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Thread: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

  1. #51

    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Okur, not Okafor. Think Utah.

    Yeah, I caught myself, but didn't get it deleted in time. My bad.

  2. #52

    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Now that my mind is clear, hopefully, who is going to play the starting 5 for UTAH? Fesenko? Koufos? I don't see Utah being interested. Not to mention Ford wouldn't be able to play for Sloan.
    Last edited by Justin Tyme; 01-04-2010 at 02:48 PM.

  3. #53
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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Speed,

    You're not wrong, but at least this one can play the 5 without it feeling as much like it's a SF trying to wear C's clothing.
    True. It's probably the closest thing they'd do that I can see. Utah just doesn't seem to be a match in a trade, unless Bird covets Koufas and Sloan hates him, then I could see a Deiner (Expiring Contract) for him. I'm just throwing stuff out there.

    All of the players the Pacers would want are either expiring already (Boozer) or expiring the same time (AK47) or are keepers for them.

    I'd say they need a 2 or 3 for 1 trade for AK47 that has expiring contracts for this year. That's really what they need and that's not what we have.

    Side Note: Hoopshype shows Okur expiring in 10/11, so it would be a push as far as timing for the Pacers with TJ picking up his option, I think, if this is true.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    Side Note: Hoopshype shows Okur expiring in 10/11, so it would be a push as far as timing for the Pacers with TJ picking up his option, I think, if this is true.
    Shamsports shows that Okur has a deal that lasts until the 2011-2012 season ( no option or anything ).

    http://www.shamsports.com/content/pa...aries/jazz.jsp

    Shamsports has been more reliable when it comes to SalaryCap info then Hoopshype.

    I still think that the Jazz are in "SalaryCap clearing" mode and the only player that seems logical to move would be Boozer. He's made it pretty clear that he wants to get paid....and it's pretty obvious that the Jazz won't be paying him the $$$ he thinks he deserves.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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  6. #55
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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    Shamsports shows that Okur has a deal that lasts until the 2011-2012 season ( no option or anything ).

    http://www.shamsports.com/content/pa...aries/jazz.jsp

    Shamsports has been more reliable when it comes to SalaryCap info then Hoopshype.

    I still think that the Jazz are in "SalaryCap clearing" mode and the only player that seems logical to move would be Boozer. He's made it pretty clear that he wants to get paid....and it's pretty obvious that the Jazz won't be paying him the $$$ he thinks he deserves.
    So it's two things at work for them, getting something for Boozer before he just leaves AND dropping salary overal to try to get under the luxury threshold.

    Still doesn't help the Pacers. Nothing they'd want for Boozer other than our lottery pick this year, I'd imagine. Not even sure how enticing that is for them, since they are in win now or in the near future mode.

    I just want to be careful here until Feb. not try to draw an inside straight. I'd rather just fold and wait for a better hand, which should be this summer. I'm not saying they'll be in the best position then, but much better than this moment.

    Right now, it's about as bad as you can get. Max salary, not winning, no assets. This will improve some, but man Bird better be careful, right now.

    Now that I'm off on a tangent, let's say nothing happens before Feb 2010, which I think is likely other than an attempt to get under the Tax for next year, but so is everyone else. It will be a buyers market the next 7 weeks. And I guess as others have said moving Jeff to a contender is probably the best chance they have. That is inconsequential to this teams situation (love Jeff, it just doesn't matter that much, rigth now)

    And then, you get expiring contracts worth 40 some million to play with and a top 5-10 pick this summer..... and then you do nothing all the way through Feb 2011 because well, there wasn't anything worth doing.

    All is not lost, you still at least have a blank slate. Your negative right now and by quite a bit. At least then you can work from zero.

    So I guess what I'm saying is, man, I hope they don't shuffle the deck chairs on the Titantic here and just wait for something really worth doing.
    Last edited by Speed; 01-04-2010 at 03:34 PM.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    I'd give them Foster for Korver's expiring contract.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    Now that I'm off on a tangent, let's say nothing happens before Feb 2010, which I think is likely other than an attempt to get under the Tax for next year, but so is everyone else. It will be a buyers market the next 7 weeks. And I guess as others have said moving Jeff to a contender is probably the best chance they have. That is inconsequential to this teams situation (love Jeff, it just doesn't matter that much, rigth now)
    As much as I hate it....I suspect that Bird will be doing his best to continue to move the "un-moveable" by trying to trade Dunleavy, Ford or Murphy for an 2009-2010 Expiring Contract....but I'm afraid that the most realistic contract to move ( only cuz of his trade value ) is Foster. I wouldn't be surprised if Dunleavy, Ford, Murphy OR Foster is not on the roster the day after the 2009-2010 Trade Deadline....I'm afraid that the most likely scenario would be for Foster to be sent packing.

