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The Rules of Pacers Digest

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Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

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Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Pacers asking too much for Murph

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  • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

    Originally posted by McKeyFan View Post
    Unless Foster is done.
    Even if he is done, it would have to be a medical slam dunk for his salary to be taken off our cap.

    Comment


    • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

      Originally posted by Wage View Post
      I can't understand why people are arguing about luxury tax savings on a message board. It's like arguing about Granger's stock portfolio, who cares?

      The luxury tax is something that only ownership can have a valid opinion on. If ownership decides they value the LT savings more than other factors, they will give Bird the order to trade Murphy for expiring contracts. If the LT is not that large of a concern, they will let Bird do as he wishes with a prospective trade.

      As fans, we are out of the loop when it comes to luxury tax decisions.
      Yes, because we are in the loop on all the other decisions.

      IF they care about lux tax??? IF????

      They do and it's beyond debate now. They've made many moves to protect against it, or passed on moves. They LET JACK GO because of lux tax limits.

      And if the lux tax is a barrier then I repeat YOU CAN'T TAKE BACK MORE MONEY IN TRADES if you are at that barrier.

      You know how tough it is to get dead-on matches? What if it's TJ Ford for Crawford and the $1m increase the Pacers take on is the dealbreaker? Is keeping Troy worth that, because that's exactly the kind of impact we are talking about.

      You are trying to get the books in order because it frees up a bunch of moves that have next to nothing to do with cap space or free agency. Extensions, SnTs, the 125% salary in return exception...these are moves that a team under the lux tax threshold can consider.

      I mean if they are planted against the lux tax and refuse to go past it then that means they wouldn't even use the MLE if they had it.

      Being at the lux tax literally makes every signing past that point cost DOUBLE.


      This is not just as simple as "hey, if they want to spend the money".


      Good lord, some of this thread sounds like people never heard of the CIB story either.





      *I'm not saying that moving Troy now is the only move, I'm only saying that the impact of such a deal, savings plus only the 29th pick isn't nearly as shabby as some make it sound. It does help the team quite a bit. Maybe something better can be found, but this wouldn't be a punt in the least, it would be sound financial strategy in the world of declining caps and thresholds.
      Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 02-04-2010, 04:59 PM.

      Comment


      • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

        Murphy is going no where, is performance against the Raps this week is all any playoff team needs to convince themselves not to take a chance on him. A double double, but let andrea bargnani go off for 35. That like 15 pts Lebron would have to make up for.
        You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

        Comment


        • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

          Put him on a team that needs the things he does well and can limit the stuff he doesn't do well and he's very valuable, imo.

          The Toronto game is what happens when he's your primary PF and has to play 30+ minutes of defense. That's not how a contender would use him. Think of him in bench role as a guy you can hide defensively and exploit his range.

          Comment


          • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

            Looks like Cleveland might not get what they want.

            It's no secret the Cavs would like to add Antawn Jamison at the trade deadline, as they'd like a stretch 4 to throw into their offense. With Jamison's talent, it's a move that could put the Cavs over the top in the East.

            But there's been some chatter the Wizards aren't necessarily interested in dealing with the rival Cavs.

            And as ESPN's Chad Ford notes today, the Wizards are also expecting some solid talent in return.

            Add in that the Pacers are asking for more than the Cavs are willing to return in a Troy Murphy deal, and that Andre Igoudala, another potential get for the Cavs, is rumored to possibly be traded to another couple teams, and there's a chance the Cavs might not end up with either of their potential three targets by the deadline.
            Nothing new, just an update from ESPN.

            Comment


            • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

              I'm really not worried about all these reports that suggest the Pacers are asking for "too much" for Murphy. I would wager that one GM (probably Cleveland's) leaked out such a thing a few weeks ago in order to drive the price down, and every media outlet subsequently reported that same information. When we get closer to the deadline, both sides will give a little bit, and I think Murphy will be traded.

              Comment


              • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                Originally posted by Speed View Post
                Put him on a team that needs the things he does well and can limit the stuff he doesn't do well and he's very valuable, imo.
                That maybe true but "that list" of possible teams to me is small and with that the price to acquire him will be lower than if he had more skill.

                Comment


                • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                  Originally posted by cinotimz View Post
                  This is just like the owners wanting a hard cap and salaries at 45 percent.

                  Its a starting point. We got about 2 weeks of negotiations to see what we actually end up with.
                  Perhaps. But if we end up with nothing it'll be disastrously bad.
                  SportsTwo.com

                  Comment


                  • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                    This isn't any real update....but greater insight into what the Wizards may ( or may not be doing ):

                    http://voices.washingtonpost.com/wiz...wizardsinsider

                    Posted by Michael Lee on http://www.washingtonpost.com

                    The Wizards have been reluctant to move Jamison because he ranks among Grunfeld's favorite players. Although Jamison is 33, Grunfeld doesn't want to give away a player who averages more than 21 points and nearly nine rebounds, and he also has little desire to help Cleveland win a championship -- especially after the Cavaliers signed away Larry Hughes five years ago.
                    This is the only glimmer of hope I have of the Wizards sticking with their ( likely ) higher asking price for Jamison. I'm really hoping that Grunfeld sticks to his reluctance to help the Cavs improve their team and therefore make it that much harder for them to trade Jamison.

                    If the Wizards stick to their guns and it simply comes down to asking price, then I really hope that ( at most ) we ask for Z+1st round pick+$$$.
                    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                      Originally posted by CableKC View Post
                      This isn't any real update....but greater insight into what the Wizards may ( or may not be doing ):

                      http://voices.washingtonpost.com/wiz...wizardsinsider


                      This is the only glimmer of hope I have of the Wizards sticking with their ( likely ) higher asking price for Jamison. I'm really hoping that Grunfeld sticks to his reluctance to help the Cavs improve their team and therefore make it that much harder for them to trade Jamison.

                      If the Wizards stick to their guns and it simply comes down to asking price, then I really hope that ( at most ) we ask for Z+1st round pick+$$$.
                      LOL, Grunfeld should send the Cavs a bouquet of flowers and fine chocolates for signing Larry Hughes.
                      SportsTwo.com

                      Comment


                      • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                        Originally posted by Trophy View Post
                        Looks like Cleveland might not get what they want.



                        Nothing new, just an update from ESPN.
                        If you're going to paste that, you need to include the link. Please edit the link in. Thanks.

                        Comment


                        • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                          Originally posted by MikeDC View Post
                          LOL, Grunfeld should send the Cavs a bouquet of flowers and fine chocolates for signing Larry Hughes.
                          You're right. But if Grunfeld wants to hold a grudge....and it make him think twice about shipping Jamison in a bow to the Lebrons....I'm hoping that he still feels like a jilted boyfriend being dumped by an ex for another guy.
                          Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

                          Comment


                          • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                            Originally posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
                            Yes, because we are in the loop on all the other decisions.

                            IF they care about lux tax??? IF????

                            They do and it's beyond debate now. They've made many moves to protect against it, or passed on moves. They LET JACK GO because of lux tax limits.

                            And if the lux tax is a barrier then I repeat YOU CAN'T TAKE BACK MORE MONEY IN TRADES if you are at that barrier.

                            You know how tough it is to get dead-on matches? What if it's TJ Ford for Crawford and the $1m increase the Pacers take on is the dealbreaker? Is keeping Troy worth that, because that's exactly the kind of impact we are talking about.

                            You are trying to get the books in order because it frees up a bunch of moves that have next to nothing to do with cap space or free agency. Extensions, SnTs, the 125% salary in return exception...these are moves that a team under the lux tax threshold can consider.

                            I mean if they are planted against the lux tax and refuse to go past it then that means they wouldn't even use the MLE if they had it.

                            Being at the lux tax literally makes every signing past that point cost DOUBLE.


                            This is not just as simple as "hey, if they want to spend the money".


                            Good lord, some of this thread sounds like people never heard of the CIB story either.





                            *I'm not saying that moving Troy now is the only move, I'm only saying that the impact of such a deal, savings plus only the 29th pick isn't nearly as shabby as some make it sound. It does help the team quite a bit. Maybe something better can be found, but this wouldn't be a punt in the least, it would be sound financial strategy in the world of declining caps and thresholds.
                            You are putting words in my mouth now. I never said that trading Troy for LT savings was a bad move, I simply stated that we have no idea how much ownership values Troy vs LT savings.

                            Of course ownership cares about the LT. Every owner cares about the LT, it's simply a matter of how much? I would argue that the Jack deal we did not match was less about LT concerns and more about being a terrible contract in the first place. I would hope ownership would not have matched that offer if we had zero dollars on the books.

                            So again, my point is simply "How much do the owners want to get under the LT." If they trade Murph for nothing but savings, I will be fine with the move, and will understand ownership's position.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                              Troy for Z, Powe, and a pick. Book it.
                              This space for rent.

                              Comment


                              • Re: Pacers asking too much for Murph

                                1) Cleveland is in our division and we play them 4 times a year.

                                2) Cleveland wants to keep LeBron.

                                3) Cleveland wants to trade for one of our starters.

                                4) Cleveland wants us to buy out the player they trade to us so he can go back to Cleveland.

                                5) Many Pacer fans are more than willing to go along with this trade as outlined. Just Murphy for Z.

                                FORGET THE MONEY, LOOK AT THE TRADE! YOU DO NOT GIVE ASSETS AWAY!

                                You do not help division rivals! Bird and Morway are not asking to much for Murphy!

                                Comment

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