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Thread: No reason to dis Dampier

  1. #1
    IndianaMan
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    Default No reason to dis Dampier

    Since Smits wat has been our startin centers average? Not very damn good. Dampier has been very consistant and has not only had one good year. he has been round a 9 and 9 guy and this year he had a great season and it was against the very dominant big man players in the west so dont dis him. i hope we get him!!!!

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    Member Dukins's Avatar
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    I would cringe though if we gave up Bender for Damp and this trade turns out to be similar to the Davis/Oneal trade.


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  3. #3

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    He had one good season.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Don't forget he's also had a major injury along the way.

    I'd take ten and ten from a true, widebodied center that is physically strong enough to own the paint and stay out of foul trouble against everyone else not named Shaq.

    IMO, ten and ten from Dampier is much better than Brad Miller's 14 and 7 when the points all come from outiside the paint.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  5. #5

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by btowncolt
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    What? Canadian Bacon?
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  6. #6
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Jay, how will the offense work with Damp and J.O in at the same time.

  7. #7

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Dampier won't be a ten and ten guy.

    He has averaged over 8 rebounds and 10 points in twice in his career. Granted those where the times he got over thirty minutes but there are reasons he hasn't gotten mins.

    I don't think the reason for lack of minutes is only injuries but lets say it is. How much do you want to give up for a 30 yr old injury prone underachieving center?
    [edit=75=1089909810][/edit]
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  8. #8
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    First of all, my definitions include three "post" positions; left block, right block, and high post.

    Now when I say high post, I don't mean 18-feet out, like Rik or Brad Miller would play. I mean in the paint, between the FT line and the dotted line.

    Envision the 1980's Celtics with Parrish and McHale on the court.

    With three post positions for Dampier and JO to rotate through, they should be able to space themselves properly. Now it may take them some time to learn each other's tendencies, and clearly JO gets the first choice of where he wants the ball, but it should work.

    Remember all the hype about JO's ambidexterous-ness? And I've seen Dampier be effective from the high post. It *should* work. Admittedly, we haven't seen as much of JO from the high post, so there's some uncertainty there.

    Now, if you're going to occupy two of the three post positions with legit offensive threats (in other words, not Foster), then slahing/ penetration from the three perimeter players is going to be more difficult because the lane will be crowded.

    The offense must be inside-out and the players must be disciplined enough to stick with it.

    The perimeter players *can* force the defense to shift by driving to the paint, but the guy that penetrates won't necessarily be looking to go all the way to the basket/ score. I would expect to see Ron or Stephen Jackson drive from the wing toward the FT line, in effort to open up either a backdoor cut or a player spotted up along the baseline.

    Quick passing will be important. JO, Ron, Stephen Jackson can't hold the ball too long, and all of them have a reputation for doing so.

    As you know, its all about creating mismatches. With JO and Dampier in the game, opponents will be very reluctant to double-team with a big man. With Ron and Stephen Jackson, opponents will be reluctant to double-team with a wing player. Tinsley must continue to keep defenses honest, then its just a matter forcing the defense to shift, find the seam, and get the ball there before it closes.

    Oh, and can you imagine just how wide open Reggie could be off a double-screen involving Dampier and JO?

    UB, what do you think?
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  9. #9
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadian
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    Dampier won't be a ten and ten guy.

    He has averaged over 8 rebounds and 10 points in his career. Granted those where the times he got over thirty minutes but there are reasons he hasn't gotten mins.

    I don't think the reason for lack of minutes is only injuries but lets say it is. How much do you want to give up for a 30 yr old injury prone underachieving center?
    Frankly, I'd be content with ten and eight but I think he's better than that.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  10. #10
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Why do people dis a guy for having a only one good year? Especially when many were falling all over themselves proposing trades to get an unproven young lottery pick. One who has never seen the floor of an NBA gym. It could be argued that Tinsley, Foster, and/or Jones have only had 1 good year too.
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  11. #11

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arcadian
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    Dampier won't be a ten and ten guy.

    He has averaged over 8 rebounds and 10 points in his career. Granted those where the times he got over thirty minutes but there are reasons he hasn't gotten mins.

    I don't think the reason for lack of minutes is only injuries but lets say it is. How much do you want to give up for a 30 yr old injury prone underachieving center?
    Frankly, I'd be content with ten and eight but I think he's better than that.
    Reading your post I realized I left out an important word--"twice" in his career. His career averages are less.

    But my problem isn't with his stats. Its that Dampier is an aging, injury prone center whose going to get a big payday.
    "They could turn out to be only innocent mathematicians, I suppose," muttered Woevre's section officer, de Decker.

    "'Only.'" Woevre was amused. "Someday you'll explain to me how that's possible. Seeing that, on the face of it, all mathematics leads, doesn't it, sooner or later, to some kind of human suffering."

