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Thread: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

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    Default ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/insid...od_nba_xxx_xxx

    Not a lot of optimism here. Their projected starting 5:

    Collison
    Dunleavy, Jr.
    Granger
    McRoberts (!)
    Hibbert

    NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30
    Timberwolves, Pistons, Raptors, Pacers, Wizards, Nets, projections and previews
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    By Chris Broussard and John Hollinger
    ESPN The Magazine and ESPN Insider

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    A tough road lies ahead for the teams of Kevin Love, Gilbert Arenas and Richard Hamilton.
    With the most highly anticipated free-agency period in NBA history now in the books, ESPN Insider is surveying the new landscape of the Association over the next five days. Chris Broussard examines what changed for each team and what issues still linger, before ranking the teams from No. 30 to No. 1 for the coming season. And John Hollinger weighs in with per-40 minute statistical projections for each squad's starting lineup.




    PG | SG | SF | PF | C
    30. Minnesota Timberwolves
    The more things change: Losing the best player on a 15-win team is no big deal, so bye-bye Al Jefferson. Now, the Wolves' most talented player, though perhaps not their best, is Michael Beasley, who's already had a duffle bag's worth of controversy in his disappointing two-year career. While you hope Beasley can turn it around in Minny, it just doesn't seem like the place to build a problem child into a professional. Elsewhere on the roster, Luke Ridnour replaces Ramon Sessions. Ho-hum. Both are truly backups.

    The more they stay the same: The Timberwolves remain, undisputedly, the worst team and franchise in the league. Since Kevin Garnett left for brighter days in Boston three years ago, the Timberwolves have become a joke. They're overstocked at point guard, yet all of them are mediocre, and perhaps the best of the bunch (Ricky Rubio) refuses to play for them, choosing instead to remain in Europe. The one bright spot is Kevin Love, but even he's not bright enough to overcome the darkness covering this club.


    PG | SG | SF | PF | C
    29. Detroit Pistons
    The more things change: Years ago, when Tracy McGrady was healthy and in his prime, the Pistons tried and failed to trade for him. Well, they finally got McGrady, signing him as a free agent this summer for the veteran's minimum of $1.35 million. But the 31-year-old McGrady is such a shell of himself that the Pistons were perhaps the only team that wanted him. McGrady will get a chance to shine in Detroit, though, which is an opportunity he would not have received in most places. The Pistons also finally got a skilled big man, happily drafting Georgetown's Greg Monroe. Monroe has great talent, but his toughness and determination have been questioned, as he underachieved in NCAA ball.

    The more they stay the same: Detroit's three best players may still play largely the same position. Point guard Rodney Stuckey may be more like a shooting guard, a position that's already stocked with Richard Hamilton and Ben Gordon. The three are too small to start in a three-guard lineup, but the Pistons' front line is too offensively challenged to put up big points without those three on the floor.


    PG | SG | SF | PF | C
    28. Toronto Raptors
    The more things change: The Raptors played the Chris Bosh situation all wrong. It seems that every single individual in the league knew Bosh was leaving Toronto except those working in Toronto. Why else would the Raptors hold onto him until the summer, when they would have been far better off trading him before last season's deadline? In the end, Toronto was left to take whatever it could get in the form of draft picks and a huge trade exception for its best player. The Raptors were able to get rid of the disgruntled Hedo Turkoglu, bringing in another international player in Leandro Barbosa, and they also added free agents Amir Johnson and Linas Kleiza and draft pick Ed Davis. Those are decent players, but this was, without question, a lost summer for the Raptors.

    The more they stay the same: The Raptors organization has to begin seriously wondering whether it can get an American-born star to stay in Toronto. McGrady left as a free agent years ago, then Vince Carter forced his way out of the country and now Bosh has followed suit. If talented second-year guard DeMar DeRozan blossoms into a star, will he eventually bolt, too? You can't help but think "probably."


