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Thread: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

  1. #526
    Member Speed's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    p4e's link is to Jonas V; yours is to Donatas?

    If the mocks are to believed, Valanciunas won't be available at the Pacers' pick but Motiejunas might. If Donatas does drop to 15, I think he would be BPA. Not necessarily a good fit with the roster, but definitely a talented guy.
    Wasn't Donatas projected top 5 early on last year in the mock drafts or am I thinking of someone else. I remember Vesley and another foreign born player both ranked highly. Neither came out.

    Also, not sure if its been mentioned here, but Chad Ford on a Bill Simmons podcast said the Bismark may be older than 18, but no one knows.

  2. #527

    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    Wasn't Donatas projected top 5 early on last year in the mock drafts or am I thinking of someone else. I remember Vesley and another foreign born player both ranked highly. Neither came out.

    Also, not sure if its been mentioned here, but Chad Ford on a Bill Simmons podcast said the Bismark may be older than 18, but no one knows.
    The problem with Donatas is that it may be very hard to bring him over the U.S. I would be cautious with drafting guys like him.

  3. #528
    Artificial Intelligence wintermute's Avatar
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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    Wasn't Donatas projected top 5 early on last year in the mock drafts or am I thinking of someone else. I remember Vesley and another foreign born player both ranked highly. Neither came out.
    Yup, projected top 5 last year, now Chad Ford is projecting that he'll drop all the way to the 20s. Weird isn't it? It's not that he regressed - he put up solid minutes for his Italian team, and his offensive efficiency stats are up across the board. The huge red flag it seems is his apparent laziness and lack of passion for the game.

    Now, the last thing I'd want us to do is draft a lazy player. On the other hand, at #15 the guys we'd be looking at are likely role players. Is it worth taking a shot at a clearly talented but underperforming player? I don't really know either.

    Quote Originally Posted by Gamble1 View Post
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    The problem with Donatas is that it may be very hard to bring him over the U.S. I would be cautious with drafting guys like him.
    Valanciunas is one prospect with a problematic buyout. DX reports that he still has a 3 year contract with his Euro club with no buyout. Something could still be negotiated of course, but it's bound to be a headache. I've not read anything regarding Donatas' contract.

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  5. #529

    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    Valanciunas is one prospect with a problematic buyout. DX reports that he still has a 3 year contract with his Euro club with no buyout. Something could still be negotiated of course, but it's bound to be a headache. I've not read anything regarding Donatas' contract.
    I could of swore I read that Donatas italian club was going to lock him up long term and that he didn't have a big interest on coming over to the US right away.

  6. #530

    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Its so hard to find Euro information and I can't find where I got that info from but I am pretty sure it was Donatas. Right now it looks like he has option clause after each year to enter the NBA. He signed a 2 year contract with an option on the 3rd in 2009.

    Edit: My fault. It was actually Nikola Mirotic not Donatas.
    Last edited by Gamble1; 05-24-2011 at 11:14 AM.

  7. #531
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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    Yup, projected top 5 last year, now Chad Ford is projecting that he'll drop all the way to the 20s. Weird isn't it? It's not that he regressed - he put up solid minutes for his Italian team, and his offensive efficiency stats are up across the board. The huge red flag it seems is his apparent laziness and lack of passion for the game.
    The laziness and lack of passion was there last year as well, I think the drop is more due to him not advancing in the areas that most wanted him to, like his rebounding and defense.

    regressing is bad, but going another year and not progressing is bad as well especially since the NBA draft deals a lot with potential

  8. #532

    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Really? View Post
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    The laziness and lack of passion was there last year as well, I think the drop is more due to him not advancing in the areas that most wanted him to, like his rebounding and defense.

    regressing is bad, but going another year and not progressing is bad as well especially since the NBA draft deals a lot with potential
    Maybe some practices with Hans would get some fire in his belly.

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  10. #533

    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    I dont know if he can play Center at the NBA level vs guys like Bynum Howard ect. the bigger guys. But I could see him as a Ben Wallace at the NBA level. Or he could be Hasheem Tabeat i dont know his attuite so it is a tuff player to judge. . But no way he becomes a Pacer he will be long gone.
    If Ben Wallace can guard Shaq in his prime, then I think Biyombo has a shot against Dwight Howard. I don't think a bigger, longer and more athletic version of Ben Wallace will have as many problems with a lesser center.

    I'd really like to see him next to Tyler. I think getting a defensive and athletic PF to put next to Roy is overrated. Roy's main problems are on offense and that type of PF isn't going to help him there.

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  12. #534
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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Ballerzfan View Post
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    Don't remember reading anywhere about questioning his athleticism, but his desire or enjoyment of the game instead. If you do any searches for him you'll see some great athleticism for a 7 footer.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFqK-YXlsHs

    From the block he goes over each shoulder with a hook shot using both right and left hands, uses the glass from both sides of the block, soft jump shot going either way and just look at the strong one-step dunk at 4:42 in the video. Shoots the 3. Puts the ball on the floor with either hand. 21 years old. To me he's the epitome of high risk-high reward we need.
    u are thinking of Dontas not Jonas two very different players. Jonas a power post player and Dontas a stretch 4. Jonas is a stud power post player but his contract situation isn't good he will still likely go 5-8 range and still fouls way to much and people question his athletic ability. Dontas people question his attitude me being one of them but the kid is really skilled will likely go 10-15 range.

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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    If Ben Wallace can guard Shaq in his prime, then I think Biyombo has a shot against Dwight Howard. I don't think a bigger, longer and more athletic version of Ben Wallace will have as many problems with a lesser center.

    I'd really like to see him next to Tyler. I think getting a defensive and athletic PF to put next to Roy is overrated. Roy's main problems are on offense and that type of PF isn't going to help him there.
    I just think he has a much higher shot of busting over a guy like Kanter. He is my type of guy long athletic defender but it is a moot point he will be long gone b4 the pacers pick.

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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    If Ben Wallace can guard Shaq in his prime,
    Maybe I'm reading too much into your use of the word "guard", but I have a very different memory of this. Ben Wallace couldn't even guard Jermaine O'Neal 1 on 1 in the mid 2000's. It wasn't until the Pistons put Rasheed Wallace on JO (with Ben moving back to where he truly dominates: As a help defender) that JO struggled mightily against them.

    Ben was a phenomenal defender, but I distinctly remember Jermaine doing well against him one on one, and then getting shut down when Ben was the help defender to Rasheed, who guarded JO on the ball.

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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Maybe I'm reading too much into your use of the word "guard", but I have a very different memory of this. Ben Wallace couldn't even guard Jermaine O'Neal 1 on 1 in the mid 2000's. It wasn't until the Pistons put Rasheed Wallace on JO (with Ben moving back to where he truly dominates: As a help defender) that JO struggled mightily against them.

    Ben was a phenomenal defender, but I distinctly remember Jermaine doing well against him one on one, and then getting shut down when Ben was the help defender to Rasheed, who guarded JO on the ball.
    This is correct now at least(i cant speak for Shaqs prime) Ben is a great defender but he isn't that great at 1 0n 1 post defense he is like Marcus Camby a really great help defender.

  17. #538
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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Also, Ben Wallace struggled with long guys who were fairly quick, which is what JO was. Ben can body up anybody and is a terrific, physical man-to-man post defender. I really thought that Pistons team was such a well put together team. Every player in their rotation fit well with one another. That is the style of team we were during our prime years in the 1990's.

    We were a different team in the early to mid 2000's, but we had several good higher end players. I think that is the formula our front office is trying to build. We aren't going to be successful paying players $15M per year. We will never be a contender that way. That is why they are building a deep team that fits extremely well together, but it will take time for us to gel. Ben Wallace was Dale Davis part II. Those are important role players on contending teams and we cannot underestimate their importance. Nobody underestimates DD's importance to our team for all of those years.

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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Trey Thompkins may have the most polished low post game game scoring wise in this draft. He def will be available @ 15. I favor him over Faried.

  19. #540

    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Anyone have Chad Ford's Mock Draft 3.0 ?

  20. #541
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    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Maybe I'm reading too much into your use of the word "guard", but I have a very different memory of this. Ben Wallace couldn't even guard Jermaine O'Neal 1 on 1 in the mid 2000's. It wasn't until the Pistons put Rasheed Wallace on JO (with Ben moving back to where he truly dominates: As a help defender) that JO struggled mightily against them.

    Ben was a phenomenal defender, but I distinctly remember Jermaine doing well against him one on one, and then getting shut down when Ben was the help defender to Rasheed, who guarded JO on the ball.

    You are 100% regarding JO. But against Shaq, Ben did as well as anybody. I think the reality is can Bismack guard quicker players. He does not have the quickness of Serge, but he has more girth.

    Bismack may very well be a better center than a PF.

  21. #542

    Default Re: 2011 Prospect Scouting Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by immortality View Post
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    Anyone have Chad Ford's Mock Draft 3.0 ?
    its up in the jimmer thread. We pick jimmer, try to act surprised.

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