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Thread: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

  1. #26
    Administrator/ The Real Jay ChicagoJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by Dece View Post
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    Besides, even if we did care, people deal with harsh pressure everyday under circumstances that make JO's look like a satirical mockery of something that actually matters. Guy plays a game for a living. This isn't life or death. This isn't cold or warm, starving or fed, it's a game. Cry me a river about the mental pressure of a game.
    Let's look at this sentence: "Guy plays a game for a living."

    You're all focused on the fact that he plays a game. Because he gets to play basketball you assume he shouldn't have any other problems. Like he's a robot or something.

    "... for a living." So I take it that nobody here has ever been stressed out about thier job or career. No fears that, "I'm just not doing as good as I hoped."?? No concerns that, "I'm doing my best but the new boss doesn't seem to appreciate it. Plus, he's got his favorites already."??

    Cry me a river? Yeesh.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


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  3. #27
    Yeah, I'm a Pacers fan. MyFavMartin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    The criticism isn't personal.

    So it shouldn't be taken that way.

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by Day-V View Post
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    At the time, I never bought into J.O. as the "leader" of the Pacers. He was definitely the franchise player, but I still thought of it as Reggie's Team even though his role and production took a huge step back in those last few years.
    Except that Reggie was such a non-leader that he was always promoting Jackson and Jalen as the leaders before JO became his target.

    Yet Reggie gets a free pass?

    Meanwhile, I like the distinction you made between franchise player and leader. Given the rest of the roster, there wasn't a human alive on the planet that could lead them anywhere productive.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


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  6. #29
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    My favorite part of this discussion is that none of it really matters (to the Pacers) because JO is long gone and not coming back...
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

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  8. #30
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFavMartin View Post
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    The criticism isn't personal.

    So it shouldn't be taken that way.
    That's laughable.

    What part of

    "$20 million a year" or

    "can't stand the pressue"

    isn't personal?

    That's like a couple of years ago when my daughter and all her third-grade friends with start an insult with, "Not to be insulting..."

    As in, "Not to be insulting, but I don't like your ponytails."

    We had to teach them that starting an insult with "not to be insulting..." doesn't eliminate the fact that its insult. Saying what you said in post #2, then saying "its not personal" doesn't magically make it impersonal.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  9. #31
    Member Isaac's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
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    I agree that he probably wasn't happy with his play but I think what overall had him down was that the team wasn't winning and the fans were throwing him under the bus.

    He played through major injuries, injuries requiring surgery, because he was making the big bucks and he knew the team needed him. All that money did was put a huge bullseye on his back for the fans and media to shoot at when the Pacers were struggling. His feelings were hurt more than anything else and both he and Larry Bird made the decision to split.

    Luckily we got Roy Hibbert out of the deal and JO got to move on to a situation with less pressure.

    Oh I completely agree, I´m defending JO here. I just don´t understand why people seem to be saying he was making 20 million a year so he shouldn´t get upset. That makes no sense.

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    The ironic thing here is a young JO is EXACTLY what this current team of Pacers desperatley needs!!
    Sittin on top of the world!

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoJ View Post
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    Let's look at this sentence: "Guy plays a game for a living."

    You're all focused on the fact that he plays a game. Because he gets to play basketball you assume he shouldn't have any other problems. Like he's a robot or something.

    "... for a living." So I take it that nobody here has ever been stressed out about thier job or career. No fears that, "I'm just not doing as good as I hoped."?? No concerns that, "I'm doing my best but the new boss doesn't seem to appreciate it. Plus, he's got his favorites already."??

    Cry me a river? Yeesh.
    Good points Jay

    I agree, I always cringe when someone says they didnt always give 110%

    Like who the *&^% can honestly say they give 110% on their job EVERYDAY!

    Its not realistic
    Sittin on top of the world!

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    Member nerveghost's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    I'm rolling my eyes because I don't believe a word of it...."cried"...whatever...

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by nerveghost View Post
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    I'm rolling my eyes because I don't believe a word of it...."cried"...whatever...
    yea God forbid somebody, let alone an athlete, cries...
    follow me @TruenoPanda - lets talk Pacers!

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoJ View Post
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    That's laughable.

    What part of

    "$20 million a year" or

    "can't stand the pressue"

    isn't personal?

    That's like a couple of years ago when my daughter and all her third-grade friends with start an insult with, "Not to be insulting..."

    As in, "Not to be insulting, but I don't like your ponytails."

