Results 1 to 14 of 14

Thread: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

  1. #1
    Banned
    Join Date
    Nov 2009
    Posts
    1,150

    Default Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Really interesting read in ESPN insider regarding how long the high school to pro guys are going to be able to play.
    Because they started so young they SOUND young even after 10 years in the league. But there is significant evidence and the belief of several team management people that it's not age that matter, but the number of games played. That there are only so many games in an NBA players body and it matters less the biological age that the miles on the meter. The grind of the long season, the travel and practice and playing through injuries all add up and take a large toll.
    There's is a long list of HS'ers that were very good players and then faded badly as the miles mounted on their bodies at very Young (comparatively) ages (30ish). TMac is one of the prime examples. From dominant to irrelevant at an awfully young age. Bodies breaking down from the grind and the beating they take in the NBA as teenagers not yet totally developed physically. Pretty good list of high schoolers who's NBA careers ended early due to injury or general physical developmental problem, like Benders knee problems. Will be interesting to see what happens with Labron as he was so advanced physically for his age.
    Also, most of the high schoolers were physical specimens that were often skywalkers that played above the rim. You are going to get hurt more when you are that far off the ground. The falls are harder.
    The thinking is the 4 college years are critical in physical development in athletics. That the college games 35 game schedule and easier practice etc don't accumulate nearly the wear and tear that a 100 game NBA season does. (what a shock)
    So that the 4 year guys SHOULD end up playing to an older chronological age and with some exceptions, they do.
    In particular, Kobe has played 13 years in the league already though he's only 31. Most people look at his age and assume he's got another 5 good years in him. That Could be way off. He's already played more games than John Havlicek played in his career. Oscar Robertson. Jerry West. Guys that were around FOREVER it seemed.
    Lebron has already played around (I think) 250 more games at the same age as Michael Jordan played. So even though he's only 25, he's got a lot of miles on the odometer.

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    3,440

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    It's a valid point.

    At the same time, guys like Ralph Sampson, Bill Walton, Brad Daugherty, Christian Laettner and countless other 3/4 year college players broke down early as well.

    For a 31 year old, Kobe is in remarkably good shape physically. He's still very much at the top of his game. Kerry Kittles was a 4 year college player from the same draft and ended up broken down way earlier.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    The NBA season is probably the most grueling job in pro sports. The human body is just not made to withstand that type of intense physical punishment. Thankfully modern science and medicine has helped quite a bit. How many guys have blown out their ACLs and returned to have a decent careers? Quite a few. And that was just not possible even 30 years ago. It was over for pro sports when the knees gave out.

    For a guy like Kobe to stay in the league for 13 years, and still be at the top of his game, as in MVP calibre, is quite an achievement. I think guys like him are the exception not the norm.

    As much as we humans like to think we are the pinnacle of evolution on the planet... we aren't. And our bodies have alot of limitations... knees are at the top of the list. As Darwin said, "Man still bears in his bodily frame the indelible stamp of his lowly origin."

  4. #4

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    I'd say that, the specific characteristics that differentiate each
    player (body type, playing style, etc.) notwithstanding, the key
    variable is total minutes played, not total games.

  5. #5
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Downtown baby
    Posts
    12,628

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Quote Originally Posted by Thingfish View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    As much as we humans like to think we are the pinnacle of evolution on the planet... we aren't. And our bodies have alot of limitations... knees are at the top of the list. As Darwin said, "Man still bears in his bodily frame the indelible stamp of his lowly origin."
    I've posted this before, but from an engineering standpoint the human body is a disaster waiting to happen. If it were a car, plane or elevator you wouldn't trust your life to it. Those other systems have 5-10 times more redundancy, perhaps more than that.

    Elevators have multiple cables, brakes that lock if the cable snaps, etc, things that mean its failure point runs perhaps 600-700% above it's normal operating level.

    Meanwhile things like the liver or tendons have failure points perhaps just 110% of normal operating levels, meaning they are constantly on the fringe of failure.

    Of course this is evolution at work. Redundancy and safety are costs the human machine can't waste resources on. It's runs about as lean as it can.

    It's almost a miracle it can handle things like professional sports at all. Adaptation is a great thing...just ask D Blair.

  6. #6
    Pacer Pride, Colts Strong Kid Minneapolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    4,646

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Human body is amazing.

    I think it has more to do with the individual make-up than "miles", although it's definitely a factor. Put two people through the same grueling physical abuse, and one is going it handle it better than the other. Reggie Miller played 18 freakin' years and look at his body-type. Bender wasn't much different (tall, skinny) and his career never got off the ground. Oden goes about 2 weeks between season-ending injuries, all he has to do is look at his legs and something fails.

    Jermaine is definitely showing wear-and-tear at a relatively young age, but look at Garnett... he's not what he used to be, but he's still really effective. Kobe is a fantastic physical specimen, I could see him going for another 5 years, despite the "miles already logged". He's like Reggie in his regimen. With LeBron, I could completely see "bulk" becoming a problem for him in 8-9 years. But I could be wrong.

    I think the person who baffles me the most is Shaq. A dude that large isn't supposed to still be playing, and somewhat effectively, at that. The feet/knees shoulda gave out by now, but he still looks pretty good. Sure he misses some time, but to me it's amazing he is still doing this. He's *massive*.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 03-27-2010 at 11:34 AM.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

  7. #7
    Member idioteque's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    washington dc
    Age
    28
    Posts
    9,615

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Kobe's reign may be short? Kobe's already had a long reign. He has won 4 titles this decade, which rivals the 6 titles that MJ won. If he had to retire tomorrow, one could say without fear that he had a long, successful career. I don't get it.

