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Thread: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

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    Call me Kauffie Kaufman's Avatar
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    Default Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    I'm astonished nobody has brought this up but its been something I've been thinking about for some time now... I don't post here much anymore but I read daily.

    For those that don't know me, I've been a fan since 1989. I think that is the year Indy Geezer was born. I grew up with Chuck, Reggie, Rik, Detlef, Vern Fleming, Dale. I miss those guys.

    So I have been feeling disappointed in Danny since the all star appearance and winning the most improved player award.

    It started back when he posted on here a few years ago to recruit for his basketball camp. I was excited to see him reaching out, but then equally disappointed when we never heard from him again. We've seen others reach out and become involved, Mark Boyle, and indirectly Roy. I was hoping for more involvement from him but I felt like he really just used this board as a free advertisement alone. There was little give back to us.

    I have lived out of Indianapolis since 2005. Where I currently live, I hear the name Antoine Walker commonly associated with Danny. Good guy with good basketball skills who all too commonly settles for the three point shot. All other skills forgotten about.

    Also, this summer was a major disappointment for me with regards to Danny:
    1) World Championships. As kstat eluded to, great honor to be named to the team even if he was riding the pine. But the bigger thing that I expected was for it to light a fire under him and in his heart. I really expected him to come out this preseason and really light it up in every dimension. We've read that Danny often blows preseason off, but given his summer, I think this was the preseason to really lead by example. His teammates and coaches all watched and know what happened to him this summer and I think he should have something to prove to them, if not himself. I really expected him to come out against Memphis and two people involved in the summer games - Haddadi and Rudy Gay.
    I know it is just preseason, but this is a team that needs to start winning and feeling the importance of what winning is. And the tone is set by the leader who SHOULD be Danny, but I'm not sure if he really is inside the locker room.

    2) Neither here nor there, but I didn't care for the deodorant comment. Didn't reflect well on the Pacers nor himself.

    Again, I'm not privy to the local market media and I might be off on my thoughts about Danny and his attitude. I've not forgotten the day when he busted up his teeth a few years ago, but would he do it again?

    I've noticed on this very board people suggesting that Danny is not off limits to a trade. This never would have been spoken of 1-2 years ago, especially here. Why has this attitude arisen?

    Again, I know it is preseason and there is a lot of bball to be played. But these have been some of my thoughts for the last one year or so.

    I also know there are some major league Danny apologists on this board (I know who you are and you know who you are), so please don't drown out my thoughts, I'd like an intelligent discussion. Please no insults. And no, I don't want this to turn into a discussion about JOB either, please.
    "Sometimes, when you look Andy in the eyes, you get a feeling somebody else is driving." -- David Letterman

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    I just don't believe you can read much into pre-season, especially with Danny. I also think he was injured for much of last year which contributed to some of his playing woes. I seem to remember a stretch late when he had seemed to get healthy and his play became a lot better, we also won some games in that stretch... go figure.

    Wait and see approach. He should be healthy now, he has better talent around him, this is the make or break year for him. Too early to speculate.
    "As a bearded man, i was very disappointed in Love. I am gathering other bearded men to discuss the status of Kevin Love's beard. I am motioning that it must be shaved."

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    Call me Kauffie Kaufman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Thanks for your comments IMF, I appreciate it. I think you might be right with regards to early season but I'm not sure you actually read what I wrote?

    I think it is really important for Danny to step up during the preseason - especially for all of the new players and given how disappointing his offseason bball participation was.
    Last edited by Kaufman; 10-12-2010 at 10:11 PM.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    I'll wait until the season before I judge Danny. BTW, I think Danny is showing good leadership skills as he called up Brandon Rush and Lance Stephenson and got on them for their off the court issues. Its still a wait and see approach.
    Last edited by Mr_Smith; 10-13-2010 at 12:58 PM.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Two thoughts about Danny: [1] Danny isn't a disappointment. Danny is playing in a league that knows who he is and what he wants to do. Each night he faces the best defender and sometimes a double team. Danny hasn't had a lot of support because of a team that is often injured, without experience, and seldom consistent. I think this is one reason Danny settles for perimeter shots. It is much easier to catch the ball from the outlet and shoot than drop your shoulder and drive. This is something Danny could learn from Reggie. Reggie didn't always shoot the three. He would often pump fake his defender, drive, and finish with a nasty running floater or take a trip to the charity stripe. That could be identified as an issue with aggressiveness. However aggressiveness is the result of confidence, and confidence is the result of team play (otherwise its foolish arrogance). [2] Danny is the product of hype. I am not putting Danny down or calling him a bad player with a good name. Danny can be an all-star level player. Think of it like this, when you or I discover something good that we never heard of or knew of our initial response is to think it is great. Then we begin to handle it and look at it, and we notice a flaw here and a weakness there. All the sudden it is not "great" though we continue to hold it to such a standard.

