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Thread: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

  1. #51

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    And you still have it wrong calling Branch a 4th rounder. He was drafted in the 2nd round by the Pats in 2002. Therefore his ranking should be a 2nd round pick, not a 4th. But yeah....details details.
    I had him a 2nd rounder in my initial analysis. Then somebody insisted that Welker should more fairly be considered a second rounder since they traded one for him. If you do that, then it makes no sense to also list Branch as a 2nd rounder since they traded a 4th rounder to get him. clear? If that's going to be the guideline it should be evenly applied.
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  2. #52

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    So cherry picking like you did in this anaylsis is clearly not the way to do it.
    And then you proceeded to cherry pick your own analysis. Why "since 2004?" if the Brady-Manning rivalry began in 2001? To avoid counting Wayne and Clark? Why pick three rounds? Obviously any analysis has to have guidelines, but saying mine is any more cherry-picked than yours is simply not accurate in the least.

    I'm not going to dig through all the drafts, but tables of 1st rounders are an easy get, and I'll cover the whole Brady-Manning rivalry

    5 Colts 1st round skill players picked since 2001: Wayne, Clark, Addai, Gonzales, Brown

    3 Patriots 1st round skill players since 2001: Graham, Watson, Maroney
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  4. #53

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Why did I chose top 3 rounds? Because everyone values the top 3 rounds and considers them highly valuable and in your analysis you also put them in and you said this......


    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    . I would be quite surprised if many other teams are so fully invested in skill position players drafted quite so high. It is one clear advantage Peyton has always had.


    Why did I chose since 2004? Simple, it sucks to actually do the work but i can sure waste my time to prove the same point. Since both GM have been with their teams the Pats have had more skill positions drafted in the top 3 rounds. If you want to include the 4th round it still holds true.

    Since 2000 when BB and Pioli were hired the Pats drafted 11 skill position players in the top 3 rounds. The colts however drafted 6 since 2000.

    Your assumption is wrong when you actually "do" the analysis. Its not only wrong it's opposite of what you are saying.

    Now you want to include just the first round......lol. Sure the only picks that are valuable are the first round picks.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-09-2010 at 07:50 PM.

  5. #54

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Yes, and you want to include only the first 3 rounds. The fourth round isn't valuable? The fifth? The Colts had penciled in 5 first round picks at skill positions into their lineup THIS YEAR and because of injury they have the services of only two. The Patriots planned on one (Moss) and he flaked out so they are making do with zero. Yet Brady has all the talent around him and Manning is getting guys off the street up to speed.

    Okay...

    or maybe Deion Sanders had it right:

    WHY DO WE HAVE TO MAKE EXCUSES FOR THIS GUY EVERY TIME HE PLAYS LIKE GARBAGE?!" While the other commentator sticking to their guns, Deion went on to say that Peyton Manning is the least sacked quarterback in the league and still has an All-pro receiver in Reggie Wayne and Pierre Garcon who everyone thought was great last year.

    He then went on to ask the others what Tom had that Peyton didn't. The exchange went like this:

    Theisman: Deion Branch
    Deion: He's 60
    Marriucci: Woodhead
    Deion: He's 12
    Millen: Gronkowski and Hernandez
    Deion: Rookies
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

  6. #55

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    Yes, and you want to include only the first 3 rounds. The fourth round isn't valuable? The fifth?
    You set the standard not me. You said high draft picks which for most die hard nfl guys that means the first 3 rounds or atleast the first 2 rounds. We could take a poll but I think I would win.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    The Colts had penciled in 5 first round picks at skill positions into their lineup THIS YEAR and because of injury they have the services of only two. The Patriots planned on one (Moss) and he flaked out so they are making do with zero. Yet Brady has all the talent around him and Manning is getting guys off the street up to speed.
    So I guess Maroney (1st round pick) and Fred Taylor (1st round pick) don't count. I know the actual facts don't help much but lets be fair. The 2009 Pats had 5 1st round picks at the skill position penciled in.
    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    or maybe Deion Sanders had it right:

    WHY DO WE HAVE TO MAKE EXCUSES FOR THIS GUY EVERY TIME HE PLAYS LIKE GARBAGE?!"
    I am not trying to make excuses for him. He threw the picks and he has played like garbage the last couple of games.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    He then went on to ask the others what Tom had that Peyton didn't. The exchange went like this:

    Theisman: Deion Branch
    Deion: He's 60
    Marriucci: Woodhead
    Deion: He's 12
    Millen: Gronkowski and Hernandez
    Deion: Rookies
    No mention of a pro bowl wr called Wes Welker? I know its not a career year for him but neither is this a record setting year for Wayne either. By the way Deion is younger than Wayne so I guess wayne is 61...

