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Thread: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

  1. #51
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Nope, I meant dunks. You obviously didn't read the post to which I was replying.
    Oh Look At Mr. Smarty Pants Always Having to Be Correct.*







    *I'm still not sure I'm using it right. That might have come off as too Droopy even by my standards.

  2. #52

    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Rush is also a shooter.

    He'd do well to add a midrange shot, and be more comfortable finishing around the basket. But at the moment, Rush is best at shooting. (or learn good movements, an ability to come off screens..if out team would set screens..a la Rip or Ray)

    Which means Rush needs someone to pass him the ball when he's open. Someone to look for him. At the moment, he can not create his own offense, which means he's limited. So as I said, either he needs to learn how to come off screens better to get himself open (meaning we need to set screens) or he needs to become comfortable with the "ball fake take a step in shoot a midrange shot" move, or he can be more comfortable with finishing at the rim. (All three would be good..and this is all stuff he can learn to do..)

    Which makes it far less shocking that his scoring picks up when TJ sits down.

    And this offense, particularly hurts his production, because either we run up the court and get a three (which, in 90% of cases goes to either Danny or Troy, and then probably 5-6% of the time the PG takes the shot..leaving a limited percentage to find Rush.)

    Then, we didn't really have an offense. It was just sort of TJ/Watson/AJ making it up. Which meant, TJ would dribble the ball for twenty seconds and turn it over, AJ would try and run the pick and roll or Watson would pass into the post. AJ and Earl would find Rush if he was open, but he doesn't run himself off of screens (partially because we don't set any) or even really do anything besides stand in the corner. So if he's open, AJ and Earl would get it to him, but if not..they'd pretty much ignore him on offense. (or pass it to him because he had a better angle into the post.) However, with Price and Watson in, the ball movement was better, which meant that Rush would be open more often, and therefore they were able to get him the ball a bit more.

    So it's a combo, the lack of offensive structure hurts him, because there aren't any screens to run off of, any set plays for him. And the fact that he's virtually stagnant, and uncomfortable with a midrange shot and finishing at the basket.

    Basically, a more structured offense and some improved skills (movement, midrange, finishing) would make Rush a very good starter. But he probably wasn't told to work on that. Jimmy hates that step in for midrange jump shot (which is SO short sighted..) so he wouldn't want him to work at that. There is a lack of screens, so why would Rush work on getting better with that..so he's probably just been told to work on finishing at the basket..and his three point shot.

    I think it would be a mistake to trade Rush. And get him on a good team with a good coach, (Pop) and we'll be kicking ourselves..
    Last edited by Sookie; 07-17-2010 at 07:07 PM.

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  4. #53
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    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    One more thing on the coaching - do you trade Dale, Reggie and Rik or do you swap Bob Hill for Larry Brown?

    Are we not possibly facing a similar choice now?
    I'd have to agree with that assessment. I think we actually have more talent on this team than the players have been able to show in this loony system that uses the 3-point contest as a basis for the offense and all but ignores defense. It seems obvious that certain players in particular have been frustrated by it, as it doesn't fit their strengths. The latest "Murphy-izing" experiment with McRoberts shows you all you need to know about the problem with JOB's stubbornness and how it has adversely impacted his players.

  5. #54

    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    As long as his man is at the other end with a lower PPMin then I'm thrilled with it.

    Or better put since many teams use the SG as the main scorer, if his SG is putting up less efficient scoring than Danny Granger is for the Pacers, and Rush is outscoring Danny's man, then that's a win.

    Plus as many of us are saying (and have been for some time now), Rush is not a player who fits well with this system.


    Let's seriously ask the following question and answer it honestly -
    What would McKey or Dale look like in the JOB system? What would they do, would they get playing time?
    Would their good games be irrelevant? I ask this because we do know that their games were extremely valuable to a very successful roster for many years and for more than one coach.

    Rush is not a perfect player, but then he wasn't the #1-3 pick and won't be getting a giant 2nd contract to replace his rookie deal. He's going to have flaws and his main flaw is not being able to attack the rim off his own dribble.

    He plays great defense, he rebounds extremely well, and he shoots a killer 3 ball. Reggie rebounded at a much lower rate and was a sub-par defender who could draw fouls instead.