    Danny Granger is not Kevin Durrant. I am not disappointed, because I think he plays hard and leads well. I wish he were not apart of a system that encourages him to settle for perimeter shots, but I believe the improvement of Roy and Josh, the rejuvenation of Mike and A.J. , and the acquisition of Darren will create confidence and cause aggressiveness.

    Wait for the regular season.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    My disappointment with Danny has been strictly on-court.

    He's young, he's lived almost entirely in the US, so I don't expect everything he says to be wise and cosmopolitan. He is a smart guy, though, and I'm sure he is still learning. But, that is all off-court stuff, and bottom line...I don't care.

    On the court, I've been disappointed in his tendency to prefer the 3pt shot to driving the hoop. I do think some of that tendency was related to lack of power in his legs last year, as he dealt with the medical issues he had then. A look at his 08-09 stats vs his 09-10 stats shows a decided drop off in FG percentage, FTAs and blocks...all attributable to not having his legs back to form, I think.

    I just hope that with renewed health, he returns to a more '06-'09 style, and doesn't turn into a habitual high-volume chucker.

    As far as a leadership role, I don't know that I ever expected much from him there, except for setting an example. I really don't know who the vocal leader in that locker room might be.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by kester99 View Post
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    My disappointment with Danny has been strictly on-court.

    He's young, he's lived almost entirely in the US, so I don't expect everything he says to be wise and cosmopolitan. He is a smart guy, though, and I'm sure he is still learning. But, that is all off-court stuff, and bottom line...I don't care.

    On the court, I've been disappointed in his tendency to prefer the 3pt shot to driving the hoop. I do think some of that tendency was related to lack of power in his legs last year, as he dealt with the medical issues he had then. A look at his 08-09 stats vs his 09-10 stats shows a decided drop off in FG percentage, FTAs and blocks...all attributable to not having his legs back to form, I think.

    I just hope that with renewed health, he returns to a more '06-'09 style, and doesn't turn into a habitual high-volume chucker.

    As far as a leadership role, I don't know that I ever expected much from him there, except for setting an example. I really don't know who the vocal leader in that locker room might be.
    the guy is like a genius he scored perfect on the ACT

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    ryheathco and kesty - awesome posts. different way of looking at it and I agree with both of you guys. Danny has the abilities.

    Should we have seen more of it this preseason though? Where is the fire from what happened this past summer?

    Kesty you say "I don't know that I ever expected much from him there" - I think I did. And I think this is disappointing to me.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaufman View Post
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    Kesty you say "I don't know that I ever expected much from him there" - I think I did. And I think this is disappointing to me.
    He's just always struck me as pretty laid back, except on the court. So I don't know if he has the personality that would guide / focus a locker room.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Last season was a little disappointing. He needs to stop jacking so many threes up early in the shot clock, drive to the hoop more, and learn what an assist is. Honestly, I think that is all correctable. I'm more concerned about his injuries affecting his game than his actual game.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by kester99 View Post
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    He's just always struck me as pretty laid back, except on the court. So I don't know if he has the personality that would guide / focus a locker room.
    agreed.

    let me take it to another level though - he's a competitor and scorer. how can you be soooo laissez faire after this summer? humble pie is one thing, but where is the fire?
    "Sometimes, when you look Andy in the eyes, you get a feeling somebody else is driving." -- David Letterman

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Just like we were/all disappointed, I think Danny is just as, if not more, disappointed in our teams these past years. He's had alot of injuries that have messed him up last season. However, three weeks or so after he recovered from his injury he played quite phenomenal and I hope that is the player he will be all this year.