    The reality of the situation is that IF we do not move any of them before this year's Trade Deadline......the only way to get under the SalaryCap for the 2010-2011 season ( which we are likely over ) is to make a deal like the one that the Nuggets were forced to do with Camby ( last season ) for 2nd round pick ( essentially a Salary Dump for a valuable Trading Asset ) or the one the Jazz were forced to do by including "Sweetner" ( Maynor ) to simply move Harpring because they had ZERO choice IF wanted to avoid the Luxury Tax for that season.

    I don't like that we'd have to likely give up Foster for nothing....but I have a feeling that is where we we will be in 2 months.

    Quote Originally Posted by Speed View Post
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    And then, you get expiring contracts worth 40 some million to play with and a top 5-10 pick this summer..... and then you do nothing all the way through Feb 2011 because well, there wasn't anything worth doing.

    All is not lost, you still at least have a blank slate. Your negative right now and by quite a bit. At least then you can work from zero.

    So I guess what I'm saying is, man, I hope they don't shuffle the deck chairs on the Titantic here and just wait for something really worth doing.
    A 3 year plan that involves doing little to nothing by simply letting the bulk of the 2010-2011 Contracts expire may not seem as glamorous as one where we trade them away for Players ( while grooming a young core of players to take over in the 2011-2012 season ), but IMHO given where we are now and our financial situation...I'd rather do what the Thunder have done by maintaining a young core and having significant financial/SalaryCap flexiblility. If a Team is patient and makes smart but deliberate moves.....at the start of the 2011-2012 season, we'll be in a good position to significantly improve this team through FA and ( more then likely ) be Financially Flexible enough to make the type of moves that the Thunder have made over the last 2 seasons.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by CableKC View Post
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    The reality of the situation is that IF we do not move any of them before this year's Trade Deadline......the only way to get under the SalaryCap for the 2010-2011 season ( which we are likely over ) is to make a deal like the one that the Nuggets were forced to do with Camby ( last season ) for 2nd round pick ( essentially a Salary Dump for a valuable Trading Asset ) or the one the Jazz were forced to do by including "Sweetner" ( Maynor ) to simply move Harpring because they had ZERO choice IF wanted to avoid the Luxury Tax for that season.
    Isn't the tax based on the salaries at the end of the season? In that case don't we have until the trade deadline of 2010-2011?
    BillS

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  11. #59
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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Isn't the tax based on the salaries at the end of the season? In that case don't we have until the trade deadline of 2010-2011?
    We do, but if we wait until next year, then we would have to find somebody under the cap to take the salaries without sending as much or any back. There aren't a lot of teams in that position.

    To avoid next year's luxury tax, trying to do it by this trading deadline provides the most options, because we could match contracts, as long as the ones coming in expire this season.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    We're worried about paying the tax THIS year (2010), aren't we? 2011 is when our cap drops like a rock if we keep these contracts.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    We're worried about paying the tax THIS year (2010), aren't we? 2011 is when our cap drops like a rock if we keep these contracts.
    No. We aren't worried about the tax this year. We're about $3mm under this year.

    We're already above next year's highest projection of $65mm, with only 12 players under contract, and that's before we sign our draft picks.

    The lowest threshold I've see is about $60-61mm, but it's all up in the air.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Isn't the tax based on the salaries at the end of the season? In that case don't we have until the trade deadline of 2010-2011?
    Yes.....technically you are right. But the problem will be that we will be about $7-8 mil over the "possible" Luxury Tax Threshold going into the 2010-2011 season. After the start of the 2010-2011 season...unless we luck out and find a Team that is under the Luxury Tax that is willing to take on any of their 2010-2011 contract without sending back any Salary back.....then we'd be forced ( at the very least ) to take on a deal where we take back a Player that has a 2010-2011 Salary...which at most could only be 25% less then what we send out...thus still keeping us over the 2010-2011 LT.

