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Thread: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

  1. #126

    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by pacers101 View Post
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    I don't know if Chicago is heading to the lottery this year. We'll have to see how it plays out because Toronto is also really struggling at the moment.
    Even if Chicago does miss the playoff you have to admit that their franchise is in a much better position then we are...
    They have a star PG for the next 10 years. The have a TON of cap space this summer when all the big name free agents are on the market. I would think that they have a real shot at Wade or Bosh but not James. They will likely pick up a solid player in this year draft even if they do have a late lotto pick (10-13) since this draft is stacked. Another plus for them is they need a PF and this draft is full of them. They are also set at SF with Luol Deng.
    This is a reach but their lineup next year could look something like this:
    PG-Rose
    SG-Wade
    SF-Deng
    PF-Monroe (from Gtown)
    C- Maybe keep Brad Miller? or sign someone cheap

    Basically the point I'm making is even if the Bulls miss the playoffs this year, their future as of right now looks a lot better than ours does. Now if we land the top pick that could change but the odds of that happening aren't very good.
    They probably won't get a lotto pick because they give the rights to swap picks this season to the Bucks (top-10 protected and it's basically impossible for them to get under 10).

    But I agree they may have a bright future and have a strong young core. I think you're forgetting Noah, an excellent player, and Gibson, a young solid player with good potential. I like what they've been doing in recent years. Of course, a lot depends on what they can do this off-season.

    However, they started to improve when they hired Skiles. When have the Bulls tanked in any recent years? Those miserable under-20 wins with Tim Floyd were already more than 10 years ago! I mean, is it worth it? How good did that to them?

    And things change too fast in this league: the Bulls seemed to have a very bright future just a couple of years ago when they made the ECF with a very young core - and, again, after a few years, they're back to be a playoffs bubble team.

  2. #127
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by cordobes View Post
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    I think that bottoming out (making an effort to fill the roster with potential sacrificing current ability) is different than tanking, at least as I understand it.
    That's essentially what tanking is. See Nuggets circa 2002-2003 as a good example. It's any effort by a team's front office to do less than everything to put a team on the floor with the best chance of winning. There's different methods of it, but the Nugz clearly exhibited tank as did OKC the couple of years after they moved.

    The Warriors this year clearly tanked. Yes, they were decimated by injuries, but they had enough expiring deals and flexibility to swing a couple deals to get a couple guys to help them win some games (without giving anything too valuable up in return). Instead, they went to the DLeague about 5 or 6 times to fish for players. They stood pat in trades. That's tanking.

    One of the big reasons Chicago never made it over the hump is because they never swung a big trade to make use of all the assets they accumulated through the draft. Year after year they were discussed as a team that was potentially making a big trade (they clearly possessed the assets to do so) and year after year they just stood pat. John Paxson has probably done less with more than any GM during his tenure.

  3. #128
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by d_c View Post
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    That's essentially what tanking is. See Nuggets circa 2002-2003 as a good example. It's any effort by a team's front office to do less than everything to put a team on the floor with the best chance of winning. There's different methods of it, but the Nugz clearly exhibited tank as did OKC the couple of years after they moved.

    The Warriors this year clearly tanked. Yes, they were decimated by injuries, but they had enough expiring deals and flexibility to swing a couple deals to get a couple guys to help them win some games (without giving anything too valuable up in return). Instead, they went to the DLeague about 5 or 6 times to fish for players. They stood pat in trades. That's tanking.
    I would put forward that there's a fine line between not using assets you currently have to put the best team on the floor (sitting your best players, etc.) and not making moves for the sake of winning a few more games (your example for the Warriors). I would maintain that the first is not keeping good faith with your fans while the second is simply choosing not to waste resources for little or no return.

    It's kind of like having a car that is burning oil and is on its last legs. Do you:

    - torch it for the insurance money
    - trade it for a car that still burns oil but maybe only a quart every two days instead of a quart a day
    - try to keep it going until you can afford a better car
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  4. #129
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    I decided to move this post here since it made more sense on the topic of winning or losing. For me, it's about accomplishing Short and Long Term goals when it comes to our lineups for the rest of the season ( which is a major area of contention for many of us here on PD ) to better prepare us for the next season.

    Winning with a majority of the minutes given to Ford/Watson/Dunleavy/Murphy = Good for the Team in the short term but doesn't really accomplish anything in the long term.

    Losing with a majority of the minutes given to Ford/Watson/Dunleavy/Murphy = Bad for the Team in the short and long term since giving them a lot of minutes doesn't really accomplish anything.

    Winning or Losing Games with a minimal # of consistent and meaningful minutes against key rotational Players given to AJ/McRoberts on a regular basis ( maybe 15 mpg ) while playing them more with our future core of Players ( specifically Granger/BRush/Inferno/Hibbert ) to properly evaluate their performance ( specifically not giving them garbage minutes ) and determine whether they should be considered part of the future core of Players = Good for the Team in the short term and long term...regardless of whether we win or lose.

    This doesn't mean that I do not want to give any minutes to Dunleavy/Ford/Watson/Murphy nor reduce their minutes to the point where they do not factor into a game.......we need them to play in order to remain somewhat competitive ( both a short and long term goal )....but at the same time....we need to evaluate whether AJ and McRoberts should be here for the long term or not.

    This isn't about me wanting the Pacers to win or lose games nor giving AJ/McRoberts any undeserved minutes.....it's about planning for the future, it's about seeing what happens if we give AJ/McRoberts more minutes on a regular basis and "let the chips fall where they may"....win or lose...I don't care......I'm looking beyond this season......the important thing is that we get to see if either of them are keepers or not.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    New York just won today.....................

  6. #131
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    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
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    New York just won today.....................
    Yea, but Philly lost (they had the same record when they played each other last night).

  7. #132

    Default Re: Time to Root for Pacers Losses?

    21-61 sounds mighty good to me !

    Unfortunately though, unless TPTB put DG on ice for the remainder
    of the season, given that they have more 'imminently winnable' (at home
    vs the other teams w/ 25 wins or less) games left than anyone other
    than perhaps the Knicks, they're highly likely to play their way 'down'
    into the 6-8 range.

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