  12. #12

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by indygeezer
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    Why do people dis a guy for having a only one good year? Especially when many were falling all over themselves proposing trades to get an unproven young lottery pick. One who has never seen the floor of an NBA gym. It could be argued that Tinsley, Foster, and/or Jones have only had 1 good year too.
    Because that one year is coming later in his career, and a CONTRACT year at that. There is absolutely no guarentee that he will perform the same way. How is it that all of a sudden he has a superb year? I just don't think it is worth the risk.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  13. #13
    Pacer Pride, Colts Strong Kid Minneapolis's Avatar
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    I don't want Damp, either. We had him, and we traded him for Chris Mullin. Kinda strange why we did that looking back, and hindsight is 20/20, but that was a bad trade in regards to the future, hehe.

    Last year was a contract year, for him, right? And he put up 10 and 10? Not impressed. He's aging, injury-prone, and I don't think there's enough space in the paint for he and O'Neal. I don't see him playing as well this year now that he'll have the contract and he'll be fat and happy.
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    But an unproven high schooler is worth trading away established players? With no work history? yeah they may be cheaper than Damp's contract but with a vet you KNOW he can play at the NBA level. If you don't think he can play at the level you want then you go after somebody else. But the rookie is ALL risk.

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  15. #15

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    He only played NBA level GOOD for 1 year.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    it was 12 and 12 last year, not 10 and 10

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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Hey, maybe it was his BREAKOUT year! Everybody always talks about a player having one of those and really jumping on their bandwagon. Maybe he was finally free enough of injuries to have that special year.
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  18. #18
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Suaveness
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    He only played NBA level GOOD for 1 year.
    He's at 9 and 7 for a career average. He's been NBA - Good for most of his career, he was NBA great last season.

    I'd make this trade even if he was only NBA - Good for the duration of the contract.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  19. #19

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by indygeezer
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    Hey, maybe it was his BREAKOUT year! Everybody always talks about a player having one of those and really jumping on their bandwagon. Maybe he was finally free enough of injuries to have that special year.
    Breakout year at HIS age...hmm..

    And maybe those injuries will come back this year

    I think Elmer is poisoning your mind geez...
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  20. #20

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section222
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suaveness
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    He only played NBA level GOOD for 1 year.
    He's at 9 and 7 for a career average. He's been NBA - Good for most of his career, he was NBA great last season.

    I'd make this trade even if he was only NBA - Good for the duration of the contract.
    And 9 and 7 doesn't warrant 10 mill a year.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  21. #21

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    I dont know how many of you have actually seen Dampier play but he is a big strong guy and one thing he CAN do is rebound the HELL out of the ball.

    I wouldnt trade bender for him because im a homer and i love Jonathan Bender (he's my second favorite player on the team after Reg), but from a basketball standpiont when you just brought in a player who can spell artest at the 3, (granted we lost Al) we are STILL loaded at the forward position, IF we plan on playing croshere, and dampier clogs a big hole in the middle...

    YES we have a hole in the middle. The only players on our team with REAL center size is a ROOKIE (i know a lot of you are expecting big things, and maybe he IS that good, but MOST LIKELY he wont play much this season. Be realistic.) and POLLARD. I love fosters game to death, but it would be nice to have a real bruising center that we could actually play from time to time unlike Scot "hands of STONE" pollard.

    I like the idea of having a 3 man rotation at PF/C, and Jermaine/Foster/Al worked well, but guess what Al iis gone, and even if he was still here, that is a SMALL 3 man rotation up front. Who's gonna step in? Croshere? Still small. Harrison? ROOKIE (and 29th pick rookie at that). Pollard? (honestly he is currently our best option, and thats not a good thing.) Dampier would help immensely.

  22. #22

    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    but i agree he does not warrant 10 million a year. but i REALLY think he can be had for an extension of his current contract, 8 million a year, and in that case we have to go for it. Especially with SA Detroit and Miami, the only 3 competitors in the LEAGUE so big up front.

  23. #23
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section222
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    First of all, my definitions include three "post" positions; left block, right block, and high post.

    Now when I say high post, I don't mean 18-feet out, like Rik or Brad Miller would play. I mean in the paint, between the FT line and the dotted line.

    Envision the 1980's Celtics with Parrish and McHale on the court.

    With three post positions for Dampier and JO to rotate through, they should be able to space themselves properly. Now it may take them some time to learn each other's tendencies, and clearly JO gets the first choice of where he wants the ball, but it should work.

    Remember all the hype about JO's ambidexterous-ness? And I've seen Dampier be effective from the high post. It *should* work. Admittedly, we haven't seen as much of JO from the high post, so there's some uncertainty there.

    Now, if you're going to occupy two of the three post positions with legit offensive threats (in other words, not Foster), then slahing/ penetration from the three perimeter players is going to be more difficult because the lane will be crowded.

    The offense must be inside-out and the players must be disciplined enough to stick with it.

    The perimeter players *can* force the defense to shift by driving to the paint, but the guy that penetrates won't necessarily be looking to go all the way to the basket/ score. I would expect to see Ron or Stephen Jackson drive from the wing toward the FT line, in effort to open up either a backdoor cut or a player spotted up along the baseline.

