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Thread: Andre Miller and Tmac

  1. #26
    10 - 32 - 50 31andonly's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Don't you actually think that the Rockets could get much much better offers than our superstars Troy Murphy and TJ Ford??

    I mean...he's got that 23 million $ expiring contract!

    Don't understand me wrong, I'd be all for it, but Houston can surely do better which leads me to believe that this scenario is pretty unrealistic.
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  2. #27
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by JGray View Post
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    The problem with that is that we'd be stuck with only two point guards on the roster after that. We would either need them to add in Lowry or we'd have to sign a point guard. I say we add in McRoberts instead, if that works.
    I'd play Luther Head at the point, which would give us 3 PGs. If two guys break legs I'd consider running Jones at point and Dun at SG with Mike actually controlling the offense.

    You don't nix the trade because of Travis Diener.
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  4. #28
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by 31andonly View Post
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    Don't you actually think that the Rockets could get much much better offers than our superstars Troy Murphy and TJ Ford??

    I mean...he's got that 23 million $ expiring contract!

    Don't understand me wrong, I'd be all for it, but Houston can surely do better which leads me to believe that this scenario is pretty unrealistic.
    Yeah, I'd think so too, but the articles linked seem to suggest they're finding no takers.
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  5. #29

    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Yeah, I'd think so too, but the articles linked seem to suggest they're finding no takers.
    TMac is a great player.

    But he's injury prone and aging. I don't quite know his contract, but I'd guess it's not a great one for a team to take on.

    Still, TMac has a LOT of advantages for the pacers, in this trade.

    1. He can shoot. This seems to be a requirement in order to get minutes *unless of course you are a point guard, then if you can shoot you sit on the bench*

    2. He's injury prone. This sounds bad, but if he gets hurt, JOB will be forced to play rush.

    3. This trade gets rid of TJ Ford and Troy Murphy..seriously..a bag of potatoe chips and I might agree..

  6. #30
    Cheeseburger in Paradise Los Angeles's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    I love Andre Miller. He's smart, a great locker room guy, physically resilient, capable and adaptable.
    “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.” - Winston Churchill

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  7. #31

    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    I'd play Luther Head at the point, which would give us 3 PGs. If two guys break legs I'd consider running Jones at point and Dun at SG with Mike actually controlling the offense.

    You don't nix the trade because of Travis Diener.

    I find it odd people never realize Head plays PG too!

  8. #32

    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    I wonder what the asking price is for TMac. It sounds like they're basically trying to GIVE him away... if they'd do TJ/Troy for him then it's a no-brainer.

    edit: Add Diener and the numbers work out just about perfectly.

    I totally agree. Not only would the Pacers be getting rid of Murphy and Ford, but they get a 22 mil contract that expires at seasons end. The problem with Houston trading Mac is they almost have to take back more than one contract to get a deal, and they have 15 guaranteed contracts. Unless they take back less in contracts and still meet the CBA requirement, so the difference would allow them to cut an expiring contact or two.

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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    With Oden now out for the season, and the injuries the Blazers are already dealing with, the latest article quotes the GM as saying he may have to look for some help. We know they're deep at the PG position and would be looking to trade Miller for a big man. This would be a good time for Larry to pick up the phone.

  10. #34
    Artificial Intelligence wintermute's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    With Oden now out for the season, and the injuries the Blazers are already dealing with, the latest article quotes the GM as saying he may have to look for some help. We know they're deep at the PG position and would be looking to trade Miller for a big man. This would be a good time for Larry to pick up the phone.
    we don't exactly have a glut of big men either. foster, i suppose, is the only one who makes sense - i mean, for portland.

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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    we don't exactly have a glut of big men either. foster, i suppose, is the only one who makes sense - i mean, for portland.
    I'd be hoping for Murphy if it could happen. You're right though in that Foster would fill in more for Oden then Murphy ever could and his salary is closer to matching Millers.

  12. #36
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    send Mike dunleavy to porland get A.Miller
    send TJ and Murphy to Houston get T.mac

    PG: Miller/Waston,
    SG :T.mac/D.Jones
    SF: Granger/Rush
    PF:foster/Hansbrough
    C:Roy/S.Jones

    Ganger can play PF
    so maybe

    PG: Miller/Waston
    SG: D.Jones/Rush/Head
    SF:T.mac/Rush
    PF:Granger/Hansbrough
    C:Roy/foster

    !!!!BETTER TEAM, Tmac = 2010 expire contract!!!

  13. #37
    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Houston is not going to take Murphy or Ford with the dork Elvis running the show. The advanced numbers generate too many red flags.

  14. #38
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    I wish this was T Mac of 3 or 4 years ago, not they guy who is coming off major surgury and you never know if he'll be any good.

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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    If I was Larry, I'd trade anyone not named Granger or Hibbert to get TMac. Whether TMac can play is irrelevant. The #1 reason to pull the trigger on this trade is to get that $23 million dollar expiring contract.

    There will be a dozen good FAs this summer and shedding $23 million of payroll will allow the Pacers to go after a max level or near max level player. They won't be able to attract a Wade or Lebron but Bosh might be interested in playing here if NY or NJ doesn't come through with a good enough offer.