    PG | SG | SF | PF | C
    27. Indiana Pacers
    The more things change: The Pacers added a potential star in Darren Collison, who put up big numbers while filling in for Chris Paul last season in New Orleans. James Posey also came along in the trade that cost Indiana Troy Murphy, and he brings championship pedigree and leadership. For all their struggles on the court, the Pacers are beginning to manage their cap well and could be players in free agency next summer.

    The more they stay the same: Second-round pick Lance Stephenson's recent altercation with the mother of his child, in which he allegedly pushed her down a flight of stairs and slammed her head against a step, brings back despicable memories of the havoc wreaked by Ron Artest, Stephen Jackson and Jamaal Tinsley a few years ago. Indiana, in an effort to win back its fan base, has brought in nothing but "good guys" the past few years, but diverted from that strategy in drafting Stephenson, whose troubled past is well-documented. They got burned for it.



    PG | SG | SF | PF | C
    26. Washington Wizards
    The more things change: There's a new leader off the court, in new owner Ted Leonsis, and one on the court, in new point guard John Wall. Wall has explosive talent and is expected to become a superstar, and the Wizards acquired Kirk Hinrich to give Wall a veteran sounding board to help him maximize his potential. There's been a ton of team turnover, both at last February's trade deadline and over the summer, including a minor move that brought Yi Jianlian over from New Jersey. The Wizards are now a young team with big talent.

    The more they stay the same: Gilbert Arenas is back, but back in a different role. When Gilbert left the team after being suspended because of his foolish gunplay with Javaris Crittenton, he was the face of the franchise, on and off the court. Now both of those titles belong to Wall, and no matter what he says, Arenas will have a hard time accepting that. The Wizards would love to trade him but his baggage and the four years and $80 million left on his contract make that awfully hard to do. Arenas helped ruin last season; the Wizards are determined not to let him ruin this one, as well.


    PG | SG | SF | PF | C
    25. New Jersey Nets
    The more things change: Rod Thorn and Kiki Vandeweghe are out, and Billy King, Avery Johnson and celebrity Russian owner Mikhail Prokhorov are in. Johnson was one of the league's most successful coaches during his tenure in Dallas and will whip the talented but young Nets into shape. Free agency was a failure, pure and simple, since the Nets missed out on all the big names, but they added some quality in Travis Outlaw (though they overpaid him with a five-year, $35 million deal), Jordan Farmar and Anthony Morrow. No. 3 pick Derrick Favors has a world of potential, and the Nets smartly brought in Troy Murphy to hold down the power forward spot until Favors learns the ropes.

    The more they stay the same: The Nets are still stuck in a sort of limbo. While they've left the Izod Center in the New Jersey swamps, they're still not in their permanent digs yet. They'll spend the next two years in Newark, playing at the Prudential Center, before moving to Brooklyn for good in 2012. The failure to reach Brooklyn earlier, which was the initial plan, certainly cost the Nets a legitimate shot at LeBron James and the other big-name free agents this summer. Some would say it was fitting for a franchise that, despite its back-to-back trips to the Finals in 2002 and 2003, is still largely regarded as backward.

    Chris Broussard is a senior writer for ESPN The Magazine.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    So are these their rankings of how they think the league will be record-wise this upcoming season?? And they're making us as this bad of a team while getting Collison by dealing Murphy and his horrible defense among other things, and then also because of Lance Stephenson and his troubles, who has yet to play an NBA game?? ESPN cracks me up. Talk about being irrelevent.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck Chillout View Post
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    Not a lot of optimism here. Their projected starting 5:

    Collison
    Dunleavy, Jr.
    Granger
    McRoberts (!)
    Hibbert
    That exclamation point should belong next to Dunleavy Jr.

    He has no business starting for this team.
    "I had to take her down like Chris Brown."

    -Lance Stephenson

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
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    That exclamation point should belong next to Dunleavy Jr.

    He has no business starting for this team.
    Agreed, but given his past comments, it's not that outrageous that O'Brien would choose him over Rush.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    We added a potential star....yet are ranked 27th, as in got worse.

