Page 1 of 8 12345 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 197

Thread: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

  1. #1
    Member Erik's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Age
    40
    Posts
    727

    Default Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsi...r_game_wh.html

    by Mike Wells
    Indianapolis Star

    THE HOUSE - I had planned to use this space to talk about whether the Pacers made a mistake on passing on DeJuan Blair in the draft.

    Blair, who slid all the way to the second round, was selected for the Rookie-Sophomore game Wednesday. Pacers rookie Tyler Hansbrough, well, he's still dealing with his inner ear infection.

    I decided to push the Blair-Hansbrough debate to the side about a minute into the Pacers game when it was obvious that coach Jim O'Brien committed a blunder by starting Troy Murphy with four wing players.

    Go with Roy Hibbert if you're going to start one big man. Hibbert not only matches up better with Andrew Bynum, but he also gives the Pacers more down low in the post.

    O'Brien obviously didn't see it that way.

    I'm not saying the Pacers would have won the game by starting Hibbert or going with Murphy and Hibbert together, but the tone was set when Bynum immediately started abusing Murphy. Bynum scored 12 of his team's first 20 points on 5-of-5 shooting. All 12 of those points were before Hibbert checked into the game.

    Even Lakers coach Phil Jackson seemed puzzled by O'Brien going with that lineup.

    "I don't know if Jim was baiting us by starting Murphy at center," Jackson said. "It was impossible for them to cover Pau (Gasol) and Andrew. We had to find a way to move our offense to get it into them."

    O'Brien didn't like being questioned about his decision to start small against a team that has Bynum and Gasol in the frontcourt.

    "It's a small lineup, we didn't have a small guy on him," O'Brien said after pausing for a couple of seconds when asked. "It had nothing to do with small lineups, it had to do that we had one of our two centers on Bynum."

    Hibbert, meanwhile, came in the game and played like he was trying to prove his coach that belongs in the starting lineup every game.

    The big fella had 21 points, six rebounds and two blocks in 28 minutes.

    Of course, the Pacers went away from Hibbert because they thought jacking up 3-pointers - 7-of-28 - was more important.

    "I was trying to go back at them and I wanted to be aggressive because sometimes I feel like we take a lot more outside shots," Hibbert said. "We need somebody on the inside that's going to put in some damage and put some pressure on the other team to sink in so I can find cutters and guys for open 3's."

    Hibbert dropped more than a subtle hint about their love with the 3-point shot when he said "sometimes I feel like we take a lot more outside shots."

    The first thing he said to me was that Bynum got the better of him a couple of times. He didn't like that Bynum blew by him for a left-handed dunk and the foul in the second half.

    "He is a big guy and by playing against him I did learn," Hibbert said. "I can play against big or small lineups."

    That's a player that definitely wants to get better.
    I'm not just trying to get another anti-O'Brien thread going. It's just interesting to hear people other than us make comments about his decisions. I used to think that we're jumping the gun on the JOB "displeasure".....I'm not so sure anymore.

  2. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Erik For This Useful Post:


  3. #2
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Age
    33
    Posts
    28,142

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Even Lakers coach Phil Jackson seemed puzzled by O'Brien going with that lineup.

    "I don't know if Jim was baiting us by starting Murphy at center," Jackson said. "It was impossible for them to cover Pau (Gasol) and Andrew. We had to find a way to move our offense to get it into them."

    O'Brien didn't like being questioned about his decision to start small against a team that has Bynum and Gasol in the frontcourt.

    "It's a small lineup, we didn't have a small guy on him," O'Brien said after pausing for a couple of seconds when asked. "It had nothing to do with small lineups, it had to do that we had one of our two centers on Bynum."




    is this guy stubborn or what?..............

  4. #3
    Member Kuq_e_Zi91's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Posts
    2,302

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    I don't know what's worse, O'Brien saying Murphy is a center, or O'Brien not realizing he made a bad decision.

    Either way, he just doesn't get it and I don't think he ever will. Bird needs to take Murphy away from JOB if he's serious about improving this team.

  5. The Following 14 Users Say Thank You to Kuq_e_Zi91 For This Useful Post:

    + Show/Hide list of the thanked


  6. #4

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    in other words...

    I don't think the problem was the team was off. I think the problem was there was a basketball lineup out there that was in danger of being crushed by a dwarf.
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  7. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Putnam For This Useful Post:


  8. #5
    It is ka Thankee sai Major Cold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Garrett, IN
    Posts
    9,078
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    I have hated having Murphy at Center for awhile. Sometimes Murph fights to front the post and sometimes he just looks like he is wondering when his next 3 is going to be and finds himself behind a Bynum, Howard, or Duncan about to get schooled.

    As much as he got schooled you would think he could learn to develop a low post game, but alas that is not as sexy as chucking up the three.

  9. #6
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    He honest to God said Murphy is a center AND that there was nothing wrong with having him guard Bynum. Wow. This guy needs to coach some other team.

  10. The Following 9 Users Say Thank You to Hicks For This Useful Post:


  11. #7
    All is full of Orange! Mourning's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Bilthoven, The Netherlands
    Age
    38
    Posts
    8,981

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    He honest to God said Murphy is a center AND that there was nothing wrong with having him guard Bynum. Wow. This guy needs to coach some other team.


    I told myself to waite until about the half of february before I make a final judgement on JOB and the team this year. But, I can tell you that I have allready made that judgement with regards to JOB a couple of weeks ago, unconciously.

    It's indeed time for Jim to start packing his stuff at the end of this season.
    2012 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

    2011 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

    2006 PD ABA Fantasy League runner up, sports.ws

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to Mourning For This Useful Post:


  13. #8
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Free Lance!
    Posts
    8,079

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Mike Wells, we welcome you as a member of Pacers Digest.

    Applications are available by the door for the Five Game Win Streak Club.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

  14. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to McKeyFan For This Useful Post:


  15. #9
    Professional Beachcomber mildlysane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Port Charlotte, Florida
    Age
    43
    Posts
    1,263
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    It almost seems like JOB is in the "tank the season" camp with some of his decisions.

  16. #10
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,756

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    He honest to God said Murphy is a center AND that there was nothing wrong with having him guard Bynum. Wow. This guy needs to coach some other team.
    Honestly. What are his alternatives. Foster is out, Tyler is out. Obviously Jim doesn't have any confidence in Josh (neither do I). So Jim is left with trying to decide how best to defend Bynum and Pau with a combination of Granger, Roy and Troy. Do you scrap the small lineup and start Troy and Roy together? No, because Troy is going to have as much trouble guarding Pau at he did with Bynum and Pau is the better player. OK, so what do you do. Anyway you go it isn't going to be pretty. Jim decided to stick with the small lineup and see if maybe Troy could cause as much trouble on the other end of the court.

    Probably what he should have done is start Roy and have him guard Bynum and sit Troy and have Danny guard Pau.

    Honestly though it would have made much difference as the game was lost in the 3rd quarter and didn't Jim start Roy in the third quarter with Troy (I missed the start of the third, so I'm off to check the play-by-play)

    Disclaimer: Not trying to stick up for O'Brien, just trying to move the discussion into a more productive route then Jim is horrible how could he be so dumb mode.

    Exactly, - yeah Troy and Roy started the third quarter and that was when the pacers got beat. So this whole discussion is a straw man. No lineup the pacers have can defend the Lakers
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 01-28-2010 at 08:04 AM.

  17. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Unclebuck For This Useful Post:


  18. #11
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    23,738

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Wow. When Phil Jackson's mocking your coaching in a press conference, that's not a good thing.

    And UB, I'd have been fine with seeing either Solo or McRoberts on the court. Once. I mean, if you've decided out of the gate that neither of them is going to see PT, then yeah it's hard to have enough beef to match up. We got destroyed inside, yet neither of those guys even played.
    Last edited by Anthem; 01-28-2010 at 08:06 AM.
    Welcome to Pacers Digest! New around here? Here are three tips for making the forum a great place to talk about Pacers basketball.

    • Log in. Even if you want to read instead of post, it's helpful because it lets you:
    • Change your signature options. You can hide all signatures by choosing "Settings" (top right) then "General Settings" (middle left) and unchecking the box "Show Signatures" (in the "Thread Display Options" area).
    • Create an ignore list. I know it may seem unneighborly. But you're here to talk about the Pacers, not argue with someone who's just looking for an argument. Most of the regular users on here make use (at least occasionally) of the "Ignore" feature. Just go to "Settings" -> "Edit Ignore List" and add the names.

    Enjoy your time at PD!

  19. The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Anthem For This Useful Post:


  20. #12
    Professional Beachcomber mildlysane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2006
    Location
    Port Charlotte, Florida
    Age
    43
    Posts
    1,263
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Honestly. What are his alternatives. Foster is out, Tyler is out. Obviously Jim doesn't have any confidence in Josh (neither do I). So Jim is left with trying to decide how best to defend Bynum and Pau with a combination of Granger, Roy and Troy. Do you scrap the small lineup and start Troy and Roy together? No, because Troy is going to have as much trouble guarding Pau at he did with Bynum and Pau is the better player. OK, so what do you do. Anyway you go it isn't going to be pretty. Jim decided to stick with the small lineup and see if maybe Troy could cause as much trouble on the other end of the court.

