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Thread: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

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    Default Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=5200347


    ORLANDO, Fla. -- The NBA is investigating an incident between referee Joe DeRosa and a fan at halftime of Tuesday's Game 2 of the Eastern Conference finals between Orlando and Boston.


    DeRosa was walking to the scorer's table to get the warm-up jackets for his crew, a common practice before the trio of referees leave the floor at intermission. A fan behind the table approached DeRosa, gesturing with his arms and appearing to be shouting at the veteran official.


    DeRosa flipped the game ball to the fan, who tossed it back. DeRosa then motioned for the man to be ejected by security.


    The NBA had no immediate comment, other than saying it was reviewing the matter.
    http://content.usatoday.com/communit...-invesitgate/1


    The NBA says it is investigating the peculiar run-in between a fan and veteran referee Joe DeRosa last night.


    Just before halftime, DeRosa headed toward courtside, where the spectator appeared to be heckling the ref from behind the scorer's table. DeRosa picked up a ball and threw it at the fan, who caught it and threw it back.


    Neither toss appeared to be particularly vicious, but when DeRosa caught the ball he called for security.


    The Orlando Sentinel says the fan is Wyndham Vacation Ownership CEO Franz Hanning, who was relocated to another seat. The Sentinel also says Hanning is an acquaintance of Boston Celtics coach Doc Rivers, who lives in Orlando.


    Check out the video, then vote on how the NBA should deal with the incident.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    I saw the replay on ESPN right after halftime -- ref sounds like he needs to relax and learn to walk away from hecklers.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    DeRosa should and probably will be suspended.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Rabbit ears and thin skin are not useful tools for a referee.
    ...Still "flying casual"
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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    He should have tossed the guy his whistle and offered to trade him spots for a quarter.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Obviously DeRosa should not have done what he did. he'll be fined and or suspended. he is a good ref and actually one of the cooler heads, this surprised me. he doesn't have a history.

    However, per usual I have a little different take. I don't think the fan should just get off scot free. First if you look at the replay, the fan was walking down right behind the scorers table (not like he was 20 rows up) he was very animated, obviously upset. Depending on what he said and there are witnesses, he should maybe have his season tickets revoked, or something less.

    I don't think fans should just be able to say anything they want whenever they want either to coaches, players, refs, other fans or who ever. It has gotten worse over the years and I do not for one minutes agree with the notion that well the fan paid for his seat he can say anything, short of throwing something he can do whatever he wants. I disagree 100%, fans need to be held to a higher standard.

    one thing that makes me sick is when i see a father and son at a game. The son might be 11 or 12 (not 17 or 18) still a little kid. The kid is yelling at the refs, (I don't care if the langauge is clean) or the kid is yelling at the other players and the father is laughing at the kid. if my kid ever did that I would tell him if he ever does that again he'll never go to another game with me ever again. Boo a ref's call, OK, boo an opposing player OK, but if my son ever did more than that he would be in a lot of trouble. But typically the father is laughing of course because where does the kid learn that behavior - the father of course.

    When I see that it bothers me.

    OK off of the soapbox
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 05-20-2010 at 09:08 AM.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    If DeRosa calls for the guy to be ejected before tossing the ball at him, fine.

    If security does their job and escorts the guy away without intervention, fine.

    But to toss the ball at the fan, get it tossed (not thrown, tossed) back, and THEN call for an ejection? That is ridiculous.

    On the yelling at refs - if the language is proper, it may be bad sportsmanship but it isn't an offense that deserves being kicked out of the game or having one's tickets pulled. If you are disrupting the flow of the game or interfering with action on the floor (this wasn't, it was half time) or are bothering the fans around you (again, half time, so moving around is happening), that's deserving of it.

    When I am at a game, the guy shouting at the players and the refs whose head is in the game is FAR less disturbing than the row of pre-teen girls who scream constantly at the top of their lungs in order to cheer the team on.
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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    one thing that makes me sick is when i see a father and son at a game. The son might be 11 or 12 (not 17 or 18) still a little kid. The kid is yelling at the refs, (I don't care if the langauge is clean) or the kid is yelling at the other players and the father is laughing at the kid. if my kid ever did that I would tell him if he ever does that again he'll never go to another game with me ever again. Boo a ref's call, OK, boo an opposing player OK, but if my son ever did more than that he would be in a lot of trouble. But typically the father is laughing of course because where does the kid learn that behavior - the father of course.

    When I see that it bothers me.
    Name calling or general abuse, sure.

    Yelling about a specific call with specific reasoning? Why isn't that part of being a fan?

    Sportsmanship doesn't mean ignoring faults, it means being fair and appropriate.
    BillS

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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Name calling or general abuse, sure.

    Yelling about a specific call with specific reasoning? Why isn't that part of being a fan?

    Sportsmanship doesn't mean ignoring faults, it means being fair and appropriate.

    I've yelled at refs on a few occasions. (although I think there should be a rule that the fan needs to know the name of the ref because yelling at them, always cracks me up when I hear a fan yell at number 24, I figure if you don't know that 24 is Joey Crawford then you have no right to yel. OK, I'm half kidding here) I've yelled, at the refs, watch traveling, call it both ways, that was a horrible call. But I've never walked down to right behind the scorers table and yelled at the refs when they are walking in my direction. i think that is uncalled for and over the line.

    Most of the stuff I hear that bothers me is when fans get personal. But then I get mad at the fans when they boo or yell at a ref when the call is the right call.

    BillS When I am at a game, the guy shouting at the players and the refs whose head is in the game is FAR less disturbing than the row of pre-teen girls who scream constantly at the top of their lungs in order to cheer the team on.
    I'll agree with you there, even though I think the fan yelling at the ref is still an idiot. I think I'm getting old stuff that never used to bother me does now
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 05-20-2010 at 09:56 AM.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    UB, I don't think the guy walked down there specifically to yell at the ref...I assume that the Magic likely have something similar to the Best Locker Room at Conseco and that this guy was probably going there at halftime. He's the CEO of Wydham hotels or whatever, and a friend of Doc Rivers? I'd imagine he has pretty good seats.

    Who knows what he said, we might never find out, but DeRosa has probably heard worse things in his career.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Indy View Post
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    UB, I don't think the guy walked down there specifically to yell at the ref...I assume that the Magic likely have something similar to the Best Locker Room at Conseco and that this guy was probably going there at halftime. He's the CEO of Wydham hotels or whatever, and a friend of Doc Rivers? I'd imagine he has pretty good seats.

    Who knows what he said, we might never find out, but DeRosa has probably heard worse things in his career.
    I realize that, it was jsut the start of halftime, so I know he didn't walk down there to yell at the ref. But the fact is he was standing up there yelling at the ref as the ref was walking towards the scorers table, that is more than your typical fan in his seats yelling at a ref, it is more threatening. I just think all the factors make the situation worse, yes I'm sure the ref has heard worse, but it is different because of these circumstances.

    And my more general point is the fact that the ref has heard worse is a huge problem IMO. Refs shouldn't have to put up with that from the fans.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    DeRosa should have done what most of the refereeing fraternity does in this instance... Walked up, grabbed his jacket & walked away. There wasn't much chance for a physical interaction with the scorers table and people at said table between the two. I'd imagine if the fan was being belligerent for much longer, someone at the press table would have had the guy escorted away. It seemed like the situation would have defused itself if DeRosa wouldn't have used poor judgement.

    Also, it looked like DeRosa didn't just toss the ball. It looked like he tried to give him a "Spalding tattoo" right off his face.

    I don't think a dissertation on fan behavior is needed because DeRosa is just wrong in this instance. Sticks and Stones...
    ...Still "flying casual"
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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    They're both wrong. DeRosa the worse of the two given their roles.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    They're both wrong. DeRosa the worse of the two given their roles.
    Judging by the fans body language... I'd assume that the fan probably did use profanity or said something that he probably shouldn't have. But, what if he said that his Blind Grandmother could ref a better game then you're doing with the same animations.

    Is the fan still in the wrong?

    Maybe DeRosa "tossed" him the ball and said, "You think you can do a better job, hotshot?"

    Who knows.... I'm just having a hard time blaming the fan without hearing what he had to say... ..and even hearing it STILL doesn't justify DeRosa's action!
    ...Still "flying casual"
    @roaminggnome74

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    They're both wrong. DeRosa the worse of the two given their roles.
    I'd probably say the fan was slightly worse given what I know of the incident

    Overall I don't think this is a big incident either way. I'm more concerned though about fan behavior that is worse than this

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Roaming Gnome View Post
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    Judging by the fans body language... I'd assume that the fan probably did use profanity or said something that he probably shouldn't have. But, what if he said that his Blind Grandmother could ref a better game then you're doing with the same animations.