    Lets talk about what Tommy does have besides dumb TV quotes. How about a 13th rank run offense which is more of a reflection of a good offensive line. How about good pass protection. You think being able to run the ball helps your QB. Give Tommy a 32nd rank run offense (colts rank) and see how his interceptions go up. Keep in mind the completion percentage between Manning and Brady is the same. The difference is that one guy has to do more with his arm which gives you more mistakes.

    So ya give Tom a terrible run offense and make him throw it 150 times more (thats the difference) and see if he doesn't throw more picks....

    I don't care who is better overall but saying one has more talent around him is wrong. Both have skill players that are good. The most important part of a team is the QB then the line. The qb is a wash the line however isn't. Tom has a big edge this year. The colts however took this line minus Lilja to the superbowl last year.

    Whats changed? Early injuries and a retired coach which is why i don't blame Polian for it entirely.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-10-2010 at 12:26 AM.

  7. #56

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    saying one has more talent around him is wrong.
    That's my point exactly, and people are saying that peyton is getting it done with nothing around him. False. He is getting it done with less than he is used to.

    Here's a list of pro bowl players that each quarterback has had at his disposal for skill positions:

    Brady's Pro Bowl Players- Randy Moss (2), Wes Welker (2), Troy Brown (1), Corey Dillon (1), total of 6.

    Manning's Pro Bowl Players- Marvin Harrison (8), Edgerrin James (4), Reggie Wayne (4), Marshall Faulk (1), Dallas Clark (1), Joseph Addai (1), total of 19.

    But, but... Brady always has a DEFENSE!

    Here's how the Patriots and Colts have stacked up since the rivalry really began in 2001. I'm putting which team had the better defense based on points allowed, the most relevant defensive stat.

    '10- Colts
    '09- Patriots
    '08- Colts
    '07- Colts (led NFL in fewest points allowed)
    '06- Patriots (2nd in NFL)
    '05- Colts (2nd in NFL)
    '04- Patriots (2nd in NFL)
    '03- Patriots (1st in NFL)
    '02- Colts
    '01- Patriots

    Final Result- In ten seasons, the Colts defense has allowed fewer points five times. The Colts have had a top-2 scoring defense twice, while the Patriots have three times.

    So ya give Tom a terrible run offense...
    Good teams are built so as not to have a terrible run offense. That's been my major point in this thread- Polian needs to be fired. He is wasting the talents of the 2nd best QB in the last 20 years. The Colts have at least if not more more running back talent than the Patriots and always have, even back when Corey Dillon was a Patriot. I'd trade nearly-waived Green-Ellis for Donald Brown in a heartbeat. They don't have a system and an O-line to get the job done, despite having no injury issues at all with their O-line.
    Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 12-10-2010 at 09:26 AM.
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  8. #57
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    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    I had him a 2nd rounder in my initial analysis. Then somebody insisted that Welker should more fairly be considered a second rounder since they traded one for him. If you do that, then it makes no sense to also list Branch as a 2nd rounder since they traded a 4th rounder to get him. clear? If that's going to be the guideline it should be evenly applied.
    No, because Branch was selected in the 2nd round, so that pick was gone. If you're going to do that then he needs to be both a 2nd round pick and a 4th round pick.

    Those picks were "used" on him. They have "used" multiple picks mulitple times to get his services.

    If I trade two picks for a player, then that player is worth both picks, not just the one and especially not just the higher one.

  9. #58

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    That's my point exactly, and people are saying that peyton is getting it done with nothing around him.
    No your point is that the Colts have drafted more skill postion players higher than the Pats. You know thats not true. The Colts have just done it better so they don't have to rely on signing aging vets.

    As far as the Pro bowl goes you know thats a fictitious way to say one team has more talent on per "team" basis. LOl, Kerry Collins and Clinton Portis got into the pro bowl in 2009. In 2010 David Garrard and Vince Young got in. Come on man...... Thats some weak .........