  8. #8

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Quote Originally Posted by Thingfish
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    As much as we humans like to think we are the pinnacle of evolution on the planet... we aren't.

    So, which other species, "likes to think it is the pinnacle of evolution on the planet" . . . and is?

    Cats?


    .
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to Putnam For This Useful Post:


  10. #9
    - .-- ... ... Natston's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Centralia, Pennsylvania
    Age
    31
    Posts
    8,355
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short


  11. #10

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Quote Originally Posted by Seth
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I've posted this before, but from an engineering standpoint the human body is a disaster waiting to happen. If it were a car, plane or elevator you wouldn't trust your life to it.
    Point well taken, Seth. I leave the engineering point to your expertise, but you leave out one consideration.

    When you speak of machines you talk about task they are designed for. When you talk about humans, you talk about extreme task that go against their design.

    Yes, the human knee is way too fragile for repeated jumping and hard landings. But neither could you drop a bulldozer 40 feet and expect no damage. I tried to mix concrete in my wife's blender and the darn thing broke right down. If I tried to pull a plow or push a skid of bricks with my Ford Taurus, it would break down as quickly as a NFL lineman does.

    This is what you're saying here:
    It's almost a miracle it can handle things like professional sports at all.
    Research I've read suggests that optimal human physical health came in the paleolithic times, when men's days were filled with almost constant, gentle movement in searching for food, punctuated with occasional brief chases and tussles to bring down game. This is what we were designed for.

    Repetitive industrial processes, sedentary office work and TV-watcher vegetativeness, and extreme sports activities are all working against the human design, aren't they?



    .
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Putnam For This Useful Post:


  13. #11
    Custom User Titleist
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Pacer Purgatory Praying for Paul
    Posts
    3,565
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Point well taken, Seth. I leave the engineering point to your expertise, but you leave out one consideration.

    When you speak of machines you talk about task they are designed for. When you talk about humans, you talk about extreme task that go against their design.

    Yes, the human knee is way too fragile for repeated jumping and hard landings. But neither could you drop a bulldozer 40 feet and expect no damage. I tried to mix concrete in my wife's blender and the darn thing broke right down. If I tried to pull a plow or push a skid of bricks with my Ford Taurus, it would break down as quickly as a NFL lineman does.

    This is what you're saying here:


    Research I've read suggests that optimal human physical health came in the paleolithic times, when men's days were filled with almost constant, gentle movement in searching for food, punctuated with occasional brief chases and tussles to bring down game. This is what we were designed for.

    Repetitive industrial processes, sedentary office work and TV-watcher vegetativeness, and extreme sports activities are all working against the human design, aren't they?



    .
    Poorly adapted from the boys from Liverpool,

    There may have been some evolution, well you know
    Changes coming from our past.

    Some say this at their institutions, well you know
    Changes make us longer last...

    And you know its gonna be
    Alright!

    Alright!

    Alright!

    Alright!

    Alright!

  14. #12

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    So, which other species, "likes to think it is the pinnacle of evolution on the planet" . . . and is?

    Cats?
    I didn't say any other species on the planet does think that.

  15. #13
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    3,440

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    Quote Originally Posted by dcpacersfan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Kobe's reign may be short? Kobe's already had a long reign. He has won 4 titles this decade, which rivals the 6 titles that MJ won. If he had to retire tomorrow, one could say without fear that he had a long, successful career. I don't get it.
    Yeah, seriously.

    Guy is 31 years old and right now he's the 2nd best player in the league. He's been in the league 13 years and is still going strong. If that's a short reign, then I'd be curious to know what a long reign looks like.

    College playing guys like Steve Francis and Mike Bibby had the same kind of drop offs in their games in their late 20s due to physical deterioration the same way as McGrady and Jermaine.

  16. #14
    It is ka Thankee sai Major Cold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Garrett, IN
    Posts
    9,117
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Kobe and Lebrons reign may be short

    I would have to agree with Putty. All animals are designed within their prescribed capabilities. Stick a seal in the Sahara and he dies of dehydration. They were created to thrive in marine life.

    The human body has the capability to withstand the trauma that athletes endure, but after awhile the constant persistent motion and trauma is what tears apart the body.

    Linecum will win more Cy Youngs than any pitcher of this era because he maximizes the body. His form utilizes more than just the arm. From the toes to the hips to the shoulders to his neck posture. His Sandy Koufax form is impecabble. Kerry Wood gassed because of his form. Greg Maddox endure because his form is through and not based on power.

    The average pitcher has 20% less strech in his delivery than Lincecum.

    Each pitch stresses the shoulders to 97% capacity. The follow through is what stresses the joints more than anything. It is how you stop.

    I don't think early hunters and gathers were worrying about a 98 MPH cut fast spear.

    They just wanted to eat.

    This topic is one big Woolly Mammoth ready to be speared by an admin though.

Similar Threads

  1. OT: Arenas Sounds off on his critics and questions Kobe (SI.com)
    By avoidingtheclowns in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 37
    Last Post: 11-04-2007, 02:05 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •