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Thread: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

  1. #1

    Default Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Nice comments here about Hibbert's teammates, and about the NBA refs!


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    Playing time rises for Pacers' Hibbert

    Stay out of foul trouble, then stay on the floor


    By Mike Wells
    Posted: March 23, 2010

    http://www.indystar.com/article/2010...Pacers-Hibbert

    Dealing with Roy Hibbert's foul trouble was a given last season for the Indiana Pacers. It was a constant problem for the rookie center.Hibbert averaged more than three fouls in just 14 minutes a game last season. His constant foul problems kept him saddled to the bench most of his rookie season, stunting his development.

    Hibbert hasn't had the same problem this season, and it's paying off on both ends of the court.

    He again is averaging more than three fouls, but he is able to play nearly 25 minutes a game.

    "I was trying to work on my fouling all summer, but unfortunately it's taken me this long to get the hang of it," Hibbert said. "I just have to keep learning."

    The biggest thing Hibbert had to learn was to not swat at every shot, which happened a lot when he slid over to help out. He learned he could have just as much impact by jumping with his arms straight up, taking full advantage of his 7-2 frame.

    Hibbert's teammates try to help by approaching the officials and asking what he can do to avoid being whistled for a foul.
    "The league has really good refs and they talk to you and try to explain things to you," Hibbert said. "They tell me to go straight up, don't jump toward them. Most teammates don't even care. My teammates care about me and I appreciate that."

    How dramatic has the change been? Last season, it seemed every questionable call went against Hibbert. This season, opposing coaches and players sometimes complain that a foul isn't called against him.

    Hibbert has fouled out just four times in 70 games this season. He has had five or six fouls just four times in the past 22 games.

    "He's doing a very good job of keeping his nose between the ball and the basket," coach Jim O'Brien said. "I think the officials across the league have done a real good job at calling the verticality rule as well.
    "I think they're doing a good job of not bailing the drivers out. As a result, that has helped Roy's guts to step in front of people."

    Hibbert's ability to stay out of foul trouble has helped his offense. He played a career-high 43 minutes against Detroit last week. He has scored at least 20 points in four of the past eight games.

    "I want to be the aggressor going up there, changing shots, blocking shots, and when I'm on offense, going to the basket strong," he said. "Even if I do miss around the paint, hopefully I put pressure on other teams to collapse on me. Like I said, I'm a giver. I'll kick it out to open guys."

    The longer he's on the court, the more likely the Pacers will make him a focal point.

    "He would get the ball under the basket earlier in the year and throw up a shot," point guard Earl Watson said. "Now if he gets the ball out of position under the basket, you see him take power dribbles. To see him take a power dribble and still finish is amazing growth because he did it all within the same season."
    Last edited by Putnam; 03-23-2010 at 09:33 AM.
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Great article.

  4. #3

    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    "The league has really good refs and they talk to you and try to explain things to you," Hibbert said.

    Yep. It is good that Hibbert has this attitude, and that he's building this kind of rapport with the officials.


    .
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  5. #4
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Ok, now it's just getting silly.
    Quote Originally Posted by Wells View Post
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    How dramatic has the change been? Last season, it seemed every questionable call went against Hibbert. This season, opposing coaches and players sometimes complain that a foul isn't called against him.

    Hibbert has fouled out just four times in 70 games this season. He has had five or six fouls just four times in the past 22 games.
    Didn't Obie have a quote just half a dozen games ago where he said he'd start giving Roy more minutes when he learned how to cut down on his fouls?

    This is the same crap as with Rush. Marked improvement, but the coach is the last to notice. An article talking about how much the young player needs to improve without noting that it's already been improved. Then, a couple weeks later, an article about the amazing turnaround over the past three months that somehow neglects to mention the existence of the earlier article.

    With Rush, I just laughed it off. But twice is just silly. What's next? An article on how AJ Price is finally learning how to run the offense?

    This isn't just Obie, by the way. Wells missed on this one as well.
    Last edited by Anthem; 03-23-2010 at 08:47 AM.
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    A quick search shows this is the SECOND time it's happened with Hibbert, actually. The last time was the less-than-one-week interval between "It's hard to play Roy because he messes up our passing game" and "Hibbert is an excellent scorer but our game plan is for him to try scoring first and only pass as a second option."

    http://www.pacersdigest.com/showthread.php?t=51686
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Hibbert's teammates try to help by approaching the officials and asking what he can do to avoid being whistled for a foul.
    "The league has really good refs and they talk to you and try to explain things to you," Hibbert said. "They tell me to go straight up, don't jump toward them. Most teammates don't even care. My teammates care about me and I appreciate that."


    This is something I was very impressed by. I remember a recent game where Roy got an early foul and both Danny and Murphy went directly to the ref and started talking about it on Roy's behalf. I have rarely seen this type of thing in the NBA let alone the Pacers.

    It made me appreciate Troy and Danny for doing that. In fact, I've seen Troy do several things that were good for team chemistry like this, recently. I just wanted to give credit where it was due, imo. Nice work!!

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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Ok, now it's just getting silly.

    Didn't Obie have a quote just half a dozen games ago where he said he'd start giving Roy more minutes when he learned how to cut down on his fouls?

    This is the same crap as with Rush. Marked improvement, but the coach is the last to notice.

    Yes. You block signatures on this forum, so you haven't seen the sig I've had for the past few weeks:

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam's signature
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    He says what he says. He does what he does. But he doesn't do what he says.

    O'Brien's mendacity is one of the tragic casualties of this season. He used to be be refreshingly forthright and informative. But this season -- he's just not speaking the truth.



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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam View Post
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    Yes. You block signatures on this forum, so you haven't seen the sig I've had for the past few weeks:
    Oh man, don't get me started. Blocking signatures makes everything on PD so much better.

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam
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    O'Brien's mendacity is one of the tragic casualties of this season. He used to be be refreshingly forthright and informative. But this season -- he's just not speaking the truth.
    Yeah, I hadn't thought about that but it's an interesting point. When he got here I enjoyed how straight up he was with the press. That's definitely been a change.
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    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Ok, now it's just getting silly.

    Didn't Obie have a quote just half a dozen games ago where he said he'd start giving Roy more minutes when he learned how to cut down on his fouls?

    With Rush, I just laughed it off. But twice is just silly. What's next? An article on how AJ Price is finally learning how to run the offense?

    This isn't just Obie, by the way. Wells missed on this one as well.
    Is this Wells countering something O'Brien said? IOW, did the article a few weeks ago revolve around what O'Brien was telling him and then this one is a subtle dig at O'Brien because Wells didn't agree and so followed it up with research to counter it?

    IOW is Wells' reporting all over the map or is he on a mission to show O'Brien either doesn't know what he's talking about, says whatever he thinks you want to hear, or says whatever he wants to make his point (facts forgotten)?

    I hate to go back and read old Pacer articles... I just want the season to end...
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    I just want the season to end...

    Circle the date of April 15, the 2010 will be officially over or late night April 14, whichever brings quicker relieve.

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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Roy's play and enthusiasm have been the best part of the season for me. He is going to be one hell of a leader on this team in the near future, IMO.
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    He and Danny are making the future look great. They will be the leaders of this winning team down the road.

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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    Hibbert's teammates try to help by approaching the officials and asking what he can do to avoid being whistled for a foul.
    "The league has really good refs and they talk to you and try to explain things to you," Hibbert said. "They tell me to go straight up, don't jump toward them. Most teammates don't even care. My teammates care about me and I appreciate that."


    This is something I was very impressed by. I remember a recent game where Roy got an early foul and both Danny and Murphy went directly to the ref and started talking about it on Roy's behalf. I have rarely seen this type of thing in the NBA let alone the Pacers.

    It made me appreciate Troy and Danny for doing that. In fact, I've seen Troy do several things that were good for team chemistry like this, recently. I just wanted to give credit where it was due, imo. Nice work!!
    While perhaps a bit off topic...I'm compelled to say that this is a reason why you don't want your players "giving up" on the season by sending the message that you want them to tank. It's not that they're playing for hope of a playoff spot or anything like that, or even for next year when many of them could be moved, they're playing for right now. Our guys are out there for each other, not riding the bench thinking about where they're going to be next season. Which it would be very easy for Troy and some of these other guys to do.

    They are sending the right message to Hibbert, and Rush and everyone else who's only going to get better. That message is play hard every night, and improve in every game.

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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by ToasterBusVIP View Post
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    While perhaps a bit off topic...I'm compelled to say that this is a reason why you don't want your players "giving up" on the season by sending the message that you want them to tank. It's not that they're playing for hope of a playoff spot or anything like that, or even for next year when many of them could be moved, they're playing for right now. Our guys are out there for each other, not riding the bench thinking about where they're going to be next season. Which it would be very easy for Troy and some of these other guys to do.

    They are sending the right message to Hibbert, and Rush and everyone else who's only going to get better. That message is play hard every night, and improve in every game.
    To play devil's advocate, isn't it possible to teach Hibbert and Rush this message ( to play hard every night, compete every second they are on the floor while improving their game ) while still playing AJ and McRoberts a consistent 20 mpg ( assuming that they have earned it ) for the rest of the season to evaluate/develop them?

    To me....it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive....moreso given our current standing in the Playoff hunt. For me, if I were to choose to play AJ and McRoberts a consistent # of minutes....I'm not telling the Team to go out and Tank....I'm telling them to go out there and do their best to win. Unless AJ and McRoberts are so bad that they are severely threatening any chance for the Team to really compete and they are showing to their teammates that they have earned the minutes in practice....I don't see much of a difference between playing AJ/McRoberts 10 minutes compared to 20 minutes. Besides.....even if they are making mistakes....the hope is that they are smart enough to learn from them now ( when it doesn't really matter if we win or lose ) instead of waiting another season to learn ( when it does matter whether we win or lose ).
    Last edited by CableKC; 03-23-2010 at 12:28 PM.
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Not to hijack the thread, but our chemistry as a team looks better lately. I think Roy is a large part of this. The guys seem to be celebrating more together on the sidelines and just look like they actually like one another.

    So the question is, is the better chemistry the reason for the recent improvement in play or is the improvement in play the reason for the better chemistry?

    Or do you think I'm wrong and we have the same chemistry we've had all season long?
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    His development has been the lone bright spot in an otherwise horrid season.

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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam View Post
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    mendacity



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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    To play devil's advocate, isn't it possible to teach Hibbert and Rush this message ( to play hard every night, compete every second they are on the floor while improving their game ) while still playing AJ and McRoberts a consistent 20 mpg ( assuming that they have earned it ) for the rest of the season to evaluate/develop them?

    To me....it doesn't have to be mutually exclusive....moreso given our current standing in the Playoff hunt. For me, if I were to choose to play AJ and McRoberts a consistent # of minutes....I'm not telling the Team to go out and Tank....I'm telling them to go out there and do their best to win. Unless AJ and McRoberts are so bad that they are severely threatening any chance for the Team to really compete and they are showing to their teammates that they have earned the minutes in practice....I don't see much of a difference between playing AJ/McRoberts 10 minutes compared to 20 minutes. Besides.....even if they are making mistakes....the hope is that they are smart enough to learn from them now ( when it doesn't really matter if we win or lose ) instead of waiting another season to learn ( when it does matter whether we win or lose ).
    Not unless the consensus thought is that those guys give you the best chance to win. Teaching a guy to give his all, and to rely on his teammates so that he doesn't have to feel like he's the only guy out there, that's really reliant on said player feeling like the coach (and the organization) is also putting full effort into winning. Why go out there and bust your hump to win if the coach is putting players on the floor with you that aren't the best you've got?

    I agree with the benefit of it, but I beleive that as a team and organization that's a path you don't want to go down. It's pretty special to be out of the playoffs (all but mathematically) and still have these guys playing as unselfishly as they are right now, I think that's an enthusiasm you get from beleiving that the guys around you, including the coach, are playing with the same kind of pride.

    That said, I think McR could be pushing Murphy for more minutes at this time, especially since you get different things from Josh. Might have been better served to see Hibbert + McRoberts paired up tonight especially when Roy got into foul trouble. Murphy grabbed a lot of rebounds tonight but did little else. There are times when Roy needs a more physical body to help down low and this was one of those times; Sunday against OKC the pairing worked well, so it's a tough call. Watson's really been making hay with his time and it's hard to make an argument for playing him significantly less.
    Last edited by ToasterBusVIP; 03-23-2010 at 11:43 PM.

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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by USF View Post
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    Not to hijack the thread, but our chemistry as a team looks better lately. I think Roy is a large part of this. The guys seem to be celebrating more together on the sidelines and just look like they actually like one another.

    So the question is, is the better chemistry the reason for the recent improvement in play or is the improvement in play the reason for the better chemistry?

    Or do you think I'm wrong and we have the same chemistry we've had all season long?
    I know one thing, Watson has been amazing lately. Roy is becoming the beneficiary of that, often as the 2nd or 3rd touch, but Watson's definitely responsible for the better ball movement.

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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by ToasterBusVIP View Post
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    I know one thing, Watson has been amazing lately. Roy is becoming the beneficiary of that, often as the 2nd or 3rd touch, but Watson's definitely responsible for the better ball movement.
    What I've noticed and found funny lately with Watson is he is doing the "TJ" a lot lately and penetrating and jumping into the air. The difference must be Earl's court vision because he is finding open teammates as opposed to throwing the ball 5 rows into the stands.

    I'm sure Earl's done this before, but I didn't notice him doing the "TJ" until the last few games. Has anyone else picked up on this?
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    Default Re: Star: Nice article on Hibbert's progress

    Quote Originally Posted by USF View Post
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    What I've noticed and found funny lately with Watson is he is doing the "TJ" a lot lately and penetrating and jumping into the air. The difference must be Earl's court vision because he is finding open teammates as opposed to throwing the ball 5 rows into the stands.

    I'm sure Earl's done this before, but I didn't notice him doing the "TJ" until the last few games. Has anyone else picked up on this?
    I've seen Earl do this before and commented on it as a bad habit.

    I agree that his seeming success is due to the way he sees the court. I've said before that TJ's problem seems to be that he decides what he is going to do long before he gets into the situation - if he guessed right, he looks great, but if he guessed wrong he gets stuck. I think Earl actually decides what to do based on what he sees and what happens, which makes him more likely to be successful even when he leaves his feet.
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