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Thread: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

  1. #1
    crazy shinaniganz BringJackBack's Avatar
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    Default Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    The 09-10 season was a disaster for both Pacers fans and Jim O'Brien, but is it time to turn the page and start fresh? It seems as if O'Brien thinks so.

    With his recent comments of a new post half-court oriented offense with pushing the ball after a defensive board, is it time that Coach has finally gotten over his stubborn beliefs of how to win? Is he finally going to coach the players as opposed to coaching the system, or no?

    When Jim has had talent, he has won games. Is this the year that we win games, or does Jim hold us back? Has Jim finally turned the page? Or am I going to eat crow when we are 0-5 and we have a lineup of TJ-Dunleavy-Posey-Granger-Foster on the floor?

    I guess what I am asking is, is he baiting all of you guys too? Do you think that he is sincere in finally working with the players, or is he the same used car salesman he's been in the past?

    I have no clue..

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    No wont belive it till i see it.

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    hell noooo, his time is done with this team.

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    Play McRoberts and Price! BRushWithDeath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    He's burned his bridge with me.
    "I had to take her down like Chris Brown."

    -Lance Stephenson

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Barring a deep playoff run (conference finals or further) I see no reason to retain him, unless there isn't another option.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    he just doesnt know how to use this team and doesnt coach D

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    I see O'Brien in the "hold the ship steady till the Captain is aboard" senario this year.

    I like what O'Brien has been saying these last couple of weeks but I'm not getting to excited about it.

    He has two new assistants this year and an expiring contract. That right there screams LAME DUCK! to me.

    I'm thinking that Bird may have already talked to Jim's replacement. I see Bird asking a guy like Mike Brown to replace O'Brien at the end of this season.

    I think Jim is a good coach. I don't think he had the players that suited his style here which will probably lead to his resignation or firing mid season.

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    I do not think Obie is the right coach for this team.

    That being said, this season is make or break for him with me. The only thing that makes me resist the urge to say throw him out the door now is Larry's "three year plan." O'Brien has had to deal with this rebuilding process through its entirety. This is supposedly the final year or the "three year plan." If we don't see some drastic improvements I say bye bye Jimmy.

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    I just want him gone.
    "Just look at the flowers ........ BANG"

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    I think he, and others in the Pacers front office, are keenly aware of what fan expectations and opinions are this season due to the franchise on the whole paying more attention to social media including fan websites such as PD, and hearing complaints by STH's regarding the team and its performance as well as that of the coach. No, I don't think the new strategy shift comes from directly responding to fan wishes, rather I believe that fans are being subtly shown that the franchise is aware of our concerns by addressing several of them in the media.

    I just hope that the efforts to change that we are being told about are actually sincere ones as opposed to just telling the public what they believe we want to hear and then reverting back to more of the same. It won't take very long before that truth becomes apparent, either, IMO. Within the first month the new identity of the team should be pretty well established despite the final gelling not happening for another month or two after that when, once again, the new guys and the previous guys, as well as the newly healthy guys finally adjust to each other, adjust to their new playing styles and strategies (assuming there really are any), and hopefully the idea that they should expect to win instead of hoping not to lose anymore because of increased health and available talent.

    I still think O'B is out after this year, but I so want to believe what I am hearing and seeing reported that I am cautiously optimistic. Go Pacers !!!!!!???!!!!!!

  14. #11
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    haha what other chance does JOB need? He's had...246 games to show us what he's made of.

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    A happy Roy is a good Roy DaveP63's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    I want to believe what's been coming out of his mouth, but...Time will tell I suppose. As soon as he reverts to "old Jim", bye-bye...
    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetime’s worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    If we make the playoffs, it should be interesting to see what Bird will do.

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    he just doesnt know how to use this team and doesnt coach D
    Bull****.

    Of course this is the make or break year for Jim. I believe we finally have a decent core of players with talent. Previous seasons we've seen that we were working with trade fillers and one year rentals. This squad appears to be the one we are moving forward with, but just missing one or two more pieces.

    He's got this year, if not any more to see where we go. If we make substantial progress does he deserve an extension? Maybe, maybe not. It depends on if there is anyone else better available that can work with this current roster.

    Now, if he can maximize this talent, he's proven himself worthy of another look. Just a consideration, nothing more. Not a decision, nothing. So none of you fly off the deep end for me saying that.
    Last edited by duke dynamite; 09-28-2010 at 08:45 AM.

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    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    The reflexive "O'Brien sucks" mantra probably hurts decent discussion on this board.

    He isn't terrible. He just isn't excellent. And the reason he can't make the top tier is that every now and then he makes a bad judgment and stubbornly sticks to it, such as: No timeouts when the other team goes on a run, play Murphy as many minutes as possible, etc.

    Remove a couple of these bad judgments and JOB is a an excellent coach. But he does in fact exercise bad judgment at times so he's not excellent. And Bird getting rid of Murphy doesn't solve the problem. Because JOB, who sometimes does not have good judgment, will screw something up again.

    He's not the worst coach in the world. He's mediocre to okay. Maybe even good in the right situation. But we've had him three years, way too long to keep a mediocre coach.
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Denim Chicken duke dynamite's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    He's not the worst coach in the world. He's mediocre to okay. Maybe even good in the right situation. But we've had him three years, way too long to keep a mediocre coach.
    I understand that, but what is the point of having an awesomely-amazing freaking bestest in the world coach when you have sub-mediocre to poor talent? Kind of counter-productive it seems...