    The defensive stats are what they are except that in 2010 the Pats have a better defense when you look at points allowed (there again with the facts). Anyone can look at the Pats defense since the 2001 and tell you it was better overall. It was better coached and better over all when you look at who they played and how they played.

    Who was the last GM to get fired for his 0-line? Seriously when has that ever happened? The Colts have one of the best offenses still given early injuries to their line and inexperienced WR aside for one.

    Do I think Polain has wasted some of Peyton Mannings years? Of course. Same could be said of Belichick and Brady. Why not draft better skill position players. I mean its not like Addai was chosen before Maroney. ITs also not like Dalls Clark was selected higher than Daniel Graham. The greatness of Wayne got him selected 30th. THe Pats traded up to in 2006 to get Chad Jackson at 36 giving up a 3rd round pick.

    Point is both have done some things good and some things bad. Polain crutch is that 0-line and that really true since MUdd has left.

    By the way who would you replace him with? There is only one guy who I would consider above Polain espcially when looking at a running offense.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-10-2010 at 01:16 PM.

  10. #59

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Um, made playoffs 10 of the last 11 seasons, 7 straight 12 win seasons, 2 super bowl appearances, 1 win...

    All this bickering and I still don't see how anyone things the Colts have been anything less than a world class organization under Polian.

  11. #60
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    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
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    Um, made playoffs 10 of the last 11 seasons, 7 straight 12 win seasons, 2 super bowl appearances, 1 win...

    All this bickering and I still don't see how anyone things the Colts have been anything less than a world class organization under Polian.
    Only because this team could have been so much more with arguably the best QB in the history of the NFL, and they have squandered so many chances at greatness because they can't seem to pick the right guys who do the dirty work in the trenches on both sides of the ball. For every Dallas Clark, Austin Collie, and Dwight Freeney, there is a Tony Ugoh, Jamie Richard, and a Donald Brown. I think since the Colts have started to win games consistently during Manning's prime years, Polian and the coaching staff tried to coast on things and ride the wave. Why did it take so long to get rid of Ron Meeks? Why did it take 12 weeks to take Sanders off the active roster and onto IR? Why is there now a sense of urgency to fix the O-line even though we haven't had a thousand yard rusher since 2006 in Addai? This team has always had a weakness on defense, special teams, and rushing but Peyton has always pulled us through, but now that he is older he needs more help and the other players aren't good enough to help him out. If Peyton wasn't our quarterback this team would be just as bad as the Lions right now and Blair White would be playing in the Canadian League.

    Peyton needs help the same way John Elway needed help to win his final 2 Super Bowls, but I fear time may be running out and we won't be able to find our O-line and our Terrell Davis soon enough.
    Last edited by DGPR; 12-10-2010 at 02:10 PM.
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  13. #61
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    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    [QUOTE=Ransom;1115447]Um, made playoffs 10 of the last 11 seasons, 7 straight 12 win seasons, 2 super bo


    edit - crap, looks like something happened to my post.
    Last edited by SoupIsGood; 12-10-2010 at 05:39 PM.
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  14. #62

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ransom View Post
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    Um, made playoffs 10 of the last 11 seasons, 7 straight 12 win seasons, 2 super bowl appearances, 1 win...

    All this bickering and I still don't see how anyone things the Colts have been anything less than a world class organization under Polian.
    Well he is 1-6 in superbowl wins which is kind of crazy to me. I don't mind much Polain keeping his job that Slicks thing but I do mind his son inheriting it when there will be known GM's that are IMO better options.

    Just wait until Bill Polain steps completely down and see what happens.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-10-2010 at 02:59 PM.

  15. #63

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    The defensive stats are what they are except that in 2010 the Pats have a better defense when you look at points allowed (there again with the facts)
    When I posted, the stats had not been updated with the Jets game, which flip-flopped the positions of the Colts (now 24) and Patriots (now T-18).

    So obviously this year is in doubt.

    I bet you can win a bar bet with just about anyone by asking how many times the Colts have had a better defense than the Patriots, as measured by points given up. A: In 4 of the last 9 years.

