this debate into one big cluster____.
    Wait, did you just say that Naptown Seth was a Tyler Hansbrough fanboy?

    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahah!!!!!!!!!

    You might want to go back in history and review that comment.


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  32. #75
    Droppin' knowledge, yo. Mackey_Rose's Avatar
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    Default Re: Where does Mcroberts fit in, if tyler starts?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Wait, did you just say that Naptown Seth was a Tyler Hansbrough fanboy?

    hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahah!!!!!!!!!

    You might want to go back in history and review that comment.
    Pretty sure he was (accurately) referring to Shabazz.

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