    We had to teach them that starting an insult with "not to be insulting..." doesn't eliminate the fact that its insult. Saying what you said in post #2, then saying "its not personal" doesn't magically make it impersonal.
    My complaint with JO was his performance on the court and what he put out there in the public regarding talking to the press. The pressure was what comes with the expectations with regard to his performance of a bball player getting superstar money. How is any of that personal?

    He gets paid $20 million to be the superstar of the team and when he doesn't meet expectations, we're supposed to not complain?

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by Isaac View Post
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    Oh I completely agree, I´m defending JO here. I just don´t understand why people seem to be saying he was making 20 million a year so he shouldn´t get upset. That makes no sense.
    not saying he can't get upset.

    i'm saying "deal with it."

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFavMartin View Post
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    not saying he can't get upset.

    i'm saying "deal with it."
    Would you prefer a player who gets upset to the point of tears because things aren't going well or a player who doesn't care if they win or lose as long as they get their 20 mil.

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFavMartin View Post
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    My complaint with JO was his performance on the court and what he put out there in the public regarding talking to the press. The pressure was what comes with the expectations with regard to his performance of a bball player getting superstar money. How is any of that personal?

    He gets paid $20 million to be the superstar of the team and when he doesn't meet expectations, we're supposed to not complain?
    Yeah, you can complain about whatever you want. But your compaints were personal. You were talking about his compensation and his ability to handle pressure. In what universe are those things not personal? As for your contributions on PD, I think you're overpaid and you need to handle the pressure better. Don't like my comment? Deal with it.

    So say whatever you want. But saying that and then saying, "its not personal" doesn't magically make it "not personal."

    Saying "he needs to improve his passing" is not the same, and is a fair comment. Even saying, "gee, during 2002-03 and 2003-04 he was one of the toughest and most-consistent clutch players but he's not anymore and he needs to get back to that level" is a completely fair comment and probably not "personal."

    He clearly wasn't playing as well as he, the fans, or the organization expected. He earned the right to his huge contract in 2002-03, but he only "earned" the compensation of that contact for a year or so, and certainly not the entire time. Most people have accused him of not caring at all, which is absurd. His leadership was misguided, no doubt about that. But nobody else was leading that team. Not dear old Reggie. Certainly not Tinsley, SJax or Ron. Maybe Croshere and Anthony Johnson tried but they didn't have the on-court status to really be the leader.

    Your personal criticisms of him are reasonable. But they're still personal, and saying they aren't personal isn't accurate and its actually disengenuous.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


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  20. #40
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFavMartin View Post
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    My complaint with JO was his performance on the court and what he put out there in the public regarding talking to the press. The pressure was what comes with the expectations with regard to his performance of a bball player getting superstar money. How is any of that personal?

    He gets paid $20 million to be the superstar of the team and when he doesn't meet expectations, we're supposed to not complain?
    The man made the All-Star team 6 times, came in 3rd in MVP voting in '04, earned All-NBA honors three times (Second Team in 2003-04 and Third Team in 2001-02 and 2002-03)…captured the NBA’s Most Improved Player Award in 2001-02…is a three-time NBA Eastern Conference Player of the Month and a two-time NBA Eastern Conference Player of the Week…has ranked in the Top 10 in the NBA in blocks eight times and in the Top 10 in rebounds on three occasions. He's also the Pacers all-time leader in total rebounds and blocked shots.

    The Pacers paid him when he was at the top of his game and there were a couple of other teams he would've received the max from if the Pacers didn't offer him the max. I'll admit that he fizzled the last couple of seasons with the Pacers and didn't live up to his contract but it was because he was injured more than because he lacked good leadership skills or the ability to be a franchise maximum contract player.

    Revisionist history sux.
    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
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    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    GOOD GOD THAT'S LARRY BIRD'S MUSIC!

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  22. #41
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Nevermind, J is probably right, I probably am being overly harsh.
    Last edited by Dece; 09-13-2010 at 06:05 PM.

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
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    The man made the All-Star team 6 times, came in 3rd in MVP voting in '04, earned All-NBA honors three times (Second Team in 2003-04 and Third Team in 2001-02 and 2002-03)…captured the NBA’s Most Improved Player Award in 2001-02…is a three-time NBA Eastern Conference Player of the Month and a two-time NBA Eastern Conference Player of the Week…has ranked in the Top 10 in the NBA in blocks eight times and in the Top 10 in rebounds on three occasions. He's also the Pacers all-time leader in total rebounds and blocked shots.

    The Pacers paid him when he was at the top of his game and there were a couple of other teams he would've received the max from if the Pacers didn't offer him the max. I'll admit that he fizzled the last couple of seasons with the Pacers and didn't live up to his contract but it was because he was injured more than because he lacked good leadership skills or the ability to be a franchise maximum contract player.

    Revisionist history sux.
    Quoted for Truth.

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    Shooting for the Moon Day-V's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by ChicagoJ View Post
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    Except that Reggie was such a non-leader that he was always promoting Jackson and Jalen as the leaders before JO became his target.
    While Reggie said those things about Mark and Jalen, I think it still goes without saying that those were all Reggie's teams. He was the heart and soul of the franchise and everyone rallied around him. Not MJax or Jalen.

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
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    The Pacers paid him when he was at the top of his game ... I'll admit that he fizzled the last couple of seasons with the Pacers and didn't live up to his contract ...
    J Bender, Croshere, Tinsley, Stephen Jackson, Al Harrington....


    So he fit right in with Pacer's history?

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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    I'm not saying I'm completely unsympathetic and feel for the guy and his injuries, but if you can't stand criticism, grow a pair.

  27. #46
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    I don't think he ever earned his contract.... if we're talking ROI.

    He was one of the top paid players in the NBA. Not one of the top 20.... one of the top 2 or 3 players. Last season he earned more than Kobe Bryant, Shaquille O'Neal, Tim Duncan, Dwight Howard, Steve Nash, Lebron James, Carmelo Anthony, Paul Pierce, Dirk Nowitzki, Ray Allen ....

    In 08-09 only Kevin Garnett made more money in the NBA.

    You can argue we had to pay him those type of numbers because he was seen as a POTENTIAL elite player and someone else would, but he hit his ceiling before he ever reached elite status. He was certainly never the 2nd best or 2nd most important player in the NBA.... yet his salary said otherwise.

    I doubt we'll ever know what any other teams really offered (or would've offered) since we gave him the max and max years... but I don't see how it can be argued he 'earned' that contract when he never was even the best player on the team, let alone in the NBA.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  29. #47
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    He was third in MVP balloting during the first season of his contract. You are cherry picking with your selective recall. And he was arguably better the season before, although his father-in-law attempted suicide and a whole bunch of other offcourt **** and Ron's oncourt flagrant foul **** and Isiah's wretched coaching **** torpedoed that team. Obviously years #3, #4, #5, etc. of the contract did not work out so well. But its not like the Pacers gave him a max contract when he was a first-year starter averaging 12 and 9. His production improved rapidly when he got into the rotation on a regular basis.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  30. #48
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by MyFavMartin View Post
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    but if you can't stand criticism, grow a pair.
    That's still "personal."
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


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  32. #49
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    JO was always an interesting character.

    Do I think he cared? Absolutely. He wanted the Pacers to succeed.

    However, I think he always thought the best way to succeed was through him. In a way, he was selfish because of this, but at the same time I think his intentions were for the team to win, he was just misguided. If that makes sense.
    "Misguided" was right. He was guided poorly.

    Watching old tape of him before he added all of that weight is just heartbreaking. He was always a player that built his game around being quick. Even in his last year with us, he'd consistently score the ball if he made a quick move as soon as he got it. That was where his skills were.

    Bulking up didn't just hurt his knees (although it obviously hurt them quite a lot). It also hurt his game, because he was a speed/quickness player trying to play a power game. It just didn't work.

    I understand letting Brad Miller walk, but the Pacers really needed to get Dale Davis back sooner and keep him for longer. Dale and Jermaine would have been the best Pacers frontcourt ever.

    Peck will always hate Jermaine for not being Dale, but the reality is that the guy Jermaine really replaced up front was Smits. See him as a better Smits who needed his Dale and his later career decline becomes almost unavoidable.
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    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal broke down crying in his car after his last game as a Pacer

    Come on everybody *****ing and moaning about JO's contract has never made sense. He earned the deal and was paid his market value at the time. He didn't screw us or bamboozle us. Everyone likes to revise this, remember the other team that was pursuing JO very actively? The San Antonio Spurs. I guess they're a bunch of idiots for thinking JO was worth a max deal too? I think we'd all like to be run by the Spurs management group.

    Everyone needs to realize, that while flawed, JO was one of our smallest problems for most of his time here.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
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