    Is it better for Reggie to score 31 while Steve Smith goes for 28 or for Rush to score 11 while his man goes for 12 on 15 shots with 4 TOs?

    What we need is a coach that can use Roy in the low post, Josh in the high post, Rush starting the play and then cutting off either post or stepping back to space. Let Granger do the same but with a bit more iso or dribble drives since he does draw fouls. Let Price or a PG of that style work the PnR action to get the bigs some points.

    You could easily see 4-5 good passes and lots of inside scoring at the end of it, and not just from Rush.


    Watching Vegas ball today I saw Mike Fratello chastise Vasquez for taking and early open 3, the kind of shot JOB insists on having players take. Mike's view was this - that was the best shot you could find, you couldn't try to work the ball for an even better look?

    It annoys me a little to have any of the current roster evaluated based on their performance in this system. Any system that has Granger taking 1.5-2 times as many 3PA PER GAME than Reggie Miller ever did has a problem.

    And Rush is nowhere the 1 on 1 player to overcome that. In fact the way JOB has presented the case for he, Josh and AJ (along with shot selection changes we've seen), avoiding the lane and shooting the 3 instead seems to be a matter of playing time survival.
    I am not minimizing Rush's defense. Defense is great but not everyone that Rush defends is a Kobe or Joe Johnson. And yes Granger is putting up 1.5-2 times as many 3's as he should but perhaps it is because Rush and others are not doing their offensive part. Who is the #2 scorer on this team, the number 3? It was Danny and whomever.
    I am tired of hearing how this system isn't good for Rush. Who drafted him knowing that? Rush would be better off playing SF imo.

  6. #55

    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Rush isn't a shot-creator, rather a low-usage role-player, but his usage is so low it's inexcusable and it's hard to put the blame entirely on the system, coach or whatever. If he's going to shoot so little, then he needs to improve that 52% TS%. Good player, valuable contributions on other aspects of the game, but he needs to fix that.

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  8. #56
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    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    What we need is a coach that can use Roy in the low post, Josh in the high post, Rush starting the play and then cutting off either post or stepping back to space. Let Granger do the same but with a bit more iso or dribble drives since he does draw fouls. Let Price or a PG of that style work the PnR action to get the bigs some points.
    Bingo. We just need someone who enhances our player growth, rather than be an obstacle like O'Brien.

    Remember Brandon/Roy's rookie season? They had a great chemistry when Brandon worked the ball into Roy. That disappeared last season.

    The crazy thing is Larry's drafted/traded for several players who are very instinctively smart basketball players (Hibbert, McRoberts, Rush, Price, Hansbrough). I honestly believe they would win more games without a coach. With a good coach, I think they're a playoff team right now.

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    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    Bingo. We just need someone who enhances our player growth, rather than be an obstacle like O'Brien.

    Remember Brandon/Roy's rookie season? They had a great chemistry when Brandon worked the ball into Roy. That disappeared last season.

    The crazy thing is Larry's drafted/traded for several players who are very instinctively smart basketball players (Hibbert, McRoberts, Rush, Price, Hansbrough). I honestly believe they would win more games without a coach. With a good coach, I think they're a playoff team right now.
    I'm not so sure about a playoff team, as these guys are still pretty young. But they should be really good within a couple of years. The potential is certainly there, and the team would be in much better shape with a few key moves (new coach, add PG and PF).

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  12. #58

    Default Re: The value of Brandon Rush (got higher)

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    Bingo. We just need someone who enhances our player growth, rather than be an obstacle like O'Brien.

    Remember Brandon/Roy's rookie season? They had a great chemistry when Brandon worked the ball into Roy. That disappeared last season.

    The crazy thing is Larry's drafted/traded for several players who are very instinctively smart basketball players (Hibbert, McRoberts, Rush, Price, Hansbrough). I honestly believe they would win more games without a coach. With a good coach, I think they're a playoff team right now.
    Yea, I think if they got to do, what they actually wanted to do, they'd be much better.

    I also like that they all seem to have great chemsitry with each other (and it looked like Paul and McBob had very good chemistry too) I think that was most obviously seen with the Hibbert/Rush/Price trio we saw a few times.

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