    You can focus on all of the tangents you want to in this thread. My central point, whether you like it or not, is that it's hard to tell if it's Caldwell's fault. His team president is terrific at building a 30 or 40 man roster studded with fancy stars on both sides of the ball, but he doesn't extend that to a 53+ man roster. In most years injuries haven't been so severe that it was a major issue. In recent years Polian has down an awful job in finding talent on both lines of scrimmage.
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

  16. #64

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    So obviously this year is in doubt.

    I bet you can win a bar bet with just about anyone by asking how many times the Colts have had a better defense than the Patriots, as measured by points given up. A: In 4 of the last 9 years.
    .
    I bet you if you ask 50 colts fans and 50 Pat fans who has had a better defense since 2001 it would 90% in favor of pats. Gessh man when all you have to do to win a superbowl is throw for 145 yards and 1 touchdown all you can do is stand in awe of that kind of defense.

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    You can focus on all of the tangents you want to in this thread. My central point, whether you like it or not, is that it's hard to tell if it's Caldwell's fault. His team president is terrific at building a 30 or 40 man roster studded with fancy stars on both sides of the ball, but he doesn't extend that to a 53+ man roster. In most years injuries haven't been so severe that it was a major issue. In recent years Polian has down an awful job in finding talent on both lines of scrimmage.
    Injuries are no ones fault. Was it Belichicks fault to lose in the first round of the playoffs. If Tom has Welker and Brandon Tate the story might be different. When the Pats had to deal with a lot of injuries or they traded away good players for future picks and depleted the team they struggled. They lost last year do to injuries not because Bill sucks as a GM/coach.

    Take away the talent do to injuries or trades and no one is going to win a lot. Lilja was injury proned. Jake Scott agent couldn't wait until we figured out our salary cap position or Polain would have signed him. Do I blame Polain for Mudd retiring? No. Do I blame Caldwell for not replacing Mudd with a succesful line coach? Yes.

    When Caldwell say this:
    “You're not going to see a huge change,” Caldwell said. “You're going to see some little tweaks and changes, and you may see some additional size at certain positions, but it won't be so much that it's going to change us from a philosophical standpoint.”
    When your dead last in running the ball I want to see a philosophical change.

  17. #65

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by DGPR View Post
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    Only because this team could have been so much more with arguably the best QB in the history of the NFL, and they have squandered so many chances at greatness because they can't seem to pick the right guys who do the dirty work in the trenches on both sides of the ball. For every Dallas Clark, Austin Collie, and Dwight Freeney, there is a Tony Ugoh, Jamie Richard, and a Donald Brown. I think since the Colts have started to win games consistently during Manning's prime years, Polian and the coaching staff tried to coast on things and ride the wave. Why did it take so long to get rid of Ron Meeks? Why did it take 12 weeks to take Sanders off the active roster and onto IR? Why is there now a sense of urgency to fix the O-line even though we haven't had a thousand yard rusher since 2006 in Addai? This team has always had a weakness on defense, special teams, and rushing but Peyton has always pulled us through, but now that he is older he needs more help and the other players aren't good enough to help him out. If Peyton wasn't our quarterback this team would be just as bad as the Lions right now and Blair White would be playing in the Canadian League.

    Peyton needs help the same way John Elway needed help to win his final 2 Super Bowls, but I fear time may be running out and we won't be able to find our O-line and our Terrell Davis soon enough.
    Not really buying it.

    He's had some draft picks not work out, that's the draft. Overall I think this team has been an excellent example of competence in the front office. Just look at other organizations, the Raiders, etc. The Colts know who they are, a passing team with a quick defense. To say they should have won more seems to cut how tough winning a super bowl actually is. To say Polian stinks because he's 1-6 in super bowls doesn't do justice to how difficult getting there is.

    Frankly, as bad as the Colts have looked this year, they're what, 3 or 4 plays from being 10-3?

  18. #66

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    When the Pats had to deal with a lot of injuries or they traded away good players for future picks and depleted the team they struggled.
    Sometimes they did and sometimes they didn't...

    They won a Super Bowl with six defensive backs on injured reserve, using a street free agent named Earthwind Moreland, an undrafted rookie free agent named Randall Gay, and a wide receiver named Troy Brown to play cornerback with a previously-unused 2nd year guy from special teams who turned out to be pretty darn good (Asante Samuel). At the time, that Patriots team had more player-games lost to injury than any other team.
    Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 12-10-2010 at 05:43 PM.
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  19. #67

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    Sometimes they did and sometimes they didn't...