    Quick passing will be important. JO, Ron, Stephen Jackson can't hold the ball too long, and all of them have a reputation for doing so.

    As you know, its all about creating mismatches. With JO and Dampier in the game, opponents will be very reluctant to double-team with a big man. With Ron and Stephen Jackson, opponents will be reluctant to double-team with a wing player. Tinsley must continue to keep defenses honest, then its just a matter forcing the defense to shift, find the seam, and get the ball there before it closes.

    Oh, and can you imagine just how wide open Reggie could be off a double-screen involving Dampier and JO?

    UB, what do you think?
    Well I am impressed you seem to be still in midseason form. I tend to get a little rusty this time of the year.

    You explain it well, I think there might be a little congestion especially with Damp, J.O and Ron upfront. Sorry I did not ask how all three could work at the same time.

    I still worry about Damp being so damn slow on on defense. One thing I like about J.O, Jeff and AL is they could help and recover and use their quickness to cover the court. Damp can't do that. That will forse J.O out on the court more.

    Jay I am not saying Damp can't work, but is he worth the cost in terms of player and $$

    Yes I would like an experienced big guy who can contend with Shaq and before Shaq was traded, i did not want Damp at all, now I want him a little

  24. #24
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay@Section222
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    First of all, my definitions include three "post" positions; left block, right block, and high post.

    Now when I say high post, I don't mean 18-feet out, like Rik or Brad Miller would play. I mean in the paint, between the FT line and the dotted line.

    Envision the 1980's Celtics with Parrish and McHale on the court.

    With three post positions for Dampier and JO to rotate through, they should be able to space themselves properly. Now it may take them some time to learn each other's tendencies, and clearly JO gets the first choice of where he wants the ball, but it should work.

    Remember all the hype about JO's ambidexterous-ness? And I've seen Dampier be effective from the high post. It *should* work. Admittedly, we haven't seen as much of JO from the high post, so there's some uncertainty there.

    Now, if you're going to occupy two of the three post positions with legit offensive threats (in other words, not Foster), then slahing/ penetration from the three perimeter players is going to be more difficult because the lane will be crowded.

    The offense must be inside-out and the players must be disciplined enough to stick with it.

    The perimeter players *can* force the defense to shift by driving to the paint, but the guy that penetrates won't necessarily be looking to go all the way to the basket/ score. I would expect to see Ron or Stephen Jackson drive from the wing toward the FT line, in effort to open up either a backdoor cut or a player spotted up along the baseline.

    Quick passing will be important. JO, Ron, Stephen Jackson can't hold the ball too long, and all of them have a reputation for doing so.

    As you know, its all about creating mismatches. With JO and Dampier in the game, opponents will be very reluctant to double-team with a big man. With Ron and Stephen Jackson, opponents will be reluctant to double-team with a wing player. Tinsley must continue to keep defenses honest, then its just a matter forcing the defense to shift, find the seam, and get the ball there before it closes.

    Oh, and can you imagine just how wide open Reggie could be off a double-screen involving Dampier and JO?

    UB, what do you think?
    Well I am impressed you seem to be still in midseason form. I tend to get a little rusty this time of the year.

    You explain it well, I think there might be a little congestion especially with Damp, J.O and Ron upfront. Sorry I did not ask how all three could work at the same time.

    I still worry about Damp being so damn slow on on defense. One thing I like about J.O, Jeff and AL is they could help and recover and use their quickness to cover the court. Damp can't do that. That will forse J.O out on the court more.

    Jay I am not saying Damp can't work, but is he worth the cost in terms of player and $$

    Yes I would like an experienced big guy who can contend with Shaq and before Shaq was traded, i did not want Damp at all, now I want him a little
    I tried to anticipate that question and address it by saying that Ron will need to make diagonal drives, instead of drives to the hoop. I think he's fully capable of doing that, in fact I'd argue that he's already more effective if he's driving to a point other than the basket.

    For example, Ron is frequently effective at driving to to dotted line, reading the defense, and either turning the corner to the basket or reading the "switch" and finding the seam.

    But if Ron thinks he going to put his head down and go to the basket, it just won't work very well.

    I had sorta soured on the idea of Damp until Shaq went to Miami. IMO, we've got to counter. I'm not saying he's the perfect player, but we don't have anybody other than Harrison with a true center's body, and I think he's the best one available.
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
    Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
    Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
    Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
    And life itself, rushing over me
    Life itself, the wind in black elms,
    Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you


  25. #25
    Member SycamoreKen's Avatar
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    Default Re: No reason to dis Dampier

    I fyou check the numbers Damp had virtually the same season last year that he had in his second seson, with his rebounding improveing. One could argue that his numbers would have been better had the team around him utilized him better on the offensive end, but maybe I feel that way since I had him on a fantasy team last year. I'm just concerned about the 5 years in between where he was average at best.

    If we got Damp. maybe JO could hit those 15-18 foot jumpers that we would love Foster to hit. Duncan and Robinson traded off the post taking those types of shots.

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