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Thread: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    What is the purpose of that IF you are getting rid of the coach? I'm not sure what Bird gains with his comment unless he plans on keeping the coach.
    Likely because a decision hasn't been made yet. And you certainly don't want the news to leak out before you are ready to replace the coach with a plan to move forward

  2. #27

    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    What if one of the unhappy players is Granger? What then? Does Bird back up his mouth and trade Granger, or find a new coach?

    Personally, I'd like to hear something from Herb. I remember him saying he was going to be more involved. If he isn't, there isn't time like the present to get involved.

  3. #28
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    oh cmon like bird is gonna tell the star, "Yea JOB isnt working out for us. id hate to pull the rug out from under the players like that and i hope JOB doesnt read this section of the paper in the morning....oh who am i kidding our team sucks."
    "To give anything less than your best, is to sacrifice the gift." - Steve Prefontaine

  4. #29
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    What if one of the unhappy players is Granger? What then? Does Bird back up his mouth and trade Granger, or find a new coach?

    Personally, I'd like to hear something from Herb. I remember him saying he was going to be more involved. If he isn't, there isn't time like the present to get involved.
    He doesn't have to say anything to prove he's involved

  5. #30

    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by odeez View Post
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    he still seems to be a lame duck coach to me.

    If you want to get right down to it, Bird is a lame duck GM w/o a new contract. And I prefer Bird stay that way. Does anyone know the date when his contract will end, so I can mark it on my new calendar?

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    NO ONES job is secure..........anyone can be fired from a job.

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Is there even a thing as a lame duck GM?

  8. #33

    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
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    If you want to get right down to it, Bird is a lame duck GM w/o a new contract. And I prefer Bird stay that way. Does anyone know the date when his contract will end, so I can mark it on my new calendar?

    One would have to think Herb would bring in a real GM this next time around. With the franchise reeling over the past 5 years with failure after failure, and even talks of moving the franchise. I would think Herb is going to give one last hoorah with the team here in Indy and hire a top GM to rebuild this franchise. And if that doesn't work then he'll most likely give control to the next gen simon's and they will proceed with the most viable business solution.

  9. #34
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    http://www.hoopsworld.com/Chat.asp?CHAT_TOPICS_ID=677

    Pierre in Indy, IN:
    Are the Pacers just going to let this season crumble to the ground, or will they make a trade, or fire Jim O'Brien.. or both?

    Alex Kennedy:

    The general consensus in Indiana is that they're still a good team, they've just been plagued with injuries that have slowed them down. I can't see Jim O'Brien going anywhere, he's done his best without a full deck of cards and the management seems to trust him. They'll likely shop around but I can't see them making a huge trade. They want to see how they're team performs when healthy.

    Probably the most deliusional outlook I have ever heard
    Sittin on top of the world!

  10. #35
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by joew8302 View Post
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    When will people see Bird is as big of a problem as anything in the organization?
    If he really believes O'Brien is a good coach for this team the people will get the idea really quickly....

    ...I'm hoping he's just using O'Brien to tank the season for a high draft pick and then start working with a new coach for next season.

    If Bird goes into next season with O'Brien still at the helm... then by all means- Fire Bird.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  11. #36
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by 90'sNBARocked View Post
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    Alex Kennedy:

    .....he's done his best without a full deck of cards
    Ohhhhhhhhhhhhh, there are just so many jokes that could be made. Hard to choose which one.......

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  13. #37
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    I hope I am allowed to post this...if not I apologize, and won't do it again...

    Chris Sheridan Chat:

    http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/30119

    Travis (Bellevue,Ky)

    This year's Pacers team is terrible. The players have clearly given up, coach O'Brien has no idea how to find a rotation, and it doesn't seem there is any chemistry. Where do they go from here? Anyone have trade value, or do we ride it out until 2011 for cap room?
    Chris Sheridan (3:20 PM)

    I don't think I can recall ever seeing less production from a starting backcourt than what Indiana got out of Earl Watson and Dahntay Jones last night, and the plus-minus numbers for them were astounding (they were both minus-38, and Troy Murphy was a minus-40!). The strange thing is that watson's plus-minus numbers so so much better than T.J. Ford's before they made the lineup switch, and now the exact opposite is happening. Larry Bird gave Jim O'Brien a public vote of confidence, so I don't expect to see much change there. As for trade value, I'd say T.J. and Troy would have the most.
    Avatar photo credit: Bahram Mark Sobhani - AP

  14. #38

    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    The cold and snow has to have affected the brains of the powers that be in Indy this weekend.

    Dang....

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by odeez View Post
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    As for trade value, I'd say T.J. and Troy would have the most.
    And yet they're the two that need to go the most. I guess there is a silver lining.
    Last edited by Since86; 12-28-2009 at 03:36 PM.

  16. #40

    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by odeez View Post
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    I hope I am allowed to post this...if not I apologize, and won't do it again...