    They won a Super Bowl with six defensive backs on injured reserve, using a street free agent named Earthwind Moreland, an undrafted rookie free agent named Randall Gay, and a wide receiver named Troy Brown to play cornerback with a previously-unused 2nd year guy from special teams who turned out to be pretty darn good (Asante Samuel). At the time, that Patriots team had more player-games lost to injury than any other team.
    Do you honestly think I want check to see if what you post is true. Randall Gay was on IR in 2005. This is according to their home page. Also 11 players on IR is a normal season in the NFL. ITs not like the colts so don't try to compare it. They also had their starting safety.

    Ya it must of been terrible to lose Chad Scott and his 4 tackles in 3 games. Come on.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-10-2010 at 07:56 PM.

  20. #68

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    Do you honestly think I want check to see if what you post is true. Randall Gay was on IR in 2005. This is according to their home page.
    Yes, and I wasn't talking about that season, when the Steelers won the Super Bowl. I was talking about the 2004 season.

    Earthwind Moreland was promoted from the practice squad and found some playing time with the New England Patriots in 2004 due to injuries to the Patriots' secondary (including starters Ty Law and Tyrone Poole), making 2 starts in 9 games. By the end of the season and during the playoffs, Moreland was the 4th cornerback on the depth chart, behind Asante Samuel, Randall Gay, and wide receiver Troy Brown. Moreland was released after the season and has not played in an NFL game since.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthwind_Moreland
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

  21. #69

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    Yes, and I wasn't talking about that season, when the Steelers won the Super Bowl. I was talking about the 2004 season.



    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earthwind_Moreland
    Glad you could see my confusion because you said 6 defensive backs were placed on IR and that the pats were depleted so badly.

    The only problem is that in 2004 the Pats had only 3 DB's on IR not 6 according to their home page.

    When you have to combine seasons to make your point how can i take it seriously.

  22. #70

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    combine seasons to make your point how can i take it seriously.
    combining seasons gets you to 12 defensive backs injured and out:

    2004 injured DB's
    Ty Law-starter, pro bowler
    Tyrone Poole-starter
    Gus Scott
    Dexter Reid*
    Christian Morton*
    J'Rod Cherry*

    2005 injured DBs
    Randall Gay
    Rodney Harrison-starter, pro bowler
    Tyrone Poole (again)-starter
    Chad Scott
    Gus Scott (again)
    Dwayne Starks

    http://www.patriots.com/team/index.cfm?ac=2005injuries
    http://www.patriots.com/team/index.cfm?ac=2004injuries

    *Not listed among the injured reserve list for 2004 are players injured in preseason, before the rosters were finalized. These include S Dexter Reid, CB Christian Morton, S J'Rod Cherry. Cherry was signed to start at FS. All were injured in training camp. Cherry subsequently retired. You can perhaps google them to find the nature of their injuries. I recall that Cherry blew out a knee. You can see all these players on the preseason roster here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Ne...atriots_season
    (see table in openibg training camp roster)

    Do I have to keep doing this research for every time you wrongly accuse me of being inaccurate? It gets tiresome.
    Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 12-11-2010 at 10:07 PM.
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  24. #71

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    combining seasons gets you to 12 defensive backs injured and out:

    2004 injured DB's
    Ty Law-starter, pro bowler
    Tyrone Poole-starter
    Gus Scott
    Dexter Reid*
    Christian Morton*
    J'Rod Cherry*

    2005 injured DBs
    Randall Gay
    Rodney Harrison-starter, pro bowler
    Tyrone Poole (again)-starter
    Chad Scott
    Gus Scott (again)
    Dwayne Starks

    http://www.patriots.com/team/index.cfm?ac=2005injuries
    http://www.patriots.com/team/index.cfm?ac=2004injuries

    *Not listed among the injured reserve list for 2004 are players injured in preseason, before the rosters were finalized. These include S Dexter Reid, CB Christian Morton, S J'Rod Cherry. Cherry was signed to start at FS. All were injured in training camp. Cherry subsequently retired. You can perhaps google them to find the nature of their injuries. I recall that Cherry blew out a knee. You can see all these players on the preseason roster here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_Ne...atriots_season
    (see table in openibg training camp roster)

    Do I have to keep doing this research for every time you wrongly accuse me of being inaccurate? It gets tiresome.
    Well yes because you have posted inaccurate information multiple times. When you say the IR list that's the actual list not some made up thing before the roster is finalized.