    That's Hollinger for ya.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    If our roster were to stay as is, I wouldn't be surprised if McBeard started.
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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy View Post
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    If our roster were to stay as is, I wouldn't be surprised if McBeard started.
    I'd be VERY surprised. This is the same McBob that O'Brien had behind Dahntay Jones and Mike Dunleavy on the PF depth chart last year

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by pwee31 View Post
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    I'd be VERY surprised. This is the same McBob that O'Brien had behind Dahntay Jones and Mike Dunleavy on the PF depth chart last year
    The addition of Collison at PG makes our PF position look much worse.

    Actually, McBob should probably backup Hibbert. Unless Foster is proven healthy, no one else on the team is remotely capable of defending the paint. If Foster is healthy, fine, McBob can put some time in there.

    Other options at PF are Granger, Tyler and Magnum. I fully expect Granger to put some time in there.

    BTW, if Jeff and Tyler are both out...we are in deep doo doo.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by pwee31 View Post
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    I'd be VERY surprised. This is the same McBob that O'Brien had behind Dahntay Jones and Mike Dunleavy on the PF depth chart last year
    If Tyler is not yet approaching 100%, and I'm pretty certain he is not there yet, McRoberts isn't a bad choice to start. Having a relatively quick PF on the floor next to Hibbert might not be a bad idea.

    The real question mark is the peculiar mind of JOB, the same guy who had McRoberts hoisting up 500 3s per day. Who knows what that bozo will say or do...

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    BTW, if Jeff and Tyler are both out...we are in deep doo doo.
    Which would be fine with me, while I'm excited about this season, I'm aware we're in a win-win scenario. If we suck, and we can get a lottery pick, we may be able to plug that PF hole with a cheap and talented rookie. Plus.

    If we make the playoffs, we should be able to attract some good PF's in free agency because they'll see a playoff team with a glaring weakness that they could help fill to improve the team overall. Plus.

    It's a rare situation in sports where we should be able to come out like roses no matter how we do. It's gonna be fun to see how it all shakes out.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by Ozwalt72 View Post
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    We added a potential star....yet are ranked 27th, as in got worse.

    That's Hollinger for ya.
    Hollinger is useless to me, so I will not let this get me worked up. Besides, ESPN has their head so far up big money's *** they don't care about Indiana and never have, never will.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by xBulletproof View Post
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    Which would be fine with me, while I'm excited about this season, I'm aware we're in a win-win scenario. If we suck, and we can get a lottery pick, we may be able to plug that PF hole with a cheap and talented rookie. Plus.

    If we make the playoffs, we should be able to attract some good PF's in free agency because they'll see a playoff team with a glaring weakness that they could help fill to improve the team overall. Plus.

    It's a rare situation in sports where we should be able to come out like roses no matter how we do. It's gonna be fun to see how it all shakes out.
    i do sorta agree with this. looking at the rankings i was a little surprised we are ranked so low, but considering the uncertainty we have at PF, i can understand the doubt espn has in the pacers.

    if it did play out were one of the worst teams in the league, it could be to our advantage in having one more solid rookie prospect to add to this core group of players; or Bird could also use it as leverage to bring in a veteran PF, and perhaps acquire a later pick in the first round. those are good things considering the direction the team is going.

    however, losing sucks, and with the recent addition of collison im now rooting for the pacers to make the playoffs, to gain some additional experience. dont get me wrong, i wanted them in the playoffs regardless, but it felt less worthwhile when the team really had no direction before the trade except that we had ample cap space next year.

    so like i said above, i agree the pacers are in a win-win. even if we fall somewhere in the middle, and end up with a pick around 10-14, its not bad because i want to see the group get use to winning. losing 50-60 games i would imagine could take alot out of a team and not sure acquiring a top 5 pick is worth that. we may not win 50, but somewhere around 35 or more is at least a low point that i dont think the team will go below as the young guys get more experience.

    all in all, im rooting for the team to make the postseason. but if we end up just missing the playoffs, and have a top 10 pick it will only help long term.

    how good this team can be really hinges on the overall health of players like Foster, Hansbro, Dunleavy, and Price; in addition to everyone else of course.