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Quote Originally Posted by duke dynamite View Post
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    I understand that, but what is the point of having an awesomely-amazing freaking bestest in the world coach when you have sub-mediocre to poor talent? Kind of counter-productive it seems...
    Yeah but nobody is talking about having the best coach in the world. But there are plenty of assistant coaches out there that are better than JOB. Lester Conner proved it last year.

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    Yeah but nobody is talking about having the best coach in the world. But there are plenty of assistant coaches out there that are better than JOB. Lester Conner proved it last year.
    Lester coached one game. Just one game. We happened to win that game. It's just a coincidence.

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  28. #19
    I'm on a MAC! graphic-er's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Or Is it......? Same opponent, different line ups, different results.

    Lester went big and forced the Raptors to try and adjust and we killed them by 15. Jimmy went with this coveted small ball line up and we lost by about the same.

  29. #20
    thx4tehmRys Danny! daschysta's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    The sample size is far too small to draw a conclusion from. Trying to extrapolate or come to conclusions from such a small sample size is always bad logic. Furthermore JOB's real cardinal sin was leaving roy hibbert out of small ball lineups and allegedly he is comfortable with giving big roy 35 minutes each game if he can handle it.. Also didn't danny guard chris bosh that game? That isn't exactly big ball in my books

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Quote Originally Posted by daschysta View Post
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    The sample size is far too small to draw a conclusion from. Trying to extrapolate or come to conclusions from such a small sample size is always bad logic. Furthermore JOB's real cardinal sin was leaving roy hibbert out of small ball lineups and allegedly he is comfortable with giving big roy 35 minutes each game if he can handle it.. Also didn't danny guard chris bosh that game? That isn't exactly big ball in my books
    Lester cost himself his job during that game by upstaging JOB. Purposely went away from JOB's preferred line up. I remember he was asked, what elements of JOB's system will you bring with you as a coach. He said none! Then JVG ripped him on during a broadcast the following night.

    Yes Danny guarded Bosh at times during the game, and totally shut him down.
    Last edited by graphic-er; 09-28-2010 at 09:55 AM.

  31. #22
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Quote Originally Posted by duke dynamite View Post
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    I understand that, but what is the point of having an awesomely-amazing freaking bestest in the world coach when you have sub-mediocre to poor talent? Kind of counter-productive it seems...
    How about just a good coach?

    Do you prefer mediocre over good?
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    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    I am with Duke on this one. I think the Jim O'Brien era in the end will not be looked upon so favorably by most fans. It really shouldn't, but I think that JOB has done a very good job with what he has had. He hasn't had ****** from a talent perspective. We gutted our whole team in an effort to remove the negative stigma. When your best three players are Mike Dunleavy, Troy Murphy, and a rookie/young Danny Granger who is learning the ropes, that is not a great lineup. It is weak, terrible defensively, poor rebounding, and requires the team to outscore other teams to win. Jim implemented a perimeter ball movement system to utilize his three best players on the perimeter. He went small because the team didn't have the front court to compete in a more half court, slowed down matchup. If we push the tempo, we could be more effective and give ourselves a better chance of winning.

    I am not a JOB apologist by any means. I don't necessarily agree with his assessments of how ready the young players are for more minutes, but he has stayed the course by letting Bird accumulate more talent. Bird made some major moves, and yet stayed patient by drafting well and letting those players develop. We were only going to get better by drafting because nobody wanted our over-priced pupu platter of huge contractual obligations to mediocre players and less than stellar defenders. Our "fountain of youth" is the key moving forward. Heavy minutes will go to our core of Granger, Hibbert, and Collison. I think we will still see our veterans getting significant burn and it will be complemented by the other young players like McRoberts, Tyler, George, Lance, and AJ. We will see a bigger distribution of minutes to the young guys this year. The last two or three years, our young guys just weren't ready enough to get more minutes. I would have played those younger guys more, because we knew then that our bread and butter going forward is with the young guys.

    I am a Pacers fan forever. Jim O'Brien is not a Pacer forever. I have been looking long-term the last couple of years, while JOB has had the "privilege" of trying to balance current winning with moving forward. I am not envious of JOB's role. But this was something that he and Bird discussed three years ago. JOB knew the plan going in. He took the job, because his phone wasn't ringing off the hook. He has done a good job with the mess that our franchise has been. Would I run things differently? Absolutely, but again, I am a Pacer forever. He only has a short timeframe to be successful.

    I think JOB at the end of this year will probably be let go. I think a fresh voice will be good for everybody. If our team makes the playoffs, it will be time for a head coach that will make us a contender. If we miss the playoffs, we will need someone toenergize this team and move it forward in that direction. This is a huge year for JOB. Not for himself, necessarily, but to finish the work that he started. He has been at the helm of a small fishing boat trying to cross the Atlantic. That beat down and battered ship is in its last leg of the journey, beaten and downtrodden. Let's hope we make it succecssfully back to the shores of our playoffs home where the Captain can retire.
    Last edited by pacergod2; 09-28-2010 at 10:02 AM.

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  34. #24
    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    Jimmy always talks a good game, but his actions never match his words.

    In respect to the Pacers new ad campaign, Jimmy's should be "I promise...to actually do what I promise to do this year."
    Come to the Dark Side -- There's cookies!

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  36. #25
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    Default Re: Jim O'Brien, another chance?

    There is no reason to give him another chance because he never lost my faith. He has done our game plan completely and fully and deserves at least one year with the team he helped build.

    I'm all for giving him an extension right now. He has done nothing to hurt the mandate that the team has given.

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