    Probably what he should have done is start Roy and have him guard Bynum and sit Troy and have Danny guard Pau.

    Honestly though it would have made much difference as the game was lost in the 3rd quarter and didn't Jim start Roy in the third quarter with Troy (I missed the start of the third, so I'm off to check the play-by-play)

    Disclaimer: Not trying to stick up for O'Brien, just trying to move the discussion into a more productive route then Jim is horrible how could he be so dumb mode.

    Exactly, - yeah Troy and Roy started the third quarter and that was when the pacers got beat. So this whole discussion is a straw man. No lineup the pacers have can defend the Lakers
    I guess I understand about Josh, but what about Solo? Is he hurt? Why didn't he play at all? His D HAD to be better than Murphy's, right? I am not saying start him (maybe I am...), but he should at least play when we are down 2 big men and we are playing talented big men.

  21. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to mildlysane For This Useful Post:


  22. #13
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,756

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Wow. When Phil Jackson's mocking your coaching in a press conference, that's not a good thing.

    And UB, I'd have been fine with seeing either Solo or McRoberts on the court. Once. I mean, if you've decided out of the gate that neither of them is going to see PT, then yeah it's hard to have enough beef to match up. We got destroyed inside, yet neither of those guys even played.
    Oops I forgot about Solo - yeah he would have defended their bigs better, but then you give up a lot on the offensive end and the offense did keep it close for 24 minutes. Bottom line this roster is not built to beat the lakers

  23. #14
    Member Speed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Brownsburg
    Posts
    8,525

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Who starts against Shaq on Friday?

  24. #15
    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Free Lance!
    Posts
    8,079

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Diener.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

  25. The Following 15 Users Say Thank You to McKeyFan For This Useful Post:

    + Show/Hide list of the thanked


  26. #16
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,756

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Who starts against Shaq on Friday?
    I would start Roy, but that will mean he'll likely get into foul trouble. if you start Troy on Shaq obviously Troy will be abused, but Troy will get open shots on the other end. Once again I don't see an easy answer.

    Personally I wish Jeff and Tyler were healthy (not to guard Shaq or Bynum per se) but I enjoy seeing those two guys play - I certainly enjoyed when they were on the court together

  27. #17
    Member Kuq_e_Zi91's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Washington, DC
    Posts
    2,302

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Foul trouble shouldn't dictate Roy's minutes. He only plays 20 minutes anyways. I'd like to play him regardless of if he has 3 fouls in the first quarter. If he fouls out, then we can resort to the gimmicks, but it's important to remember he has 6 fouls to give.

    However, I think we all know deep down inside that Murphy will get the start and the majority of the time at center.

  28. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Kuq_e_Zi91 For This Useful Post:


  29. #18

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    He called Murphy a Center and everybody and their mother knew he would get abused by the Lakers lineup. Hibbert is a center Murphy is a PF. JOB is bringing this all on himself.
    JOB is a silly man

  30. The Following User Says Thank You to jhondog28 For This Useful Post:


  31. #19
    It is ka Thankee sai Major Cold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Garrett, IN
    Posts
    9,078
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Buck I understand you saying that having Murphy guarding Gasol is not ideal. And having him in on Bynum is not ideal either. But the point is why not bring him off the bench and start Granger and Hibbert in the frontcourt?

    At some point you have to come to reality. JOB does make coaching mistakes with the limited roster he has. He is not a downright horrible coach, but the dude is not making improvements either.

    It is time for a change after this season.

  32. The Following User Says Thank You to Major Cold For This Useful Post:


  33. #20
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,756

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Buck I understand you saying that having Murphy guarding Gasol is not ideal. And having him in on Bynum is not ideal either. But the point is why not bring him off the bench and start Granger and Hibbert in the frontcourt?

    At some point you have to come to reality. JOB does make coaching mistakes with the limited roster he has. He is not a downright horrible coach, but the dude is not making improvements either.

    It is time for a change after this season.
    I would have done that myself. Although I can understand why Jim went the way he did. And really it didn't cost us the game as the third quarter when Roy and Troy were in together. (bottonline it didn't matter who was in in the third as the Lakers decided to put the game away)

  34. #21
    Custom User Titleist
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Pacer Purgatory Praying for Paul
    Posts
    3,555
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Welcome to our ghastly world, Mr. Wells, all filled with angst and disgust regarding our strategy, as well as lineup and rotational choices that probably has the name "Jim O'Brien" being considered for terrorist watch lists due to the horror he inflicts on innocent basketball fans nightly who no longer feel safe despite enhanced security measures at Conseco.

