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Thread: How would you build a strong second unit?

  1. #1
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default How would you build a strong second unit?

    I don't really want to talk about tonight's game in this thread... we played tough and lost to a really good team with a lot of experience in their house on opening night. It happens.

    What interests me, though, is that we've had several games recently where the game seemed to turn while we had a relatively weak second unit playing. Tonight we played Solomon Jones, James Posey, Paul George, and TJ Ford together for an extended bit of time. That unit seems lightweight to me. I like each one of those guys personally and as basketball players, but I don't see them ever gelling into an outstanding offensive or defensive unit. So how could we fix it?

    I have two suggestions. First, I'd move Dunleavy to the bench and add Rush to the starting lineup as soon as Rush gets back. I like Dunleavy, but he's really an offensive player more than a defensive one. And there simply aren't enough touches in the starting lineup for him. He's hardly ever had double-digit shot attempts this year, and he seems to be running out of gas by the end of the game. As a starter, Dunleavy's forced to defend outside of his position while also taking a backseat on offense. Recipe for disaster... let the guy run the show on the second unit while being paired with a defensive wing in Paul George.

    The other big change I'd make is to promote Tyler out of the doghouse and into the backup PF role. I thought the people calling for him to start were crazy, but I think it's equally crazy that he didn't play at all tonight. If he's healthy (and supposedly he is), he'd be a great fit for this backup unit that seems to play in the late third / early fourth. That group needs a spark plug, and Tyler could be it. Let him beat up on the other team's backups. It's the perfect role for him... I don't understand the hesitation.

    So you've got McRoberts/George/Dunleavy in that unit... I'd normally say that Foster should play in front of Solo, but Mr. Jones struck up some solid conversation tonight and I'd be intrigued to see if it can continue. Or you could play Josh at the backup Center role... he had by far the fewest minutes of the starters.

    I'd prefer AJ as the backup PG to TJ, but TJ did a lot of good things on the court tonight so I won't scream a ton about it, especially if TPTB can move him before February.

    Basically, then, I'd like to see a second unit of Solo/Tyler/Dunleavy/George/TJ. That's got some defensive prowess, some offensive punch, and is much more likely to give us energy than the crew that tried to make it happen tonight.

    Thoughts?
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  3. #2
    Call me Kauffie Kaufman's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    not to minimize your question, but honestly? time, experience, and gel.
    "Sometimes, when you look Andy in the eyes, you get a feeling somebody else is driving." -- David Letterman

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    Member hoosierguy's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    AJ and Tyler absolutely need to get on the floor.

    Coach Whiteburns is going to kill two promising careers if someone doesn't intervene (cough Larry cough).

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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Put Dunleavy on the bench and start Geroge/rush
    Play Tyler and Jeff

  7. #5
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaufman View Post
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    not to minimize your question, but honestly? time, experience, and gel.
    How much time and experience should we give Posey before we start asking something from him?
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  9. #6

    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    I'd Switch TJ out for AJ, obviously. Even though he played decently well tonight. Price isn't turnover prone, and a better perimeter shooter.

    And there's another reason, as you suggested, I'd replace Dun with Rush, and have Dun in the second unit. Dun and AJ play well together, TJ and Dun..not so much...

    I'd keep George, obviously. He's the one good one. :P

    And I agree about Hans. Pretty obvious.

    I think I'd go with Jeff over Solo. He'd at least rebound.

    So It'd be AJ/Dun/George/Hans/Foster

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    Member jeffg-body's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    I think meshing starters with several second unit players will get better results because we need leadership in those times. Maybe Posey could provide that, but I also agree that I'd much rather see TJ is the suit and AJ as that second unit PG.

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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    We desperately need another scorer in the front court for when Roy sits.

    If Tyler ever figures out how to consistently score in this league, problem solved. Otherwise............

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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    I'd love to get another PF in the starting line-up so McBob can come off the bench. I think he'd be a tremendous energy guy off the bench. He'll get you points, he'll get you some rebounds, and he'll scrap and hustle.

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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    We desperately need another scorer in the front court for when Roy sits.

    If Tyler ever figures out how to consistently score in this league, problem solved. Otherwise............
    Another?

    You think we've got scorers in that rotation?

  14. #11
    crazy shinaniganz BringJackBack's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    TJ
    AJ
    Dunleavy
    Hansbrough
    Foster

    That's how I'd do it. Start George I guess by default.. Dunleavy shouldn't be closing games.. He's too prone to screw things up.. sad face.

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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    It's only one game, but what I saw from Posey tonight suggested that he really was only the price to pay to get Darren Collison. Real slow.

    I like your second unit, Anthem. If TJ's not around, then sure, use Price, but I'd like to see some more TJ after tonight's effort.

  16. #13
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sookie View Post
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    I'd Switch TJ out for AJ, obviously. Even though he played decently well tonight. Price isn't turnover prone, and a better perimeter shooter.

    And there's another reason, as you suggested, I'd replace Dun with Rush, and have Dun in the second unit. Dun and AJ play well together, TJ and Dun..not so much...

    I'd keep George, obviously. He's the one good one. :P

    And I agree about Hans. Pretty obvious.

    I think I'd go with Jeff over Solo. He'd at least rebound.

    So It'd be AJ/Dun/George/Hans/Foster
    I agree that I'd prefer AJ, but I've given up hope on that lost cause.

    The Foster-v-Solo thing is a fair point as well, if you assume that Foster's physically up for it. He seems to be up one day and down the next... I assumed that he sat because he wasn't feeling good today. I agree, if he's available he'd be my preference.
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  17. #14
    Flipped Off The Refs Larry Staverman's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Playing Solo or Foster and Posey together up front gives you no post offense.

    You pass around the perimeter and then someone goes one on one and forces up a contested shot.

    Expect O.B. to stick with this rotation.

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  19. #15
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    To me the starting unit should be Collison,DJ(until Rush gets back), Danny,Mcbob,Hibbert and the second unit should be Ford,Dunleavy,PG,Tyler and Solo, then I would have AJ as the third string point guard and Foster as the 3rd back up center.

    I could also pull a JOB move and play AJ at the point with TJ at the two sometimes(to give a breathing to Dunleavy)

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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by LoneGranger33 View Post
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    It's only one game, but what I saw from Posey tonight suggested that he really was only the price to pay to get Darren Collison. Real slow.
    I at least think Posey could have a role in terms of finishing out games. He made a couple of good plays in the preseason in close ballgames to help seal victories.

  21. #17
    Play McRoberts and Price! BRushWithDeath's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Day-V View Post
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    I'd love to get another PF in the starting line-up so McBob can come off the bench. I think he'd be a tremendous energy guy off the bench. He'll get you points, he'll get you some rebounds, and he'll scrap and hustle.
    In my opinion, he looked like the perfect starting PF for this team for all the reasons you mentioned.
    "I had to take her down like Chris Brown."

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  23. #18
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sookie View Post
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    Another?

    You think we've got scorers in that rotation?
    He's saying besides Roy.

    Regardless, I think it's fair to consider Tyler a scorer.
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  24. #19
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Day-V View Post
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    I at least think Posey could have a role in terms of finishing out games. He made a couple of good plays in the preseason in close ballgames to help seal victories.
    Sure. I like Posey, he's savvy. But his ideal role is playing with the starters at the end of the game, not playing with the scrubs in the late third quarter. What's he going to accomplish there? We need some more firepower from Solomon Jones' frontcourt partner.
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  25. #20

    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    He's saying besides Roy.

    Regardless, I think it's fair to consider Tyler a scorer.
    Roy's not in the second unit? (And unfortunatly, nor is Tyler)

    I don't think there's anyone that can score, perhaps TJ on a good day, in the second unit.

    Or was he talking about post players?

    Also, I'd cut Jim O'brien and make Posey the coach.

  26. #21
    Over the pond ballism's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Idk about Tyler, if he's not in game shape as JOB says, then he won't make us stronger short term. Sure he needs play time long term, but that doesnt make the bench stronger right away.

    We just need more talent. We can switch these guys all we want, that's about the worst 6-15 in the league.

  27. #22
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Sure. I like Posey, he's savvy. But his ideal role is playing with the starters at the end of the game, not playing with the scrubs in the late third quarter.
    My thoughts exactly.


    Quote Originally Posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
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    In my opinion, he looked like the perfect starting PF for this team for all the reasons you mentioned.
    Oh, don't get me wrong, I love him in the starting line-up, too. I think he has played great so far in the preseason and tonight. What I meant is that I'd love to somehow get a PF that could start alongside Roy so Josh could help solidify the bench play.

    Hell, can we just clone him? That'd be fantastic.

  28. #23

    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    we have enough offense out there with collison, granger, and hibbert that i really don't understand the thought process of putting dunleavy out there as well when that does nothing but hurt our perimeter defense while not affecting our offense one bit. with the players currently on the roster my lineups would be:

    1st unit:
    pg- collison
    sg- george
    sf- granger
    pf- mcroberts
    c- hibbert

    2nd unit:
    pg- price
    sg- rush
    sf- dunleavy
    pf- hansbrough
    c- varnado ;-)

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  30. #24

    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Day-V View Post
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    Oh, don't get me wrong, I love in the starting line-up, too. I think he has played great so far in the preseason and tonight. What I meant is that I'd love to somehow get a PF that could start alongside Roy so Josh could help solidify the bench play.

    Hell, can we just clone him? That'd be fantastic.
    I think Josh is much better for the starters. He plays good defense (needed) is a good passer, and is simply a role player.

    The bench needs someone who can score. Not another energy guy.

  31. #25
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: How would you build a strong second unit?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sookie View Post
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    Roy's not in the second unit? (And unfortunatly, nor is Tyler)
    Go back and read his post again. He said we need a big man who can score for when Roy sits. "Another" is clearly referring to "another big man besides Roy."

    The Pacers have two big men who are threats to score the ball. It makes sense to play one in the starting lineup and one with the backups.

    I don't think there's anyone that can score, perhaps TJ on a good day, in the second unit.
    Which would be solved by adding Tyler and Dunleavy to the second unit.

    Honestly? For the next four games, I'd start D.Jones and see what happens. That's the closest he'll get to his past successful role.
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