    if that happens i could easily see the pacers winning 40-45 games and earning a playoff spot.

    whatever does happen, i am finally looking forward to watching pacer games again! the past few seasons its been pretty hard to watch the product assembled on the court. now with the clear direction of the team, i can tolerate the losing a little better than before, as long as there is continued improvement, and wise decision making in the FO.

    with all that said, i think there is gonna be one more move made prior to the season beginning involving Ford, and possibly another player. as someone else pointed out in another thread, before we were looking to move Ford for a PG; now there are more options available to us. it may not be a blockbuster deal or anything, but i dont think the team will stay as is heading into the season.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Two points:

    1. Training camp material.

    2. Commentators always underestimate the Pacers. No consideration of Tyler and Danny at the 4, the continued development of Roy and Rush, and our 1st round draft pick, PG.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    I don't see the outrage? We were a bottom 5 talent team last year. We (smartly) traded a vet 4 for a young PG with upside. How creating a hole by plugging another makes us some sort of contender is beyond me?

    Another punt year, that hopefully leads to a Horford and a high lotto/franchise level talent.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    what's the bigger change....


    Watson, Ford to Collison

    or

    Murphy to Hansbrough, McBob

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Am I the only one who REALLY doesn't like the idea of Danny playing the 4?

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by Ozwalt72 View Post
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    what's the bigger change....


    Watson, Ford to Collison

    or

    Murphy to Hansbrough, McBob
    I say the PG change to me, mostly because I think it's the most important position in the NBA. If your PG play is bad, you're going to be bad.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    We've got plenty of forwards.

    Granger, Dunleavy, Posey, George will take most of the minutes at both forward positions, and if we need to play a "bigger" guy then Tyler or Jeff will hopefully be available.

    I'd be surprised if McBob plays in more than 30 games -- barring injury. We've got pretty good depth at forward, especially once George is ready to play (and play forward, not guard.)

    Please remember to put "Hollinger (Idiot) Alert" in the thread title. He's awful.
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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Am I the only person who likes Hollinger?

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Am I the only person who likes Hollinger?
    Yes
    "It's just unfortunate that we've been penalized so much this year and nothing has happened to the Pistons, the Palace or the city of Detroit," he said. "It's almost like it's always our fault. The league knows it. They should be ashamed of themselves to let the security be as lax as it is around here."

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Am I the only person who likes Hollinger?
    No, you're not.

    Besides:

    With the most highly anticipated free-agency period in NBA history now in the books, ESPN Insider is surveying the new landscape of the Association over the next five days. Chris Broussard examines what changed for each team and what issues still linger, before ranking the teams from No. 30 to No. 1 for the coming season. And John Hollinger weighs in with per-40 minute statistical projections for each squad's starting lineup.
    Last edited by count55; 08-24-2010 at 06:12 AM.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by pwee31 View Post
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    I'd be VERY surprised. This is the same McBob that O'Brien had behind Dahntay Jones and Mike Dunleavy on the PF depth chart last year
    UNTIL he started doing the things his coach required of him to do.
    Then he played.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by Day-V View Post
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    Am I the only one who REALLY doesn't like the idea of Danny playing the 4?
    Not full time, but i LOVE him there in the right matchups. He abuses the bigger guys.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    It is true the Pacers, especially the past 2 seasons, have generally done better than what most national experts have expected them to do. All of you are suggesting that the "experts" have just been wrong. I have argued that maybe coaching has actually gotten the Pacers to overachieve a little. I'm not going to flesh this out anymore than that (don't see the point in having this discussion now)

    As far as the specific point of the insider article. I could see from an experts opinion, someone who maybe watches parts of 5 or 6 games a season, subtracting Murphy and adding Posey and Collison isn't a major upgrade. The general concensus of NBA experts is that Murphy was a valuable part of the team last season, so taking him away in their opinions is going to hurt the team.

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    Default Re: ESPN Insider: NBA Offseason Buzz: Teams 25-30

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    No, you're not.

    Besides:
    The whole, in this case, is not any greater than the sum of its parts.

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