    Chris Sheridan Chat:

    http://espn.go.com/sportsnation/chat/_/id/30119

    Travis (Bellevue,Ky)

    This year's Pacers team is terrible. The players have clearly given up, coach O'Brien has no idea how to find a rotation, and it doesn't seem there is any chemistry. Where do they go from here? Anyone have trade value, or do we ride it out until 2011 for cap room?
    Chris Sheridan (3:20 PM)

    I don't think I can recall ever seeing less production from a starting backcourt than what Indiana got out of Earl Watson and Dahntay Jones last night, and the plus-minus numbers for them were astounding (they were both minus-38, and Troy Murphy was a minus-40!). The strange thing is that watson's plus-minus numbers so so much better than T.J. Ford's before they made the lineup switch, and now the exact opposite is happening. Larry Bird gave Jim O'Brien a public vote of confidence, so I don't expect to see much change there. As for trade value, I'd say T.J. and Troy would have the most.
    Good trade them both!

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Here come the pitch forks. Again and again and again.........

  18. #42
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by EmCeE View Post
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    Here come the pitch forks. Again and again and again.........
    Right, the pitch forks are definitely out today! That Miami loss really pushed a lot of us to the edge.
    Avatar photo credit: Bahram Mark Sobhani - AP

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by EmCeE View Post
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    Here come the pitch forks. Again and again and again.........
    You might like rooting for a horible team, but most of us do not.

    I have disliked the hiring of JOb since the very first time it was announced he was the HC. I ranted and raved about his offensive system, and tried to tell everyone who would listen about how his defensive....well whatever it is, wouldn't work either.

    Everything that has happened wasn't about "if" it was about "when." There isn't an angry mob having knee-jerk reactions. Those supposedly happpened three weeks ago.

    For some of us, those reactions have been "knee-jerk" for well over two years now.

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    You might like rooting for a horible team, but most of us do not.

    I have disliked the hiring of JOb since the very first time it was announced he was the HC. I ranted and raved about his offensive system, and tried to tell everyone who would listen about how his defensive....well whatever it is, wouldn't work either.

    Everything that has happened wasn't about "if" it was about "when." There isn't an angry mob having knee-jerk reactions. Those supposedly happpened three weeks ago.

    For some of us, those reactions have been "knee-jerk" for well over two years now.
    Nobody likes rooting for a bad team and neither do I. Forget two years ago. We became terrible when the "pitch forks" came out the year after the brawl, and our front office decided fans would rather lose than root for a bunch of so called thugs. The front office made a "knee jerk" reaction to our mumblings and now look. Everything we complain about is a direct result of those reactions. I don't think Larry plans to make the same mistake that Donnie and he himself did by listening to everything fans say.

    Please, don't confuse me for a JOb lover, but firing him accomplishes nothing at this point. The problem is personel and the fact that we took on two over-inflated long-term contracts for players who are basically mediocre in comparison to their pay. Also, we exiled a player with the other semi-big deal killing any chance of us moving him. Larry made that mistake. Then, we absorbed another long-term contract for an over-paid mediocre player in Ford. For two seasons we have not been able to sign any real help because of the cap situation, go figure. Futhermore, we have flopped on our draft choices outside of Tyler. So, this poor performance was to be expected from my perspective, and JOb has been the easy target ever since.

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    This is a good point and my biggest fear. That he'll screw up the plan. If he under trades those chips, it does screw them on two levels. You make a great point.
    I think the bigger fear ought to be whether he can trade most of those guys at all, not whether he gets enough for them.

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    And yet they're the two that need to go the most. I guess there is a silver lining.
    I see a major flaw in that comment. Do you?

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    When you say "mob" that paints the picture as an irrational bunch just out looking for blood. That is as far from the case as possible.

    JOb is the root of the problem. Look at his offensive designs. What are they? They highlight the skills of players like Troy Murphy, and put players like Roy Hibbert on the bench. The message is too shoot the ball when open. Players like D.Jones aren't good shooters. TJ isn't a good shooter.

    A good coach plays towards the strength of his players. He doesn't change 25-30 year old men into what he wants. They are what they are. They cannot be changed. The definition of insane is trying the same things and expecting a different result (paraphrasing of course). That is exactly what JOb is doing. He keeps getting a bigger hammer to try and fit his square peg into a round hole.

    All summer he talked about getting better defensive players. So he got D.Jones, Solo, and Watson. Then he decides it's better to start Rush, when it was obvious to all that DJones was the heart of the team, and a pretty damn good defender in himself.

    It took him how long to realize TJ shouldn't be the first option at PG. But at the same time, he was leaving TJ in to finish games. (That makes sense)

    Solo might as well sit beside Deiner. All while Murphy continues to play big minutes. As long as the offense doesn't suffer, they need better defenders. That is the message. As long as you can shoot the 3, and spread the floor, you get playing time. I about puked when I watched McRoberts set up for a PnR and instead of rolling, he stepped out and shot a damn 3. I immediately turned off the game.

    This team as constructed won't win any rings. Obviously. Then what is the goal for the organization? When you start a season NBA Live, it asks you what you want as a direction for your club. Rebuild, Develop, or Contend.