    I'd rather take "Antoine Walker" that will stay here no matter how tough things have been rather than Carmello Anthony or Lebron James who have had everything given to them every single year and they still have no loyalty and they don't care.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Where is the fire? We have to wait and see, I think. Preseason may not tell us much.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    So you expected Danny Granger to play like he did in his All-Star season even though he had a torn foot that made it pretty much impossible to play with the same intensity. Never mind that when he came back from injury he played with that exact intensity to finish out the season.

    Granger isn't a jump out of the Gym athlete going full on the entire game, he has whats called old man moves. Infact there are many blogs/articles about this just google it. So you belly ache over the fact that he didn't show up and dominate team USA at the same position Durant plays who was anointed the day he showed up. After all he was the NBA's leading scorer. Granger was most likely the insurance policy for Durant.

    Then you're upset that Granger didn't go out and score 30 on Memphis to throw it in Rudy Gay's face in the first practice game of the season. News flash veterans don't use preseason to make a statement. Its practice, its exhibition, its figuring out line ups and rotations. Most veterans are just trying to get through preseason with out getting injured, and they certainly aren't going to come out and give the opposing scouts a fresh look at their game this year when the games dont' count.

    Its amazing how many have completely 180'd on Granger without really looking at the context of events and situations. Injured for most of the season, Team USA wasn't built to utilize his type of game, and its practice....

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    I know it is not all based on this current preseason, but I will say that Danny has some of the worst preseasons of any players ever...his worst ever (I believe) came during what was eventually his All-Star season. For some reason he doesn't do any good in the preseason, but when games start to count, his productivity, attitude on the court, his activity on the court, etc completely changes--plus his shots start falling once the regular season begins. I'm never too worried about Danny anymore as I know when it counts in the regular season, he'll go back to normal form of being the star player we know him to be. It is odd, but it is what it is.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    So you expected Danny Granger to play like he did in his All-Star season even though he had a torn foot that made it pretty much impossible to play with the same intensity. Never mind that when he came back from injury he played with that exact intensity to finish out the season.

    Granger isn't a jump out of the Gym athlete going full on the entire game, he has whats called old man moves. Infact there are many blogs/articles about this just google it. So you belly ache over the fact that he didn't show up and dominate team USA at the same position Durant plays who was anointed the day he showed up. After all he was the NBA's leading scorer. Granger was most likely the insurance policy for Durant.

    Then you're upset that Granger didn't go out and score 30 on Memphis to throw it in Rudy Gay's face in the first practice game of the season. News flash veterans don't use preseason to make a statement. Its practice, its exhibition, its figuring out line ups and rotations. Most veterans are just trying to get through preseason with out getting injured, and they certainly aren't going to come out and give the opposing scouts a fresh look at their game this year when the games dont' count.

    Its amazing how many have completely 180'd on Granger without really looking at the context of events and situations. Injured for most of the season, Team USA wasn't built to utilize his type of game, and its practice....
    Really, this misrepresents what has been said, and seems quite rude. News flash.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Alot of you talk about the 3pt chucking last season and wanting him to drive more, I get that but remember the foot really effected his ability to put it on the floor and even shoot, heck he was blocked alot more last year as well. He was trying to be as effective as he could be given the limit his foot placed on his game. I remember that his Plantar Fascia finally tore completely when drove it into the paint and planted to switch directions and dropped the ball and immediately fell over.

    I'm really quite impressed that he was able to still average 24pts a game with such a limitation.

    You all should really place your frustration with JOB who refused to sit him out for the first month of the season to let his foot heal up.
    Last edited by graphic-er; 10-12-2010 at 11:18 PM.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Danny never plays well during the preseason. He is actually one player that I am not worried about. We all know what we're going to get from him: SCORING.

    It would be nice that he steps his defence up a little. I know his defence isnt all that bad, but it could get better.

    I wouldnt worry too much about Granger. Hes a consistent 25 ppg scorer
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by kester99 View Post
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    Really, this misrepresents what has been said, and seems quite rude. News flash.
    No it doesn't, and sometimes you gotta be rude.

