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Thread: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

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    Member joew8302's Avatar
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    Default From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Maybe I am crazy here, but it seems like people are WAY overvaluing Rush on the trade market viewing him as some valuable trade asset. I see him more as a filler or complimentary piece in a deal.

    The positives about Rush is his three ball and his defensive ability. Those two things are the highlights which you would try to sell other teams on. Other than that what does Rush have going for him?

    The negatives about Rush: He is a TERRIBLE free throw shooter. Under65% as a two is beyond awful. He is also below 43% from the field for his career, which might not be terrible, but it isn't too great as well. Rush also can not create for others at all as his 1:1 assist to turnover ratio would indicate.

    Looking at Rush through stats brings me to why I am thoroughly confused. Why are some of you so hesitant to move this guy? I mean he will be 25 before next season, meaning he isn't exactly that young anymore. Some of you wouldn't move him for a Darren Collison type, which to me is mind boggeling. Where is all this hope and promise that some of you show in Rush coming from? I sure don't know.

    While I wouldn't give Rush away for a pack of M&M's, I would not hesitate to give him up either. I mean if Rush is what could land us or keep us from landing a guy like Darren Collison or Tony Parker I would think you have to do that. I mean Rush has not shown me anything to think he is too valuable for that.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    I think they keep Brandon and try to use one of the expiring players for any trade. Brandon is just too good to trade and he is undervalued by other teams. He is not a star or will ever be one, but he is a good role player who plays awesome D and can nail the 3.

    I think he is the perfect 6th man - rotation player for the future. Plus, when it comes time to sign him he won't cost very much. I think he would get a deal similar to or less than DJones.

    Those are the kind of people you want on your team, glue guys who don't demand huge contracts.
    Last edited by PaceBalls; 06-27-2010 at 02:20 PM.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    I agree completely Joe.

    Thingfish what makes you say he is "too good to trade"? Sure he has some talent and looks to be a good role-player in the future, but why is that too good to trade for a starting PG?

    The problem I have with keeping Rush is that he is not the answer at SG for a team looking to put together a legitimate PO roster... He looks great off the bench for a win-now team but with George (hopefully) on the rise and holes in the starting roster, the Pacers don't have the luxury of holding onto role players who have the ability to bring back starting talent in a trade.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Within the O'B offense, the job of a wing is to either attack the paint with dribble penetration or shoot 3's. Otherwise, they pass to someone else who does the same. Rush makes fewer mistakes and has better judgement on when to drive and pass than pretty much anyone else who has been on our roster since he came here. His only rub is that he isn't agressive enough to finish well, and he passes up too many shots.

    Defensively, he is a potential beast if he is put on a team that values defense enough to have everybody playing it.

    It was obvious that the Bobcats wanted him to be the primary acquisition in the proposed trade for Felton, while being willing to pay TJ as a backup for them. I am sure that other teams have wanted him, also, but Bird doesn't want to trade him because he realizes both how good he actually is, as well as recognizing that he can be quite a bit better down the road.

    Rush is valuable as a trading piece, but it depends on who the Pacers are trying to get rid of at a given time as to whather they are willing to include Rush, or if he is too valuable to include at that particular time.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thingfish View Post
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    Those are the kind of people you want on your team, glue guys who don't demand huge contracts.

    You also don't want a whole team of those kind of players...

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thingfish View Post
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    I think they keep Brandon and try to use one of the expiring players for any trade. Brandon is just too good to trade and he is undervalued by other teams. He is not a star or will ever be one, but he is a good role player who plays awesome D and can nail the 3.

    I think he is the perfect 6th man - rotation player for the future. Plus, when it comes time to sign him he won't cost very much. I think he would get a deal similar to or less than DJones.

    Those are the kind of people you want on your team, glue guys who don't demand huge contracts.
    I am still trying to understand how other teams could undervalue any Pacer player. THe NBA sets the value of any player and right now Rush's value is leveled off to maybe even declining.

    IF thats the case then I would trade him before his contract is up because I think you are dead wrong on what his next contract will be. The Djones comparison is a bit flawed becuase he doesn't spread the floor with his 3 pnt shooting. Guys like Ariza and Posey are better comparisons IMO and if that is the case Rushes next contract will be more like 4-6 million per year.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    I agree with Joew8302 completey. I would trade Rush for almost any of the PG's selected in the first round last year. If Bird thought he was the answer than George would not have been drafted. Sure most people think George was dratfed because he was the BPA, but if we were set at the wings our BPA would have been Davis or Patterson.
    If some othe GM is willing to take Rush and we get back a starting caliber young PG, you jump all over it. I would have traded him for Hill, if that was on the table last week.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Value?

    I'd say something in the range of a dishwasher and a Lunchable.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Oh, alright. The Lunchable was a reach.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Are people just not getting the idea that if we trade away Rush we won't have a starting SG anymore? Neither George or Stephenson are ready to start at SG right now. We trade a 1st round pick (which we could eventually use to get a PG) and our starting SG and then we have a hole at SG instead of PG plus we lost a pick.