    Is the fan still in the wrong?

    Maybe DeRosa "tossed" him the ball and said, "You think you can do a better job, hotshot?"

    Who knows.... I'm just having a hard time blaming the fan without hearing what he had to say... ..and even hearing it STILL doesn't justify DeRosa's action!
    There's different shades of wrong.

    I'm thinking wrong in the "you look stupid and shouldn't do it" sense, not "how terrible!".

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I'd probably say the fan was slightly worse given what I know of the incident
    Wait - throwing something from the floor into the stands is not worse than mouthing off?

    Is it just because it was a ref?
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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    Obviously DeRosa should not have done what he did. he'll be fined and or suspended. he is a good ref and actually one of the cooler heads, this surprised me. he doesn't have a history.

    However, per usual I have a little different take. I don't think the fan should just get off scot free. First if you look at the replay, the fan was walking down right behind the scorers table (not like he was 20 rows up) he was very animated, obviously upset. Depending on what he said and there are witnesses, he should maybe have his season tickets revoked, or something less.

    I don't think fans should just be able to say anything they want whenever they want either to coaches, players, refs, other fans or who ever. It has gotten worse over the years and I do not for one minutes agree with the notion that well the fan paid for his seat he can say anything, short of throwing something he can do whatever he wants. I disagree 100%, fans need to be held to a higher standard.

    one thing that makes me sick is when i see a father and son at a game. The son might be 11 or 12 (not 17 or 18) still a little kid. The kid is yelling at the refs, (I don't care if the langauge is clean) or the kid is yelling at the other players and the father is laughing at the kid. if my kid ever did that I would tell him if he ever does that again he'll never go to another game with me ever again. Boo a ref's call, OK, boo an opposing player OK, but if my son ever did more than that he would be in a lot of trouble. But typically the father is laughing of course because where does the kid learn that behavior - the father of course.

    When I see that it bothers me.

    OK off of the soapbox
    I do agree the fans should be held to a higher standard, but I think the refs should be held to the highest standard. Fans are going to get mad, after all fan is short for "fanatical".

    I do not think the fan should have his ticket revoked, but him losing ticket right for 5 or 10 games would not bother me

    With that said I have to agree with your last point.

    Last year at the Cowboys game (I was in the dream seats, the ones right behind the teams benches) I was next to a guy who was tauning our old kicker. Sorry, I am drawing a blank on his name. He was yelling things like "You Mother F'ing suck" and "Go F yourself you f'ing traitor"

    The security guy asked him to calm down, and he responded by saying "My daughter may only be 7 but she is used to this kind of language".

    While I agree it is ok to taunt the other teams and even yell at the refs, there is a fine line that should not be crossed.

    With all that said, if the ref just walks away none of this happens and this conversation is not happening

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    FWIW, the fan was not ejected, he was simply relocated

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I'd probably say the fan was slightly worse given what I know of the incident

    Overall I don't think this is a big incident either way. I'm more concerned though about fan behavior that is worse than this
    The ref is a PAID PROFESSIONAL. Getting heckled is part of his job discription. It comes with the territory.

    Does it make it right what the fan said/did? Not even close. But you cannot control what the fans do. You can control your own actions. No matter what the fan said/did some other fan has said/did something worse probably that very night.

    Refs are a part of the NBA, and the NBA is going to be judged by their actions. The fan is just some nameless schmuck that won't get any attention if the ref just walks away.

    Obviously what the ref did was worse, because his actions are what is making this an "incident." The ref doesn't throw the ball to him, and no one is wiser about what happened.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Just because people give refs **** doesn't mean they're entitled to it or that the refs are forced to accept it.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Just because people give refs **** doesn't mean they're entitled to it or that the refs are forced to accept it.
    That's very true. But there are rules in place to handle "out of control" fans. Tell security to give them a warning, or tell them to leave the arena.

    Security is there for a reason. Use them.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Obviously the Magic didn't think the guy was too out of control if they didn't even remove him from the arena....

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    I can't, for the life of me, understand how you can back the ref up in this situation.

    If he can't handle criticism, something tells me, he's in the wrong profession.

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    Default Re: Referee DeRosa tosses ball at fan

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Just because people give refs **** doesn't mean they're entitled to it or that the refs are forced to accept it.
    Hey if DeRosa wanted to toss the ball at the dude's face I don't care...but he should be ready to face the repercussions that deal with it.

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