    Being placed IR means you stay on IR not being waived.?

    Should we have a preseason IR list so you can make your point valid?

    Edit: When your not on the IR list but your waived because of injury before the season that means you suck so bad that there is 50 DBs like you on the waiver wire. Also Db's are easier to replace than any other position outside of a punter.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 12-12-2010 at 02:27 PM.

  25. #72

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?



    Caldwell is Jesus. Polian is God. Manning is Buddha. All are infallible and their team can only lose when refs and opponents cheat.
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

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  27. #73
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    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    Caldwell is Jesus. Polian is God. Manning is Buddha. All are infallible and their team can only lose when refs and opponents cheat.
    Come on now, this thread is proof that almost no one thinks that.
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  28. #74

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    Caldwell is Jesus. Polian is God. Manning is Buddha. All are infallible and their team can only lose when refs and opponents cheat.
    You know whats funny Slick is that you sound like me....... In June of 2009.

    Citing previous success doesn't mean he would have had been able to reproduce it with the Colts and without Peyton. The fact that he once again he has a HOF quarterback (hardest thing to get by the way) and is unable to build a complete team gives me a reason to question his ability to get the Colts in the same category as the Pats, Steelers, etc.

    THe question is not whether the colts have been a contender but why they are not like the Pats/Steelers who are the best. The reason is that they don't have the players to be a complete team. I hope this changes by the way.

    The colts are very good in 2 phases of the game. Passing the ball and defending the Pass. They are not great at running the ball or defending the run. In 10 years we have gotten worse at running the ball and defending the run.

    Now I am not a genius but shouldn't one of the best GMs if not "the best" GM improve a team overall in 10 years. The colts over ten years have a run defense that ranks 21.9. The colts over ten years have a run offense that ranks 18.4.

    Thats right... below average.
    http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthre...566#post901566


    Since86 by the way criticized Dungy so its not like we are blind sheep following Polainism.

  29. #75

    Default Re: Serious question: How come Jim Caldwell hasn't been criticized by the national media?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    When your not on the IR list but your waived because of injury before the season that means you suck.
    Before this season the Patriots signed Torry Holt to a 1 year contract, to play the role that Deion Branch plays now- posession receiver, good route runner, knows defenses, goes to the right place. He tore up his knee in camp. The team even announced he was being placed on IR:

    http://www.bostonherald.com/sports/f...icleid=1274969
    Wide receiver Torry Holt arrived in New England with high hopes and the belief he could still make a difference in the Patriots [team stats] offense. The 34-year-old veteran, however, won’t get the chance to prove it, as he was placed on season-ending injured reserve due to a knee injury that will require surgery this week.
    Is Torry Holt on the Patriots injured reserve list for this season? No. http://www.nfl.com/teams/roster?team=NE

    Why not?

    I'm thinking that it must have to do with that it happened before roster cuts were finalized, or maybe before the preseaon games were played, otherwise he would be there.

    I am not arguing that Holt was some key irreplaceable loss to the team this year. I am merely pointing out that sometimes injured players lost for the season don't show up on the injured reserve list, and perhaps it's if they are lost before any of the preseason games are played. I'm not explaining the phenomoneon (because I don't know the rules that govern it), but I'm just pointing out that this inconsistency can exist. It doesn't mean they suck. I don't think they asked for a "he sucks" exemption to keep from listing Torry Holt as injured.

    I was wrong, though, in remembering 6 DBs on IR in the 3rd super bowl season when officially it was 3 (though all three were starters). Since six were out the next year, it's too much of a coincidence to think that it was that season where that number stuck in my mind. Some of the additional depth for 2004 was cut, after injury, in training camp. Only in hindsight did we know that Asante Samuel was something special. It was blatantly obvious that Earthwind Moreland, Hank Poteat, Randall Gay as an undrafted rookie, and Troy Brown (though I loved him as a WR) were nothing special as defensive backs. It still has to be up there as one of the more impressive patchwork jobs any champion ever pulled off.
    Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 12-13-2010 at 01:46 PM.
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

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