    I'm kidding (?).

    It does seem that there is an additional shift towards the Dark Side regarding O'B, though. Please, everyone, proceed cautiously. There are those of us who have been here for some time now, and we don't want you tripping over us due to not being accustomed to the lack of illumination. There is an adjustment period, so please be patient.

  35. #22

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Quote Originally Posted by jhondog28 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    He called Murphy a Center and everybody and their mother knew he would get abused by the Lakers lineup. Hibbert is a center Murphy is a stretch forward. JOB is bringing this all on himself.

    fixed.

    Murphy is vulnerable to a lot of criticism, but we'll all be happier if we give up the idea that he's a bad power forward. He isn't a power forward at all. Even if he's listed in the lineup as the "4" doesn't make him a power forward. Even if O'Brien or Bird or Mark Boyle or the printed program call him a power forward -- he isn't one. And, as jhondog28 implies, Murphy's not a center either. He's a prototypical stretch forward.

    With Foster and Hansbrough wounded and McRoberts sitting, the Pacers are playing most of their minutes without a power forward on the floor.

    O'Brien is certainly susceptible to criticism for the way this season is going. But I think his fault is thinking the power forward role is dispensable -- not thinking that Troy is a good power forward.


    .
    And I won't be here to see the day
    It all dries up and blows away
    I'd hang around just to see
    But they never had much use for me
    In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

  36. #23
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,549

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Please note Hibbert got abused by Bynum as well, so it isn't like starting Roy would have put us in the lead. Honestly, don't you think that being within 3 at the half against the Lakers would be a positive thing?

    Everyone screams "defense sucks, defense sucks" when we lose a game like this, but the turning point was when the OFFENSE went back to its old habits of bricking long 2s and 3s as if that was the only way to score. The small lineup was actually working offensively when people were worming their way into the lane or at least into mid-range.

    My disclaimer - I want Roy on the floor for his offense. I want the team to stop thinking the way to win is to throw up a long-range shot. Both of these things can certainly be placed at the feet of the coach. BUT the focus everyone has that somehow we were destined to lose the game because of the starting lineup makes me wonder if they really watched the first 2-1/2 quarters of the game.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  37. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to BillS For This Useful Post:


  38. #24
    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Northside Bias
    Posts
    12,959

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    The only rational reason I can think of for Obie's behavior is this:

    Gee, I know Kegboy hasn't been watching Pacer games, he's busy with all his video games and TV shows and what not. And then he's got the Boilers too. I'd hate for him to feel guilty about not making time for us, so I'm just going do the stupidest **** I can, so tomorrow morning he can say to himself, "Thank god I didn't watch that game."
    Come to the Dark Side -- There's cookies!

  39. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to Kegboy For This Useful Post:


  40. #25
    Member Speed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Brownsburg
    Posts
    8,525

    Default Re: Mike Wells blog on JOB's decision making

    Let me say this, I was giving us (PD) props last night watching the game. Cuz we said a long time ago Murphy and Roy can't play together and be as effective. I think that is what Obie needs to say and quit talking about small ball.

    Whether he knows it or not, I think Obie is right to not necessarily play small ball, but do two components of it.

    1.) not play Roy and Troy together.
    2.) Get Granger some minutes at PF when match ups dictate.

    Getting Granger mins at PF allows you to compensate for missing Jeff and Hansbrough and play D Jones and Dunleavy more.

    So maybe not small ball, but adjustment ball.

    I agree last night should have called for Starting Roy on Bynum and Danny on Gasol, bringing Troy off the bench. Obie won't do this though, I guess it's a veteran respect thing for Troy, which still doesn't make sense. So who knows.
    Last edited by Speed; 01-28-2010 at 10:01 AM.

  41. The Following User Says Thank You to Speed For This Useful Post:


Similar Threads

  1. Brandon Rush to be benched? (Mike Wells blog)
    By Trophy in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 78
    Last Post: 11-21-2009, 12:34 AM
  2. couple of mike wells' articles on tinsley, trading
    By wintermute in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 79
    Last Post: 07-28-2008, 07:32 PM
  3. Tbird analysis: Making the case for Mike Montgomery for next IU basketball coach
    By thunderbird1245 in forum Market Square (General Non-Sports Discussion)
    Replies: 40
    Last Post: 04-01-2008, 05:30 PM
  4. Really good article about Mike Brown
    By Unclebuck in forum Indiana Pacers
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: 06-02-2005, 12:14 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •