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Thread: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

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    Default Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    http://www.indystar.com/article/2011...acers-workouts

    Mike Wells, IndyStar.com

    Vogel, whom Bird called the front-runner last week, and most of his assistant coaches will not be in attendance today.

    Bird doesn't want to send the wrong message to other potential candidates about Vogel's status. Vogel didn't attend last week's pre-draft event in Chicago with Bird, either.

    "I'm talking to some people and I'm talking to (Vogel)," Bird said. "When these guys come in, I don't want them to think he's going to be the coach."

    ...

    When will Bird make the decision on the coach? That's to be determined. He said he is taking his time with the process.

    One possible candidate -- former Pacers assistant Mike Brown -- is no longer on the market. He agreed to become the Los Angeles Lakers coach Wednesday.

    Bird, who is tight-lipped about the process, has talked to several candidates on the phone but said he has not interviewed any outside candidates in person.

    Vogel has had several conversations with Bird and also will get the last interview during the search.

    ...

    Vogel will be asked to upgrade his coaching staff if he expects to earn the permanent job.

    ...

    Longtime NBA coach Rick Adelman and Dallas assistant Dwane Casey are other candidates in whom the Pacers have expressed interest.

    ...

    Pacers owner Herb Simon likely would have to pay more money for Adelman than Vogel or Casey.

    Casey remains on the Pacers' radar, but they have yet to talk to him because the Mavericks are still in the playoffs.

    Casey, a respected longtime assistant, is also in the running for jobs in Houston and Golden State.

    "Dwane Casey would be a great hire for Houston, Golden State or Indiana," Mavericks coach Rick Carlisle told the Dallas Morning News earlier this week. "His communication skills, experience and work ethic would be a tremendous asset to any franchise."

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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    I'm talking to some people and I'm talking to (Vogel)," Bird said. "When these guys come in, I don't want them to think he's going to be the coach."
    That easily could be taken out of context.

    Am I wrong to assume that the longer this goes on the less likely it is that Vogel will be the coach?

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Vogel will be asked to upgrade his coaching staff if he expects to earn the permanent job.
    This pretty much eliminates any concerns I had about this coaching search. If it's either Vogel with experienced assistants, or Adelman / Casey, I'm not worried either way.

    Before, I was worried that we've only seen Vogel and his staff during a "nothing to lose", post O'Brien euphoria. And he / his staff was bound to show the lack of experience next year.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by ballism View Post
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    This pretty much eliminates any concerns I had about this coaching search. If it's either Vogel with experienced assistants, or Adelman / Casey, I'm not worried either way.

    Before, I was worried that we've only seen Vogel and his staff during a "nothing to lose", post O'Brien euphoria. And he / his staff was bound to show the lack of experience next year.
    Made me wonder about cost though. Is hiring Adelman cheaper than hiring Vogel and an Associate Head coach type?

    Speaking of Adelman, I heard JMV say he doesn't have an agent and would be negotiating for himself, I found this interesting. Wonder how that effect his cost.

    I wonder if they think Dwayne Casey would need an experienced staff, too?

    I completely agree though, you need to get a really vet savvy assistant coaching group in here, I think you have enough young guys that this would be pretty valuable.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Yep more phone interviews ......

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    That easily could be taken out of context.

    Am I wrong to assume that the longer this goes on the less likely it is that Vogel will be the coach?
    I don't think so. I think Bird just knows that Vogel isn't going anywhere, so why not do your due diligence. The worst outcome for the management is if Bird rushes with this, signs Vogel right away and the team fails badly next year. That would make the management look bad, as if they were making decisions based on emotion.

    I think Bird takes pride in being calm and thorough in all his management decisions.

    If Vogel was in high demand from other teams, and Bird still took it slow, then sure, I'd think Bird doesn't want him that much.
    Now, I think it's just Bird being Bird.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    My gut tells me it won't be Adelman. I doubt he'll want to coach here - just doesn't seem a good fit for him or the Pacers. I would put Brian Shaw as a more likely head coach here and Casey

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    Made me wonder about cost though. Is hiring Adelman cheaper than hiring Vogel and an Associate Head coach type?

    Speaking of Adelman, I heard JMV say he doesn't have an agent and would be negotiating for himself, I found this interesting. Wonder how that effect his cost.

    I wonder if they think Dwayne Casey would need an experienced staff, too?

    I completely agree though, you need to get a really vet savvy assistant coaching group in here, I think you have enough young guys that this would be pretty valuable.
    Interesting. Sounds like someone who will take the team he likes the most. As opposed to making the good career move / squeezing out as much $ as possible / getting the biggest job.
    Pure speculation of course - maybe he just doesn't like agents. Has he had one before?

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    That easily could be taken out of context.