    The problem with the "take one of our 2010-2011 Contracts back while sending back NO 2010-2011 Salary" is that it's going to be VERY HARD to find a Taker without requiring some "incentive" on our part.....hence my comments about the Camby and Maynor+Harpring deal for the Nuggets and Jazz. They were in a position just like the Pacers will be next season where they were significantly over the LT threshold going into the season and HAD to make a move just to dump salary. It came at a price ( losing a productive Player like Camby for nothing and giving up on Maynor just to dump Harpring ). That's why I'm saying that it's important to move at least 1 of the 2010-2011 Expiring Contracts before the end of the 2009-2010 trade deadline. Clearing any of them from the 2010-2011 SalaryCap prior to going into the start of the 2010-2011 season won't put us in a position where we will likely be forced to provide "sweetner" to move them when we will be forced to move them.

    I'm guessing that count55 could explain it better then this long-winded post....but this is the very reason why I ( and many of us ) were saying that IF there was an deal before the 2009-2010 Trade Deadline to move Murphy for BigZ ( essentially a Salary Dump ) that we should take it and run. There will be plenty of teams that will be under the 2010-2011 LT threshold due to the 2010-2011 FA Sweepstakes....but none of them would be interested in our Players ( maybe Foster at best ).

    No matter what....we have to clear $7 to 8 mil from the 2010-2011 Salary Cap...how we do it is in question. It's preferable ( and less costly ) to do move them prior to the start of the season ( specifically not having their Salary on the books BEFORE going into the season ) as opposed to trying to so with them off the books going into the season ( only cuz of the likely cost that will be incurred to simply dump their salary ).
    Last edited by CableKC; 01-04-2010 at 05:24 PM.
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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    We do, but if we wait until next year, then we would have to find somebody under the cap to take the salaries without sending as much or any back. There aren't a lot of teams in that position.

    To avoid next year's luxury tax, trying to do it by this trading deadline provides the most options, because we could match contracts, as long as the ones coming in expire this season.
    See...I told you that count55 could explain it better then my 3 paragraph explanation.

    Given the liklihood that we won't find any takers for Murphy, Dunleavy and Ford before the 2009-2010 trade deadline......Foster is as good as gone. I'm pretty sure that there has been several teams over the years that have expressed interest in Foster. If Bird hasn't called them up yet....I wouldn't be suprised if they won't be receiving a call in the next month.

    count55, how much Salary can we take back this season before we go over the 2009-2010 Luxury Tax?

    I'm trying to figure out the Salary Range of a 2009-2010 Expiring contract if Foster is the likely candidate that is shipped out for a Salary Dump.
    Last edited by CableKC; 01-04-2010 at 05:27 PM.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    No. We aren't worried about the tax this year. We're about $3mm under this year.

    We're already above next year's highest projection of $65mm, with only 12 players under contract, and that's before we sign our draft picks.

    The lowest threshold I've see is about $60-61mm, but it's all up in the air.
    Are we just referring to the same thing by different names? This is 09-10, and at the end of this year (10), I thought we were going to be over the tax.

    Now, next year is 10-11, where Ford, Tinsley, Murphy, Dunleavy, and Foster are expiring contracts, so there's no way the '11 tax is a concern at this time.

    What is the magic date for being over/under the tax for this 09-10 season? When is that magic date for 10-11?

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Are we just referring to the same thing by different names? This is 09-10, and at the end of this year (10), I thought we were going to be over the tax.

    Now, next year is 10-11, where Ford, Tinsley, Murphy, Dunleavy, and Foster are expiring contracts, so there's no way the '11 tax is a concern at this time.

    What is the magic date for being over/under the tax for this 09-10 season? When is that magic date for 10-11?
    I think that what count55 is saying is that for this season ( the 2009-2010 season ) we don't have to worry about the Luxury Tax.

    For the next season....specifically the 2010-2011 season when Ford/Murphy/Dunleavy/Foster's Contracts ( despite expiring that season ) are still counted towards the 2010-2011 Salary Cap.. ..we do have to worry about the Luxury Tax since they will count towards the 2010-2011 Salary Cap.

    The season that we will be "free and clear" of any LT tax concerns is 2 seasons from now ( think November 2011 ).....in the 2011-2012 season when everyone of them ( including Tinsley ) are cleared from the books.
    Last edited by CableKC; 01-04-2010 at 05:54 PM.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    A team's cap/tax figure is based on the payroll as of their final game of the season.
    Last edited by count55; 01-04-2010 at 09:05 PM.

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    Default Re: Jazz trade rookie Eric Maynor to Oklahoma City

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    Speed,

    You're not wrong, but at least this one can play the 5 without it feeling as much like it's a SF trying to wear C's clothing.
    And Troy would no longer be the slowest guy on the floor!

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