    I'd much rather trade an expiring for a decent PG this summer and upgrade the position later instead of give up any of our young guys right now.

    I realize that many of you would just like to upgrade every position with above average players all at once, but that's just not reality.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bridge View Post
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    You also don't want a whole team of those kind of players...
    Perhaps not, but I wouldn't mind having a whole team that plays defense.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by IndyPacer View Post
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    Are people just not getting the idea that if we trade away Rush we won't have a starting SG anymore? Neither George or Stephenson are ready to start at SG right now. We trade a 1st round pick (which we could eventually use to get a PG) and our starting SG and then we have a hole at SG instead of PG plus we lost a pick.

    I'd much rather trade an expiring for a decent PG this summer and upgrade the position later instead of give up any of our young guys right now.

    I realize that many of you would just like to upgrade every position with above average players all at once, but that's just not reality.

    Jones would be a competent stopgap before George steps up. Also, I'd rather fill the PG hole then the SG hole any day... it's much harder to do

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    I see Rush as a player who in combination with an expirer could net us a good proven PG. His skill set of having good defense and the ability to knock down shots would bode well for a good team needing depth for both the 2 and the three spots. Maybe being traded could help him get more of a scorer mentality. I am not living in a pipe dream though. We're not landing a top PG with Rush, but we could get a promising guy like Collison, Maynor or Flynn. I'd be happy with those trade scenarios.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by IndyPacer View Post
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    Are people just not getting the idea that if we trade away Rush we won't have a starting SG anymore? Neither George or Stephenson are ready to start at SG right now. We trade a 1st round pick (which we could eventually use to get a PG) and our starting SG and then we have a hole at SG instead of PG plus we lost a pick.

    I'd much rather trade an expiring for a decent PG this summer and upgrade the position later instead of give up any of our young guys right now.

    I realize that many of you would just like to upgrade every position with above average players all at once, but that's just not reality.
    I think people are getting the idea that with Rush we will not have a starting caliber 2 guard anyways.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    my personal opinion is to keep brandon rush and trade him at all. give him another year to prove him self. i see him as having more positives than negatives and the negatives are not necessarily things that are really hurting the team, they can be fixed give him another year and see what happens. otherwise it will be a big mistake

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    IMHO, he is a very solid and effective 1st SG/SF off the bench for a Playoff caliber team and an acceptable Starter on a Lottery Team. When I look at it that way, I believe that BRush's value to this team is considerable given the direction that we are taking and the foundation that the FO is trying to build. The only way that I would even consider trading him is if we got back a solid player that contributes as much as he does.

    I understand that the introduction of 2 Wing players could mean that BRush's days maybe numbered, but why couldn't it mean the same for Dunleavy?
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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    IMHO, he is a very solid and effective 1st SG/SF off the bench for a Playoff caliber team and an acceptable Starter on a Lottery Team. When I look at it that way, I believe that BRush's value to this team is considerable given the direction that we are taking and the foundation that the FO is trying to build. The only way that I would even consider trading him is if we got back a solid player that contributes as much as he does.

    I understand that the introduction of 2 Wing players could mean that BRush's days maybe numbered, but why couldn't it mean the same for Dunleavy?
    Dunleavy has one more year left on his deal and he is an unrestricted FA. I think the fact his days are numbered is pretty common knowledge.

    And clearly you don't take back anything you precieve to be inferior, but like I said, look at his stats. I mean to contribute as much as Rush is not some monumental task.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by IndyPacer View Post
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    Are people just not getting the idea that if we trade away Rush we won't have a starting SG anymore? Neither George or Stephenson are ready to start at SG right now. We trade a 1st round pick (which we could eventually use to get a PG) and our starting SG and then we have a hole at SG instead of PG plus we lost a pick.

    I'd much rather trade an expiring for a decent PG this summer and upgrade the position later instead of give up any of our young guys right now.

    I realize that many of you would just like to upgrade every position with above average players all at once, but that's just not reality.
    Dahntay or Dunleavy will be the starting SG if we trade Rush. I know Dahntay and Dunleavy aren't part of the young core, but they're guys that Herb Simon pays to play SG, so I wouldn't say there'd be a "hole" at SG if we traded Rush.

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    Default Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Quote Originally Posted by joew8302 View Post
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    Dunleavy has one more year left on his deal and he is an unrestricted FA. I think the fact his days are numbered is pretty common knowledge.

    And clearly you don't take back anything you precieve to be inferior, but like I said, look at his stats. I mean to contribute as much as Rush is not some monumental task.
    IF you only look at points scored and his FT%, then yes. IF you include his D, which is much harder to gauge in statistics, it could become quite a different story.

    I'm on the fences about this one.

    I guess it all depends on who we get back and what the complete deal looks like and reserve judgement for that time.
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