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    No it doesn't, and sometimes you gotta be rude.
    No one was bellyaching or upset (your words). They were talking about areas where they'd hoped or expected to see more from Danny. And no one even came close to saying they were disappointed with his Team USA showing, though Kauffy did imply that Danny himself might be disappointed in it. And your points about his injury and the preseason had already been made by three different people, including me. We said pretty much what you said.

    So, yes, you did misrepresent the tone, and the words used, in this discussion.

    As for needing to be rude, you are wrong (and possibly the cause of the death of Western civilization), if you feel the need to take a civil discussion to another (lower) level.

    And i'm done with the back-and-forth, because we should not go to that level.
    Last edited by kester99; 10-12-2010 at 11:39 PM.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaufman View Post
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    I also know there are some major league Danny apologists on this board (I know who you are and you know who you are), so please don't drown out my thoughts, I'd like an intelligent discussion. Please no insults. And no, I don't want this to turn into a discussion about JOB either, please.
    Kesty, this is why I don't post much anymore - fear of exactly this.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by MillerTime View Post
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    Danny never plays well during the preseason. He is actually one player that I am not worried about. We all know what we're going to get from him: SCORING.

    It would be nice that he steps his defence up a little. I know his defence isnt all that bad, but it could get better.

    I wouldnt worry too much about Granger. Hes a consistent 25 ppg scorer
    MT - I agree with you about the scoring. He is good for that. But did you expect a bit more this preseason given the somewhat disappointing off season from Danny?
    "Sometimes, when you look Andy in the eyes, you get a feeling somebody else is driving." -- David Letterman

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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by kester99 View Post
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    No one was bellyaching or upset (your words). They were talking about areas where they'd hoped or expected to see more from Danny. Really, it came across as bellyaching in my book. Especially in the context of playing on a hurt foot for most of the season before the foot finally tore.

    And no one even came close to saying they were disappointed with his Team USA showing, though Kauffy did imply that Danny himself might be disappointed in it. And your point about his injury was already made by three different people.

    So, yes, you did misrepresent the tone, and the words used, in this discussion.

    As for needing to be rude, you are wrong (and possibly the cause of the death of Western civilization), if you feel the need to take a civil discussion to another (lower) level.

    The rest of this is all a matter of opinion.

    And i'm done with the back-and-forth, because we should not go to that level.
    THanks!

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    Thumbs up Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    So you expected Danny Granger to play like he did in his All-Star season even though he had a torn foot that made it pretty much impossible to play with the same intensity. Never mind that when he came back from injury he played with that exact intensity to finish out the season.

    Granger isn't a jump out of the Gym athlete going full on the entire game, he has whats called old man moves. Infact there are many blogs/articles about this just google it. So you belly ache over the fact that he didn't show up and dominate team USA at the same position Durant plays who was anointed the day he showed up. After all he was the NBA's leading scorer. Granger was most likely the insurance policy for Durant.

    Then you're upset that Granger didn't go out and score 30 on Memphis to throw it in Rudy Gay's face in the first practice game of the season. News flash veterans don't use preseason to make a statement. Its practice, its exhibition, its figuring out line ups and rotations. Most veterans are just trying to get through preseason with out getting injured, and they certainly aren't going to come out and give the opposing scouts a fresh look at their game this year when the games dont' count.

    Its amazing how many have completely 180'd on Granger without really looking at the context of events and situations. Injured for most of the season, Team USA wasn't built to utilize his type of game, and its practice....
    +1
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    Plumlee reminds me of a young Dale Davis. Good rebounding and he contests shots well on defense and his offensive game is very raw just like DD's was coming out of college.
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    Default Re: Danny Granger --- Disappointing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kaufman View Post
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    MT - I agree with you about the scoring. He is good for that. But did you expect a bit more this preseason given the somewhat disappointing off season from Danny?
    Agreed. I think whats more important for Danny rather than scoring is rebounding, shotblocking, intensity, and energy (which he doesn't play with). Especially rebounding considering that the team will have to have a collective emphasis on rebounding; both offensive and defensive.

    When he does play defense, he needs to stop doing the silly "touchy" fouls and go hard and just get in their grill, touching the tip of their nose, defense. Just get up on the guys and trust your backcourt to take care of the rest; kind of like what Artest does nowadays.

    Saying that, he hasn't done any of that in the preseason, not that I would neccesarily expect him to.

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