    JOb is trying to contend while everyone else is in rebuild/develop mode. Like I've said many times. I can take losses when young players get big minutes. In the end they will either develop, or they won't. Either way you learn a lot about them, and find out what needs to happen in the future.

    Troy Murphy is who he is, and playing him big minutes pushes back the development of younger players, doesn't allow you to evaluate them, nor decide if they should be a part of the future and if so what role they are capable of performing.


    Other than saving money, what positives come out of keeping him around? None.

    EDIT: And now he say's they need faster players. No what they need is a different coach.
    Last edited by Since86; 12-28-2009 at 04:27 PM.

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  28. #48
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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by EmCeE View Post
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    Nobody likes rooting for a bad team and neither do I. Forget two years ago. We became terrible when the "pitch forks" came out the year after the brawl, and our front office decided fans would rather lose than root for a bunch of so called thugs. The front office made a "knee jerk" reaction to our mumblings and now look. Everything we complain about is a direct result of those reactions. I don't think Larry plans to make the same mistake that Donnie and he himself did by listening to everything fans say.

    Please, don't confuse me for a JOb lover, but firing him accomplishes nothing at this point. The problem is personel and the fact that we took on two over-inflated long-term contracts for players who are basically mediocre in comparison to their pay. Also, we exiled a player with the other semi-big deal killing any chance of us moving him. Larry made that mistake. Then, we absorbed another long-term contract for an over-paid mediocre player in Ford. For two seasons we have not been able to sign any real help because of the cap situation, go figure. Futhermore, we have flopped on our draft choices outside of Tyler. So, this poor performance was to be expected from my perspective, and JOb has been the easy target ever since.
    Well at least it will provide change and a "hope" in the fans eyes that this play is unacceptable and they are serious about putting a better product on the floor.

    But you are correct as far as it probably wont impact the record much
    Sittin on top of the world!

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    [QUOTE=Since86;934978]When you say "mob" that paints the picture as an irrational bunch just out looking for blood. That is as far from the case as possible.

    JOb is the root of the problem. Look at his offensive designs. What are they? They highlight the skills of players like Troy Murphy, and put players like Roy Hibbert on the bench. The message is too shoot the ball when open. Players like D.Jones aren't good shooters. TJ isn't a good shooter.

    A good coach plays towards the strength of his players. He doesn't change 25-30 year old men into what he wants. They are what they are. They cannot be changed. The definition of insane is trying the same things and expecting a different result (paraphrasing of course). That is exactly what JOb is doing. He keeps getting a bigger hammer to try and fit his square peg into a round hole.


    All summer he talked about getting better defensive players. So he got D.Jones, Solo, and Watson. Then he decides it's better to start Rush, when it was obvious to all that DJones was the heart of the team, and a pretty damn good defender in himself.

    It took him how long to realize TJ shouldn't be the first option at PG. But at the same time, he was leaving TJ in to finish games. (That makes sense)

    Solo might as well sit beside Deiner. All while Murphy continues to play big minutes. As long as the offense doesn't suffer, they need better defenders. That is the message. As long as you can shoot the 3, and spread the floor, you get playing time. I about puked when I watched McRoberts set up for a PnR and instead of rolling, he stepped out and shot a damn 3. I immediately turned off the game.

    This team as constructed won't win any rings. Obviously. Then what is the goal for the organization? When you start a season NBA Live, it asks you what you want as a direction for your club. Rebuild, Develop, or Contend.

    JOb is trying to contend while everyone else is in rebuild/develop mode. Like I've said many times. I can take losses when young players get big minutes. In the end they will either develop, or they won't. Either way you learn a lot about them, and find out what needs to happen in the future.

    Troy Murphy is who he is, and playing him big minutes pushes back the development of younger players, doesn't allow you to evaluate them, nor decide if they should be a part of the future and if so what role they are capable of performing.


    Other than saving money, what positives come out of keeping him around? None.



    I agree, a good coach will adapt his style of coaching that play to his current players strengths , rather than their weakness

    Not the other way around
    Sittin on top of the world!

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    Default Re: Star: O'Brien's job is secure

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Troy Murphy is who he is, and playing him big minutes pushes back the development of younger players, doesn't allow you to evaluate them, nor decide if they should be a part of the future and if so what role they are capable of performing.


    Other than saving money, what positives come out of keeping him around? None.

    EDIT: And now he say's they need faster players. No what they need is a different coach.
    What players? Solo? Hansborough who is getting his minutes? McBob? Though he might deserve more play. Hibbert? Please get me started on him. Foster has been hurt, so be glad Solo has recieved any burn.

    So my counter question to you what are the positives to firing Jim? This team is better off finishing season with Jim. After the season is over then we do what we should do with Jim, but now this very sad team would not benefit from changing the current scheme because that will only cause more confusion learning a new scheme mid-season. Jim's biggest weakness is his lack of faith in a rotation, so I guess you have a point. It's just not a good time to do this. Last season we had the same problems, so maybe Jim finds a rotation and we finish strong again(Yeah, it's wishful thinking). Not a mark of a terrible coach though.

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