View Poll Results: Team Wall or Team Turner?

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  • John Wall

    57 63.33%
  • Evan Turner

    12 13.33%
  • Ask me after the Washington game at the end of April (dcpacersfan)

    5 5.56%
  • Either (GrangeRusHibbert)

    15 16.67%
  • Best Player Available When Pacers Have Selection (Brad8888)

    1 1.11%
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Thread: Evan Turner or John Wall

  1. #51
    NaptownSeth is all feel Naptown_Seth's Avatar
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by DrFife View Post
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    As interesting as we might find a debate between John Wall or Evan Turner, I believe the plot really thickens after that. Whom to choose, for example, should we find ourselves drafting at #3?
    * Cousins? I'm suspicious that the PD consensus (not unanimous, but general consensus) would be "no."
    * Favors? Trophy likes him. Seth has soured on him. Again, no consensus, I suspect.
    While I believe the team will win more of our remaining games than many of us are hoping for, I believe we all are in agreement that our draft position, barring a lottery "miracle" or a eye-raising trade, will be between 4th and 10th.

    As March Madness approaches, I invite everyone to identify ten players they would love to see in a Pacer uniform next season. Perhaps a consensus pick will emerge--after Wall and Turner--that we can collectively cheer for come Draft Day. (If Tbird's evaluation support's our choice, so much the better.) Or perhaps we'll grow fond of several players ... which will ignite our passion for Draft Day "activity."
    We are screwed at #3 I think, lots of potholes with players not quite worthy of a #3.

    Cousins - talent yes but that attitude issue isn't about to end, it's clearly a real risk

    Favors - the god given parts are there, the game skills and awareness aren't. If he learns the game in 2-3 years then he's killing it and you win, if not he's another big guy that never learned to really play

    Patterson - I stand by this because I think he's got the most mature game, but he does seem like a reach at #3 rather than #6-7

    Aminu - IMO he makes a solid case for legit #3, but he's 85% SF right now with dashes of PF to his game, which means he's really redundant with Granger


    Any other player with that pick is a big reach. One good thing is that there is no way you take Aldrich with the #3.


    It would be really nice to trade out of #3. One very legit possibility might be Minny trading from 2 to 3 in order to get Aminu and a little something else. That cost could be minimal and pull the Pacers up to Turner.

    Or dare I say it, Granger for their #2 and one of their later first round picks. You draft Turner AND Aminu yourself. Not too shabby, and you still get one of the many bigs with that later pick (Lawal if lucky, Ndiaye or Udoh as defense-only bigs).

  2. #52
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
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    I know some people have really hopped on Turner's bandwagon, but when you factor in the fact that Wall is only a freshman, and Turner is a juinor, and Wall's freshman production destroys Turner's freshman production, it becomes an easy choice to make. Not to mention the premium on good PGs vs. wing players, which are more abundent.
    I've watched at least 6 games of Turners and 4 of Walls and it's not even close.
    Wall is an extreme talent for sure, but he's nowhere NEAR the complete player Turner is.
    The easy choice is Evan Turner, who likely will play PG.
    Playing (PG) today against the returning Big 10 player of the year Kalin Lucas (sp), should be a good test.
    Last edited by MLB007; 02-21-2010 at 01:20 PM.

  3. #53
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    For those who have not seen Evan Turner, he is playing right now in channel 8 on U-verse

  4. #54
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Sookie View Post
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    Westbrook was drafted to be a PG. Dwade has shifted from PG. and Evan Turner is not Lebron or Magic.
    Based on what? That he hasn't done it yet? Certainly his college numbers are comparable.
    I don't think either of those two was harder to guard than Turner. He might be the best 1 on 1 player I've seen in the past 5 years.
    He will be an NBA star for many years. (bank it)

  5. #55
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Just for a bit of perspective, keep in mind again Wall is doing what he is doing as a freshman. Turner is a juinor. Is Turner the better player now? Yes. Were his numbers anywhere close to Wall's his freshman year? No.

    Imagine what Wall could do with two full seasons under his belt. Scary.
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  7. #56

    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    The answer is John Wall. I think any other No. 1 pick would be a colossal mistake -- especially by this franchise in dire need of someone to steer the ship.

    I think Evan Turner is a superb player as well, but there's no way in my mind he's a point guard. His ball-handling is OK, but it's not nearly good enough to be a full-time point facilitator. I'm not sure Brandon Roy is the best comparison, but he's closer to that than a true PG. I'm not sure he's as good as Roy, either.

    But I'd draft him as a shooting guard with a quick, solid-shooting PG next to him.

    Wall's potential -- and yes, he's already realizing some of it -- is much greater.

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  9. #57
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
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    Just for a bit of perspective, keep in mind again Wall is doing what he is doing as a freshman. Turner is a juinor. Is Turner the better player now? Yes. Were his numbers anywhere close to Wall's his freshman year? No.

