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Thread: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

  1. #26
    Member ToasterBusVIP's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by pennies View Post
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    The Pacers can't possibly win enough games to make the playoffs, so do we start rooting for the Pacers to lose the rest of their games so they can get a better draft pick in the June Draft? The difference between drafting fourth and ninth is enormous, and with a bunch of L's they will very likely be in the top five and maybe in the top three. Cousins, Turner, and Wall would all be game changers for the Pacers. Whatever they might get at ninth would be the same old thing - a really good player who will help the Pacers win 35 games. More at the link.

    http://indysportsonline.com/2010/03/...o-keep-losing/
    Here's how I feel:

    We can still afford to win a couple more games down the stretch and keep our current lottery seeding. So every game against a team like Phoenix, or the Lakers, or Cleveland, I am still pulling for them to win, hoping that we can get this upset to have something to feel good about and just trusting that our fate will continue to be what it has been, for the rest of the season. Like eating that bowl of chocolate ice cream when you know you shouldn't, because really that's still more fun than munching on some celery sticks.

  2. #27
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    adam silver, the nba deputy commissioner, recently pointed out that a key difference of nba and european ball is relegation. just imagine if, say, the 2 worst teams in the nba each year are downgraded to the d-league, while the 2 best d-league teams get promoted up. it would never happen - the talent gap between nba and d-league is still too large, and then there are all sorts of arena and logistics issues - but if it did, it would kill tanking in a hurry.
    ok, now do you have a realistic idea that works?

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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  3. #28
    pacer fan since 88-89 Mr_Smith's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Pacers and Sixers will both be trying to throw the game tonight
    Help us Paul George......you're our only hope

  4. #29
    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    I WON'T ROOT FOR THE PACERS TO LOSE!

    I always root for them to win. However right now when they lose I'm happy about it.

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  6. #30
    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mr_Smith View Post
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    Pacers and Sixers will both be trying to throw the game tonight
    Players don't throw games.

  7. #31
    Tyrant maragin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    got a better idea?
    I like a modified version of what Jeff Van Gundy proposed. His take:

    "I think every team should have an equal chance at winning the lottery, from the best team all the way down," Van Gundy told The Houston Chronicle. "I don't want to accuse anyone of anything. I would say to take away any possible conflict of interest, everyone should have an equal chance at the top pick all the way down. That way there would be absolutely no question by anybody about anything."
    Found here

    My preference would be all 14 lottery teams get 1 ball each. Effectively eliminates tanking and is better for parity.

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  9. #32
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    so...give the teams at the bottom of the lottery a much, much better chance at winning it?

    So lets see...instead of teams that are going to be losing anyway tanking on purpose, we're going to be having teams in position to make the playoffs desperately trying to tank their way into the lottery?

    Basically, instead of a mass perception that the teams at the bottom of the league are losing on purpose to get John Wall, we're going to have the perception that teams in position to make the playoffs are losing on purpose in order to get John Wall, rather than get swept out of the first round by Cleveland?

    It's no wonder JVG can't get an NBA gig anymore. He can't even see one step ahead, let alone two...this guy must be horrible at chess.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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  11. #33

    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    How about putting the lottery teams in a tournament at the end of the regular season. The bottom 4 teams or so get a bye then play it like a tournament and whoever wins gets the #1 pick. You could give home court advantage to the lower seed.

  12. #34
    Denim Chicken duke dynamite's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bender View Post
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    How about putting the lottery teams in a tournament at the end of the regular season. The bottom 4 teams or so get a bye then play it like a tournament and whoever wins gets the #1 pick. You could give home court advantage to the lower seed.
    Why would you give the winner the #1 pick? That just means that they are the best of the losers...

  13. #35
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bender View Post
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    How about putting the lottery teams in a tournament at the end of the regular season. The bottom 4 teams or so get a bye then play it like a tournament and whoever wins gets the #1 pick. You could give home court advantage to the lower seed.
    ok, so instead of improving the teams that need it the most, we're improving the better ones?

    Next.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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  14. #36

    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    It would make for a better regular season, you wouldnt see teams "tanking" like you do now. You really think the Nets are this bad? I dont think so. You can get lucky and win 7 games out of 60. Plus in the tournament you would get everyones best game you wouldnt have a team "tank". In a game that really matters I would put my money down on the Pacers at home vs teams like New York, Sacramento, Detriot, Clippers, Grizzlies, Hornets, and Sixers.



    ***Removed*** Leave the gasoline in the shed, please

    Last edited by Roaming Gnome; 03-09-2010 at 06:37 PM.

  15. #37
    Tyrant maragin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    so...give the teams at the bottom of the lottery a much, much better chance at winning it?
    I didn't say that. Well, unless by "the bottom", you mean the teams with better records.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    So lets see...instead of teams that are going to be losing anyway tanking on purpose, we're going to be having teams in position to make the playoffs desperately trying to tank their way into the lottery?
    We may disagree here. I don't forsee potential playoff teams tanking at the end of the season. The playoffs generate revenue, interest in the team, and the potential for a championship. Even if it was a problem, I think it is better than the current mass tanking issue.

    Though, if you really thought that was an issue, JVG's proposal would work better than mine.

    I'd rather have either system than what we have in place now.

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  17. #38
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    What about draft position being a weighted average of losses from the last (n) years? That means tanking in a single year doesn't do much for you if you've been a pretty good team up to then, but that a team that is truly bad for a number of years gets the chance to improve? I can't think of too many teams in the league willing to risk multiple years of bad attendance to tank for the #1 pick.

    I think that would also help teams stuck in the middle, as they'd be passed by the teams that improve in the draft.

    The best draft system would make sure that teams who need improvement get it, teams that do not are kept out except by trades or other valid deals, and teams have no incentive to tank.
    BillS

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  19. #39
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    oh yeah it would happen. You would see GMs of .500 teams weigh a %7 chance of winning the lottery against a %5 of winning a single game against the LA lakers, and immediately start unloading talent at the deadline.

    Just what the NBA wants. Now even the halfway decent teams are losing on purpose.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    The only other time I've ever rooted against my own team was in '97 when I rooted against the Colts (but only after they were mathematically eliminated from the playoffs). It worked out pretty well. I would never trade what the Colts got for KStat's respect, no matter how important that is in the scheme of life. I know thats just one example...but I'm hoping lightning strikes twice.

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  22. #41
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Actually this win over the Sixers sucks.... I'm only looking forward to see GS and Sacto finish with a better record than us ! I can only only hope that Sacto wins tonight in Portland because if not we'll be tied with them for the 4th worst record..... arrgggghh Go Kings !!

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  24. #42
    Twitter @M_Murph11 PacerPride33's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    What is seriously the point in playing Earl Watson, TJ Ford, Dunleavy, and Luther Head for extended mintues every game, especially Earl and TJ as they both have no future with this team. There is no reason to not play AJ and all of they younger players more...If we keep this up..here we come mid to late lottery once again
    Murph

  25. #43
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    The current NBA lottery system isn't perfect, but it's the best thing we have.

    Here's the bottom line: in general, teams that are bad -the ones that we all say need help- end up getting help and eventually they get better (that's unless you're the Warriors or Clips, but that's an entirely different matter). So in that sense, the system works.

    No matter how you shuffle around the lottery odds or system, there will ALWAYS be an incentive for some team out there to tank, one way or another. It's just the nature of the way the game is played. In basketball, one really special player can turn around a franchise. Teams will want that type of player.

    I think the current lottery system is about the best you can do. The only better way of doing things is to clone Tim Duncan so that, every year, every team gets a Tim Duncan. That way, nobody gets left out and nobody can complain because it'll be fair to everyone. Until that happens, every bad team that needs help and doesn't get Tim Duncan is going to complain regardless of what happens.