    Am I wrong to assume that the longer this goes on the less likely it is that Vogel will be the coach?
    Funny, I was thinking the opposite.
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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    I think the fact that Adelman doesn't have an agent working for him, would make it that much more appealing to Bird. It would be more like a good ol' boy handshake agreement between Bird and Adelman, without the sleazy lawyer types being involved. Bird seems to be the kind of guy who likes to avoid the red tape whenever possible.

    Not saying that Adelman's lack of an agent would be a deciding factor, but I can see the scenario being a good fit for Larry's personality.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    How do you go about building a new coaching staff when you've spent your entire NBA career with O'Brien?

    Who do you ask to be on your staff?

    It seems like a big challenge. I'd love to know who'd work for Vogel.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    That easily could be taken out of context.

    Am I wrong to assume that the longer this goes on the less likely it is that Vogel will be the coach?
    Is this driven by the Mav's run?
    Is Larry's relationship w/ Carlisle swaying him towards Casey?
    "Larry Bird: You are Officially On the Clock! (3/24/08)"
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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    How do you go about building a new coaching staff when you've spent your entire NBA career with O'Brien?

    Who do you ask to be on your staff?

    It seems like a big challenge. I'd love to know who'd work for Vogel.
    My thought too, you beat me to it. I wonder if there are any other guys who were active under Pitino that might be a "Vogel guy".

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    My gut tells me it won't be Adelman. I doubt he'll want to coach here - just doesn't seem a good fit for him or the Pacers. I would put Brian Shaw as a more likely head coach here and Casey
    I keep forgetting that Brian Shaw was a teammate of Larry Bird when he was drafted by the Celtics.

    I like Shaw. He was such a clutch player. He killed the Pacers multiple time during the playoffs when he was with Boston, Orlando, and the Lakers so it would be nice to have him on our side for a change.
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    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Would Shaw try to bring in the Triangle? I don't understand it enough to know if it would fit the personnel here.

    It seems like it requires a low post threat to operate efficiently, which would mean you'd have to have Roy or I guess Hansbrough on the court at all times, as currently constructed?

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Only thing I took from this is that Casey's a bigger player in the search than I thought. One thing though, I don't think they're gonna make a hire that I'm NOT happy with.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by Ozwalt72 View Post
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    One thing though, I don't think they're gonna make a hire that I'm NOT happy with.
    True, but that might be tainted by who was here as the last non interim coach.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    I'm curious to see what Golden State and Houston do. That could have an impact.

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    Artificial Intelligence wintermute's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    How do you go about building a new coaching staff when you've spent your entire NBA career with O'Brien?

    Who do you ask to be on your staff?

    It seems like a big challenge. I'd love to know who'd work for Vogel.
    Simple enough. As pointed out by JB24 in the other thread, management (i.e. Bird) simply selects new assistants for him.

    In fact, that's how I read Mike Wells' statement that Vogel needs to be willing to upgrade his staff. The subtext there is that Vogel must accept the assistants that Bird wants him to hire.

    As to the who... well there are usually more candidates than openings for head coach. There's more than a few former head coaches out there who probably want to get back into the mix, even if only as lead assistants. Do your job well, like Dwane Casey or Lawrence Frank did, and you get mentioned for all subsequent openings.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Does Vogel have the pull to get good assistant coaches?

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    The longer this goes on, the great chance we stick with Vogel. Houston and Golden State are gonna snatch up Shaw or Casey. Bird will essentially let the other teams dictate his choice it seems.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by ballism View Post
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    I don't think so. I think Bird just knows that Vogel isn't going anywhere, so why not do your due diligence. The worst outcome for the management is if Bird rushes with this, signs Vogel right away and the team fails badly next year. That would make the management look bad, as if they were making decisions based on emotion.

    I think Bird takes pride in being calm and thorough in all his management decisions.

    If Vogel was in high demand from other teams, and Bird still took it slow, then sure, I'd think Bird doesn't want him that much.
    Now, I think it's just Bird being Bird.

    How can Bird be slower in making decisions than Donnie Walsh was.

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    As to the who... well there are usually more candidates than openings for head coach. There's more than a few former head coaches out there who probably want to get back into the mix, even if only as lead assistants. Do your job well, like Dwane Casey or Lawrence Frank did, and you get mentioned for all subsequent openings.
    As long as your team is a Finals contender.

    You don't hear of many assistants from average teams getting head jobs. If a coach is looking for a spring board to a head coaching position he'll pick a contender not Indiana.
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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Don't really know much about the coaches, but anyone interested in this Brian Shaw Character... working under Phil Jackson, and working directly with Kobe has to mean something...

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    Default Re: Bird has talked to 'several candidates' on the phone, only Vogel in person

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    How can Bird be slower in making decisions than Donnie Walsh was.
    I'm not sure how Walsh is related to that post?

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