    Imagine what Wall could do with two full seasons under his belt. Scary.
    Yes, and somewhere in the draft recruiting thread I pulled up Turner's very pedestrian freshman numbers.

    I'm not against Evan Turner at all, in fact, I'd be tickled to death with him at #2. I just wouldn't pick him over Wall. And I cringe every time I see someone wanting to plug him in at the point.

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  11. #58
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Seth and I see eye to eye on this as well as vnsla.

    Beasley at this point of his freshman season had a more convincing season than Rose. Once he got elimanted, Rose was showcased and he exceled. But what threw scouts for a loop was Rose's work ethic and maturity. Beasely on the other hand showed how immature and lazy he was.

    I am not saying Wall is lazy. I share this to indicate that it is so early in the process of crowning the number one. Wall maybe a freshman, but there is no guarantee that he will be where he is projected to be.

    Turner is a top 5 pick and if he played like this last year....He would have beaten Griffin out at number 1.

    Wall has to look past his hops and speed and work with his team. He has not adjusted to the pressures of teams who have scouted him heavily. Turner has been scouted. Coaches adjusted their game plans and Turner has time and time again thwarted those plans.

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  13. #59

    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by MLB007 View Post
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    Based on what? That he hasn't done it yet? Certainly his college numbers are comparable.
    I don't think either of those two was harder to guard than Turner. He might be the best 1 on 1 player I've seen in the past 5 years.
    He will be an NBA star for many years. (bank it)
    He's 6'3 and was listed as a PG/SG coming out of college.

  14. #60
    We need John Wall. Thesterovic's Avatar
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    One legit possibility as well is that you finish with the 2nd or 3rd worst record and still end up with #5 or #6 pick in the draft.

    I would cry tears of depression, sadness, anger, bitterness, coldness, doubtfulness, etc. The thought of anything but #3 or better just makes me nervous.
    "I keep wondering the same thing. Last week they had the 4th worst record in the league, had an 11.9 percent chance of winning the lottery and were in line to land a franchise type player like Derrick Favors or DeMarcus Cousins. This week? They have a 1.7 percent chance of winning the lottery, have the 8th worst record and are in line to draft Cole Aldrich or Greg Monroe. Way to go Jim O'Brien. Rest Danny Granger the rest of the season (if it isn't too late) and give Josh McRoberts lots of minutes. That ought to do it." - Chad Ford on winning meaningless games

    Way to go Jim, you may have just put our franchise back another 4+ years.

  15. #61
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Wall if your number 1. If not, you pray Turner is still there when you pick.
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  16. #62
    Play McRoberts and Price! BRushWithDeath's Avatar
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveP63 View Post
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    Wall if your number 1. If not, you pray Turner is still there when you pick.
    If you're picking after 2 neither will be there. They're the top 2 and it isn't close.
    "I had to take her down like Chris Brown."

    -Lance Stephenson

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  18. #63
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Thesterovic View Post
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    One legit possibility as well is that you finish with the 2nd or 3rd worst record and still end up with #5 or #6 pick in the draft.
    Yeah, and if we end up at #5 (I don't expect us below that) we could be #8. Pretty big swing from #2.
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  20. #64
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    I voted Wall, but I saw a game where Kentucky lost to South Carolina and he couldn't handle 5'8" Devan Downey, which makes me wonder how much trouble he will have defending the NBA's quicker PG's. I don't know much about college ball, so take that for what it's worth to you. Turner just doesn't impress me as much as Wall.

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  22. #65
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Even if we're a few spots too low to draft Evan Turner ourselves it's plausible that we could arrange a deal for his draft rights later on, or more likely, arrange something prior to the draft. Obviously such a deal would require us to provide some incentive, but if management thinks Turner can be special and help turn this franchise, and the other team isn't demanding too much, it would be well worth it in my opinion.


    Four of the past six drafts have had such deals:

    2004: Bobcats move up to 2 (2 for 4, 33, and taking on Peja Drobnjak's 3/$10M contract)

    2005: Jazz acquire 3rd Pick (3 for 6, 27, and Detroit's 2007 1st)

    2006: Blazers land Aldridge (2 for 4, Viktor Khryapa, and a 2007 second)

    2008: Mayo heads to Memphis (3, Antoine Walker, and scraps for 5, Mike Miller, and scraps)

  23. #66
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by GrangeRusHibbert View Post
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    Four of the past six drafts have had such deals:

    2004: Bobcats move up to 2 (2 for 4, 33, and taking on Peja Drobnjak's 3/$10M contract)

    2005: Jazz acquire 3rd Pick (3 for 6, 27, and Detroit's 2007 1st)

    2006: Blazers land Aldridge (2 for 4, Viktor Khryapa, and a 2007 second)

    2008: Mayo heads to Memphis (3, Antoine Walker, and scraps for 5, Mike Miller, and scraps)
    Look at these too as us what we could get for trading down. Say we would get #2. We could take Turner or maybe trade down. Say Minny is 4th and wants Turner bad. So we trade picks with them for the rights to Rubio. Then with the 4th pick we could get Cousins or Favors.

  24. #67
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by ksuttonjr76 View Post
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    Take Turner, and see if he can fulfill the big PG role. Turner is combo guard anyways. Although Rush hasn't been the most consistent on offense, no one should doubt his defensive skills. Future lineup for next season...

    Turner/Price
    Rush/D. Jones
    Granger/Dunleavy
    Murphy (would prefer Hansbrough)/Hansbrough
    Hibbert/We need a TRUE backup C instead of a PF playing C
    Turner is a good ball-handler, but Im not a fan of having a huge talented scorer playing PG. THey tried that with AI, I think AI was more effective when Snow was playing PG and AI was SG.
    "So, which one of you guys is going to come in second?" - Larry Bird before the 3 point contest. He won.



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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by GrangeRusHibbert View Post
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    Even if we're a few spots too low to draft Evan Turner ourselves it's plausible that we could arrange a deal for his draft rights later on, or more likely, arrange something prior to the draft. Obviously such a deal would require us to provide some incentive, but if management thinks Turner can be special and help turn this franchise, and the other team isn't demanding too much, it would be well worth it in my opinion.


    Four of the past six drafts have had such deals:

    2004: Bobcats move up to 2 (2 for 4, 33, and taking on Peja Drobnjak's 3/$10M contract)

    2005: Jazz acquire 3rd Pick (3 for 6, 27, and Detroit's 2007 1st)

    2006: Blazers land Aldridge (2 for 4, Viktor Khryapa, and a 2007 second)

    2008: Mayo heads to Memphis (3, Antoine Walker, and scraps for 5, Mike Miller, and scraps)
    Gotta remember something: In every one of those instances, the team that traded down ended up getting the player they wanted in the first place. Same thing could be said of when Dallas traded down from #6 to #9 to get Dirk. If they didn't think Dirk would last past the #7 and #8 picks, they would've just not messed around and taken him at #6.

    Teams will always take the player they like most. If the team with the #2 pick likes Turner the most, that's who they're going to take. If they think Turner will be available at a lower pick, they'll trade down to get him. Or if they like someone else more than Turner who they think they can get at a lower pick, they'll trade down.

    But if the team with the #2 pick likes Turner and doesn't think he'll be around at a lower pick, they won't mess around. They'll just take him.

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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Sure, which is why I said it was plausible and not a certainty.

  27. #70
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
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    Look at these too as us what we could get for trading down. Say we would get #2. We could take Turner or maybe trade down. Say Minny is 4th and wants Turner bad. So we trade picks with them for the rights to Rubio. Then with the 4th pick we could get Cousins or Favors.
    I highly, highly doubt you could get Rubio's rights for dropping just two spots. You could almost certainly do #2 for Rubio's rights & Minnesota's second 1st (from Charlotte, currently #15) though, but I'd much rather keep #2 and draft Turner than go that route.

  28. #71
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Rubio doesn't impress me....

  29. #72
    All hail King George! KnicksRGarbage's Avatar
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    You know who doesn't impress me?
    John Wall.
    I have yet to see him take control in a game and make an impact where he was the reason KY won. If anything he's the reason all their games are so close. With all of his missed FT's and such.
    Yeah he's talented, but IMO if he's the consensus number one pick, this draft will be the worst ever.
    I just simply do not understand the love affair the world has with him.
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  31. #73
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    theres a few guys in this draft that I really like; Wall, Evans, Cousins, and Favours. All those guys could have a huge impact on a franchise, IMO
    "So, which one of you guys is going to come in second?" - Larry Bird before the 3 point contest. He won.



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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksRGarbage View Post
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    You know who doesn't impress me?
    John Wall.
    I have yet to see him take control in a game and make an impact where he was the reason KY won. If anything he's the reason all their games are so close. With all of his missed FT's and such.
    Yeah he's talented, but IMO if he's the consensus number one pick, this draft will be the worst ever.
    I just simply do not understand the love affair the world has with him.
    you me and Seth feel the same way, this draft is similar to the one when everybody was saying that Greg Oden was the better pick because of "potential" but in reality Durant was the better player, in this year draft you have a guy in Wall who is really good in open court, he is real quick but does not do much to impact the game(potential), when in the other side you have a guy in Turner who is not as athletic or as quick but overall a better player.

  33. #75
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    Default Re: Evan Turner or John Wall

    Quote Originally Posted by KnicksRGarbage View Post
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    You know who doesn't impress me?
    John Wall.
    I have yet to see him take control in a game and make an impact where he was the reason KY won. If anything he's the reason all their games are so close. With all of his missed FT's and such.
    Yeah he's talented, but IMO if he's the consensus number one pick, this draft will be the worst ever.
    I just simply do not understand the love affair the world has with him.
    He hit a game winner on the final shot of the game for one UK win. The past two games on the road (Miss. St. and Vanderbilt) he has made two huge blocks during crucial possessions. He makes 80% of his free throws. What are you talking about?

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