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Thread: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

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    Default The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    http://www.hoopsworld.com/Story.asp?story_id=15565

    The NBA's Sleeper at Center: Roy Hibbert

    There's no other way to say it - good big men in today's NBA are hard to find. If you can find a true back to the basket seven-footer today who can make it up and down the court without tripping over his own feet and who can catch the ball when it is thrown to him in the low-block you are doing pretty good. Most of the guys who are seven-feet tall and reasonably agile prefer to hover around the perimeter and shoot jumpers.

    Some have even made the argument the traditional center with back to the basket moves is all but dead in today's NBA. That seems to be the trend, but there are still a few guys in the league trying to prove that theory wrong.

    One of those guys is 7-foot-2 Roy Hibbert of the Indiana Pacers. The 23-year-old has steadily progressed during his season and a half in the NBA. His scoring is up over four points this season and his rebounds are up by nearly two. His blocked shots are also up this season.

    What's most interesting is Hibbert steadily improved during his four years at Georgetown, too. He's not a guy with explosive growth potential, but rather a guy whose growth kind of sneaks up on you.

    "I think he's progressed well," said Pacers head coach Jim O'Brien. "You know, for a guy who is in his second year I think he's had steady growth. He's gotten somewhat better at avoiding fouling and become much more effective as a scorer."

    While not aesthetically pleasing to watch, Hibbert's effectiveness as a scorer in the low block is catching the attention of many around the league. His pick-and-roll defense is also markedly improved when compared to where it was a season ago. Last season there were times where O'Brien couldn't keep him in the game to reap the benefits of his offense because opposing teams would simply put him in the pick-and-roll defensively on every possession.

    "His defense has improved tremendously," O'Brien remarked. "His speed and athleticism are what they are, but we're happy we got him in the late teens in the draft. We feel very confident that he was a good get for us."

    All told, it's not inconceivable to advance the idea that Hibbert could make an All-Star team or two before his career is over. Some of that may be more of a commentary about the relative dearth of true centers in today's game, but given the fact he was considered to be nothing more than a throw in as part of the trade that sent Jermaine O'Neal to the Raptors, the Pacers look like they might have found a diamond in the rough at a position of need for nearly every team in the Association
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    Headband and Rec Specs rexnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    He was a throw-in? What? Wasn't he the key to that trade for JO?

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Cool, love me some Hibbert! He has been progressing and the funny thing is he has also gain a bit of swagger. Would love to see him paired up with a PF to complement him and to see him get regular minutes, instead of the in and out game JOB plays.
    Avatar photo credit: Bahram Mark Sobhani - AP

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    He was a throw-in? What? Wasn't he the key to that trade for JO?
    Never mind that. O'Brien is quoted in that article as saying Hibbert was "a good get for us."

    "A good get?"







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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    He was a throw-in? What? Wasn't he the key to that trade for JO?

    That trade of JO was broken up into 3 parts:

    Ford PG of future
    Rasho expiring contract
    17th pick.

    I could see the pick, Hibbert, not being the primary part of the trade when it was done. Today it could be viewed differently.

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    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    He was a throw-in? What? Wasn't he the key to that trade for JO?
    No. The pick was part of the package, but at the time of the trade, it was impossible to say what the "key" was, and even more impossible to say that it was Hibbert, as we didn't even know who we'd get with the pick.

    "Throw in" is too casual of a characterization, but it was the 17th pick, so it likely was going to be of less value than Ford, and arguably wasn't any more important in the decision making process than Rasho's expiring.

    However, he has been far and away the best ting about this year's Pacers.

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    JO was traded to shed salary more quickly. TJ was supposed to be a good addition. Rasho was a good rental. Roy was pretty much a gift.

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Maybe I had different expectations of the trade, but I always thought the 17 pick and Rasho's salary dump were the target.

    In fact, I think that expirings and a 17 pick were far too much value for an overpaid and broken down JO. Toronto wanted to dump Ford so they could funnel a ton of money into Jose, so taking him back made the trade a little more bearable to Toronto.

    The fact that Ford would then be the best PG on our team at the time not named Tinsley, made swallowing his contract a little easier. I'm pretty sure that if TPTB would have had the option of replacing Ford with another expiring, we would have gone that route instead.

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam View Post
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    Never mind that. O'Brien is quoted in that article as saying Hibbert was "a good get for us."

    "A good get?"

    Don't you get it?

    Now, to get on with it, the cool but lazy British folk and tennis players have apparently used this word this way for long enough that it is part of their slang to mean roughly achieving or acquiring something that ordinarily would be out of reach for some reason.

    So, apparently O'Brien believes that the Pacers should not have been able to acquire a player of Hibbert's skills given their position in the draft.

    Hope you consider this explanation legitimate (!).

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Brad8888 View Post
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    Don't you get it?

    Now, to get on with it, the cool but lazy British folk and tennis players have apparently used this word this way for long enough that it is part of their slang to mean roughly achieving or acquiring something that ordinarily would be out of reach for some reason.

    So, apparently O'Brien believes that the Pacers should not have been able to acquire a player of Hibbert's skills given their position in the draft.

    Hope you consider this explanation legitimate (!).

    Legitimate? Maybe.

    But Brit-speak is definitely not relevant!
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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Putnam View Post
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    Legitimate? Maybe.

    But Brit-speak is definitely not relevant!





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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    I am really confused, I thought Jim O'Brien ruined everyone of our young players. what happened here

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I am really confused, I thought Jim O'Brien ruined everyone of our young players. what happened here
    Buck, really, what does this get you?

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I am really confused, I thought Jim O'Brien ruined everyone of our young players. what happened here
    Many of us are envisioning what his potential is, including the "man behind the curtain" who considers him a good get, as much as we are recognizing his acheivement so far. I can't wait to see what a big man coach at the NBA level will be able to help him develop into!

    Roy has a fantastic overall attitude and that has helped him persevere so far. That nearly as praiseworthy as his play so far, IMO.

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    Buck, really, what does this get you?
    I think it gets him out of his boredom, sometimes. I think he just wants somebody to "play" with.

    Actually, he is just a staunch advocate of his own position and expresses it when he thinks it is appropriate, and that is admirable in the face of the resistance he has faced here all year, and parts of last.

    I mean this. Good job standing up for your position, UB.

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    Buck, really, what does this get you?
    I have pretty much checked out for the rest of the season. But I wanted to make a point that the posts that have claimed and there have been a number of them that Jim O'Brien has done long term damage to our franchise and more specifically long term damage to our young players - the common phrase being they "might not ever recover for this coach" or "if they ever do it will be several years before they recover"

    This was my way of very succinctly making the point that Roy has seemed to have weathered O'Brien pretty well. Roy is where he should be

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Brad8888 View Post
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    Many of us are envisioning what his potential is, including the "man behind the curtain" who considers him a good get, as much as we are recognizing his acheivement so far. I can't wait to see what a big man coach at the NBA level will be able to help him develop into!

    Roy has a fantastic overall attitude and that has helped him persevere so far. That nearly as praiseworthy as his play so far, IMO.
    Which is exactly why we need to bring in Patrick Ewing in some capacity. Whether he gets a role as an assistant coach, or just a personal tutor for Roy, Ewing or Olajuwon (who makes himself pretty available to tutor players) would do wonders for developing Roy into an All-Star center.
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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    But I wanted to make a point that the posts that have claimed and there have been a number of them that Jim O'Brien has done long term damage to our franchise and more specifically long term damage to our young players - the common phrase being they "might not ever recover for this coach" or "if they ever do it will be several years before they recover"
    UB, it seems to me that you mostly address the extreme elements (for lack of a better term) these days while ignoring a rather significant population of us who have various issues with the coaching philosophy and management behavior but do not use terms to designed to vilify JOB, do not claim he is the worst coach ever or a nasty human being, do not engage in "Player X is garbage," etc. Yet you will pop into a thread and throw your punch in the direction of that extreme edge, even if none of them has actually posted anything like the point you're railing against yet. For instance, here we have a thread where people were attempting to feel good about Hibbert's development. It was a mostly JOB free discussion until you focused the thread in that direction. When you do this, it tends to bring your foils out of the woodwork and then...it's on.

    I find it both comical and disappointing that many of your comments seem to be in response to a hodgepodge of arguments made by your biggest critics over the last several months and when you respond you often act as if everyone who has a gripe about JOB shares that exact view or is coming from that exact place. Personally, I know that I have tried multiple times to offer some moderate, less heated views in some of these areas but you will just skip right over it in favor of having the same conversation with the same folks over and over again, or with the spirit of their argument if they don't happen to be present! At this point you guys seem to need each other - I am not at all certain extreme JOB supporters or extreme JOB detractors would know what to say if you didn't have each other to bounce off of.

    I think there are a number of things about this season and the tone on this board that are making some of us more combative than normal and I have noticed that some other posters I consider fairly moderate have dropped out of these conversations or are posting much less now. For the most part I've done the same and am pretty numbed out on the whole JOB thing, but I am still lurking and this one grabbed my attention. To be clear, I am certainly not saying that the somewhat nasty tone that permeates much of the board is your fault, UB. You are just one guy, after all. I guess I am asking you to consider the idea that not allowing yourself to get stuck in a tunnel where all you see are JOB haters would be good for you and us.

    Last edited by gummy; 03-16-2010 at 03:21 PM.
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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    gummy - you make an excellent point, you really do, I should have just stayed out of it or at the very least kept O'Brien out of the discussion, I apologize.

    (although I don't consider those who suggest that Jim has either done long term damage to the franchise or long term damage to the young players to be extreme - in fact if I spent 20 minutes I think I could find 20-30 posts from different posters who make that claim and many of them very well respected posters)

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    gummy - you make an excellent point, you really do, I should have just stayed out of it or at the very least kept O'Brien out of the discussion, I apologize.

    (although I don't consider those who suggest that Jim has either done long term damage to the franchise or long term damage to the young players to be extreme - in fact if I spent 20 minutes I think I could find 20-30 posts from different posters who make that claim and many of them very well respected posters)


    Maybe I look at it differently, but I see checks and balences. I was impressed with what JOB did last year. Very impressed as I thought he got more out of this team then a lo9t of coaches would have. The team was in most games, exciting to watch, had a "team mentality", and I thought JOB was a big reason

    then someone "flipped a switch"

    This season has been a complete turn around and it seems the players are tunning out JOB

    I like Buck's positioning if not for any other reason then

    He doesnt wine and complain like a lot of us (definitley myslef included)

    Of course I am also thinking he is the "mysterious consultant" annoymnously listed on the Pacers PR payroll
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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    (although I don't consider those who suggest that Jim has either done long term damage to the franchise or long term damage to the young players to be extreme - in fact if I spent 20 minutes I think I could find 20-30 posts from different posters who make that claim and many of them very well respected posters)
    You might be right about that - perhaps I am underestimating the number of posts that say that particular thing. Although when I used "extreme" earlier I wasn't meaning to say much about how many posts/posters there might be, it was more a comment on the quality of the posts. One of my main points was that no one in this thread was making that argument, they were just discussing a positive article about Hibbert, so perhaps it was extreme to inject it. Hmmm, probably not extreme, just unfortunate. Anyway, I appreciate your acknowledgment of the point.

    On the other hand, I think it is much more reasonable to wonder about or attempt to make an argument about the impact JOB has had on the players and franchise than it is to post about how JOB is so horrible he must be an idiot. It's a matter of degrees and I am suggesting that many folks have lost their ability to distinguish between those degrees because of the vast amount of anger and frustration the events of this season seem to be generating.

    Mostly, I am just depressed by the amount of bickering on the board these days...almost more so than I am about the season itself.
    Last edited by gummy; 03-16-2010 at 04:14 PM.
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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    Roy has not been too damaged by JOB because Roy has an exceptional, extraordinary attitude. He easily could have been damaged by JOB.

    There's another sophomore on the team that just may have received said damage.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: The NBA's Sleeper at Center - Hibbert gets some praise

    I've heard Roy=Smits with a little added joy. Smits took 4 years to develop. Fingers crossed.

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