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  27. #44
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Merz View Post
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    The only other time I've ever rooted against my own team was in '97 when I rooted against the Colts (but only after they were mathematically eliminated from the playoffs). It worked out pretty well. I would never trade what the Colts got for KStat's respect, no matter how important that is in the scheme of life. I know thats just one example...but I'm hoping lightning strikes twice.
    Fluke luck that the best prospect in the last 20 years happened to be in that draft the same year the colts finished dead last, and the colts still almost didnt draft him.

    But if it makes you feel better than you rooted for the colts to lose games, as if that somehow factored into it, go ahead.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

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  28. #45
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    Fluke luck that the best prospect in the last 20 years happened to be in that draft the same year the colts finished dead last, and the colts still almost didnt draft him.

    But if it makes you feel better than you rooted for the colts to lose games, as if that somehow factored into it, go ahead.
    Well yes, clearly I believe it factored into it...about as much as anyone rooting for the Pacers to tank cares about your contempt for them.

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  30. #46

    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerPride33 View Post
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    What is seriously the point in playing Earl Watson, TJ Ford, Dunleavy, and Luther Head for extended mintues every game, especially Earl and TJ as they both have no future with this team. There is no reason to not play AJ and all of they younger players more...If we keep this up..here we come mid to late lottery once again
    Who's ready for the Cole Aldrich era?!?!?!?

  31. #47
    Headband and Rec Specs rexnom's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    BTW, I have nothing but contempt for people who root for their own team to lose. Whether the ends justify the means or not, wrong is wrong.
    I have nothing but contempt for people who judge me because of how I root for my team.

    I agree more or less with your logic. I think especially that the losing has a deleterious effect on young players that have never won before.

    That being said, how dare you question and judge me because of how I root for my team? What's next? Contempt for me because I don't have season tickets? Contempt for me because I follow my team without providing them with direct revenue?

    This is ridiculous. You act as if I like rooting for my team to lose. You act as if I root for my team to lose because I like to see them lose. You act as if I have quit on them.

    Quite the opposite. I simply have a far-sighted view of the NBA. Whether we like it or not, in the long run it pays off more to lose any given game (given this level of losing - it's different when you're in the playoff picture) than it does to win it. For an analogy, consider a game in which my team's star player (in this case, Danny Granger) gets injured during the game. He can play on and give the team a better chance to win, risking making his injury worse at the same time, or he can rest and heal but make us lose, If the latter choice is better for the future, am I wrong in wanting my player to rest?

    It is my choice as a fan of my team and it doesn't change my fanhood
    to root for the team to lose. I do so not because I want them to fail. No. I do so because I want them to succeed.

    You are of course free to think whatever you want of me. Or my fandom. That's your right. However, don't think that your fandom (or you) is superior to mine (or me) because you don't root for your team to lose. Clearly we just have different styles of fandom. That's ok. It'd be nice if you could respect the fact that people root for their teams in different ways.

    -Dancing fruit to compensate for the fact that this was an overly serious post.

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  33. #48
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    This is ridiculous. You act as if I like rooting for my team to lose. You act as if I root for my team to lose because I like to see them lose. You act as if I have quit on them.
    You do realize you make the rest of your post totally irrelevant with this part, because clearly what I said didnt apply to you.

    If you'd like, though, maybe someone can find you bigger cross. Evidently, you need one.

    Oh, and for future reference, using silly terms like "fandom" and "fanhood" totally ruins the serious tone you were going for with the rest of your post. You didnt need the dancing bananas at all.
    Last edited by Kstat; 03-10-2010 at 06:33 AM.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

    Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
    Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
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  34. #49

    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    how about this,
    1. Lottery system for bottom 14 stays the same.
    2. But 2nd round of drafting will be in reverse order based on regular season record. So in this case, new jersey will draft last on 2nd round.

  35. #50

    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by stew View Post
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    how about this,
    1. Lottery system for bottom 14 stays the same.
    2. But 2nd round of drafting will be in reverse order based on regular season record. So in this case, new jersey will draft last on 2nd round.

    That suggestion seems familiar. Haven't we heard it somewhere before?


    But, in reply, I don't think the second round matters much. It's all about the top few picks.
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

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