    Even if they can't attract a big name FA, having $23 million knocked from the payroll at the end of the season is reason enough to try and make a trade. Rush, Dunleavy, and Murphy for TMac, Jermaine Taylor, and a 2nd rounder would work and it might be enough for Houston to pull the trigger.
    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
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    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
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    If I was Larry, I'd trade anyone not named Granger or Hibbert to get TMac. Whether TMac can play is irrelevant. The #1 reason to pull the trigger on this trade is to get that $23 million dollar expiring contract.

    There will be a dozen good FAs this summer and shedding $23 million of payroll will allow the Pacers to go after a max level or near max level player. They won't be able to attract a Wade or Lebron but Bosh might be interested in playing here if NY or NJ doesn't come through with a good enough offer.

    Even if they can't attract a big name FA, having $23 million knocked from the payroll at the end of the season is reason enough to try and make a trade. Rush, Dunleavy, and Murphy for TMac, Jermaine Taylor, and a 2nd rounder would work and it might be enough for Houston to pull the trigger.
    No, it won't.

    Shedding $23 million would put us about $42mm vs. an expected cap figure of roughly $50mm, so only about $8mm of actual cap space. We'd probably be looking at sending two or three guys to match McGrady's contract, so the $42mm would maybe be for 8 or 9 guys.

    We'd also have cap holds for our 1st rounder and the MLE. We could renounce the MLE, but then we'd basically only be able sign someone for a little more than the MLE. Then, once we hit the cap, we would be completely out of options (in this scenario) to fill out the roster. We would have renounced our MLE, used our BAE (on Solo this year), and be restricted to filling out the roster with league min signings.

    The scenario that gives us the most options would be to make that deal, then use the MLE (not the free capspace).

    However, that would mean that we'd have to use two or three of our 2011 trading chips (the then-expiring contracts) to get tax relief, and an MLE acquisition, which would also chew up $5-6mm of our "free" cap space in 2011.

    The Pacers would be better off trying to get a smaller expiring (like Big Z's) to provide tax relief for next year while keeping as many options open as possible for the year following. The McGrady deal seems like a squandered opportunity.

    More to the point, if you look at how Darryl Morey runs the Rockets, you would realize that Murphy and Ford are extremely unlikely to be the types of players he would go get.

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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    The scenario that gives us the most options would be to make that deal, then use the MLE (not the free capspace).

    However, that would mean that we'd have to use two or three of our 2011 trading chips (the then-expiring contracts) to get tax relief, and an MLE acquisition, which would also chew up $5-6mm of our "free" cap space in 2011.

    The Pacers would be better off trying to get a smaller expiring (like Big Z's) to provide tax relief for next year while keeping as many options open as possible for the year following. The McGrady deal seems like a squandered opportunity..
    That certainly works for me. There will be plenty of players available this year for the MLE or the 8 million or so. Also, this would make it easier for them to make trades in the offseason if they're under the cap. I don't see how that makes that deal not worth it.

    The alternative looks like it will envolve the Pacers brass paying the luxury tax for a team that's probably not going to be competitive this season as well as not making the playoffs. Between the 2 options, which one is better?

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    More to the point, if you look at how Darryl Morey runs the Rockets, you would realize that Murphy and Ford are extremely unlikely to be the types of players he would go get.
    My trade scenario included Rush and Dunleavy to make the taste of Murphy more palatable.
    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
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    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
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    My trade scenario included Rush and Dunleavy to make the taste of Murphy more palatable.
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    A horducken!

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
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    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
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  22. #44
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    Default Re: Andre Miller and Tmac

    Thanks for the info Count. I didn't know that a team couldn't use it's MLE in addition to it's cap space. It still might be worth it to go after a player in the 8 mil range, then fill in the other roster spots with vet. min. players. I guess if this happened then we'd be in about the same position next year after the 3-4 contracts including Tinsleys drop off.
    Overall I think I agree with you that it would be better to have the cap room to go after a higher quality player in 2011. That, or trade our expiring contracts for the player we want.

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    No, it won't.

    Shedding $23 million would put us about $42mm vs. an expected cap figure of roughly $50mm, so only about $8mm of actual cap space. We'd probably be looking at sending two or three guys to match McGrady's contract, so the $42mm would maybe be for 8 or 9 guys.

    We'd also have cap holds for our 1st rounder and the MLE. We could renounce the MLE, but then we'd basically only be able sign someone for a little more than the MLE. Then, once we hit the cap, we would be completely out of options (in this scenario) to fill out the roster. We would have renounced our MLE, used our BAE (on Solo this year), and be restricted to filling out the roster with league min signings.

    The scenario that gives us the most options would be to make that deal, then use the MLE (not the free capspace).

    However, that would mean that we'd have to use two or three of our 2011 trading chips (the then-expiring contracts) to get tax relief, and an MLE acquisition, which would also chew up $5-6mm of our "free" cap space in 2011.

    The Pacers would be better off trying to get a smaller expiring (like Big Z's) to provide tax relief for next year while keeping as many options open as possible for the year following. The McGrady deal seems like a squandered opportunity.

    More to the point, if you look at how Darryl Morey runs the Rockets, you would realize that Murphy and Ford are extremely unlikely to be the types of players he would go get.

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