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Thread: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

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    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
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    Default Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    OFFSEASON CHANGES
    Picky Pacers
    Team doesn't want to gut roster as it searches for 1 key addition

    By Mark Montieth
    mark.montieth@indystar.com
    July 6, 2004

    He met their bosses, dined with their coaches and waited for an invitation that didn't come.

    The Indiana Pacers had no room on their payroll for Stephen Jackson a year ago, and he wound up signing an undervalued contract with Atlanta. He hopes the timing -- and money -- is better this year.

    "That's a situation I'd love to be in," Jackson said. "That team is already a dominant team. I'd just be another piece that helps them get where they want to go."

    Despite the apparent availability of a few premier players around the NBA, any trades or free agent acquisitions the Pacers make this month more likely will involve the likes of Jackson: players who address needs, improve the team and are realistically available without gutting the roster.

    Jackson is among the free agents the Pacers are pursuing during the negotiation period that began Thursday. Contracts, free agent offer sheets and trades may not be executed until July 14.

    Other primary targets include unrestricted free agents Erick Dampier (Warriors), Brent Barry (Sonics), Derek Fisher (Lakers) and Mark Blount (Celtics).

    Jackson, a 6-8 swingman who averaged a team-high 18.1 points for the Hawks last season, would bring athleticism, energy and perimeter shooting to the Pacers. Dampier, a 6-11 center who played his rookie season with Indiana, would add size and rebounding. Barry and Fisher can play either guard position, and would bring experience, poise and shooting. Blount, a 7-foot center who blossomed in his fourth season, is the second-best free agent center behind Dampier.

    Players such as point guards Keyon Dooling (Clippers) and Carlos Arroyo (Jazz), center Adonal Foyle (Warriors) and forward Brian Cardinal (Warriors) also could warrant interest. Foyle and Cardinal are unrestricted free agents; Dooling and Arroyo are restricted, meaning their former teams can match any offer they receive.

    The Pacers are over the salary cap, leaving them with exceptions of $1.6 million and $5.1 million to offer free agents. CEO Donnie Walsh said he is willing to offer the full mid-level exception in certain circumstances, but he prefers to work a sign-and-trade arrangement for those players who can command higher salaries.

    Jackson and Dampier appear to have the most early interest in the Pacers, but each will have several options.

    Jackson listed the Pacers, Atlanta and San Antonio as his top choices. The Hawks drafted three players who are similar to him in size last week. Jackson took that as a sign Atlanta no longer is interested in him, but general manager Billy Knight rejected that notion.

    Jackson started at shooting guard on San Antonio's championship team in 2003, averaging 12.8 points in the playoffs. He was Atlanta's leading scorer last season and scored a career-high 42 points against Washington.

    He has a close relationship with Pacers assistant Mike Brown, who worked with him in San Antonio for two seasons. Brown was a candidate for Atlanta's head coaching position, which went to Mike Woodson.

    "Mike Brown has been a big part of my success," Jackson said. "He taught me how to work and how to get better."

    Jackson had dinner with Brown and Pacers coach Rick Carlisle last September, and met with Walsh and team president Larry Bird. The Pacers already had extended guaranteed contracts to 15 players, however. He signed a two-year, $2.1 million contract with Atlanta the next day, but exercised his option to become a free agent after the season.

    "We had a great meeting," Jackson said. "They got a chance to see what type of person I am and how hungry I am."

    Brown already had that feeling from his experience with Jackson in San Antonio. Jackson has been prone to emotional outbursts, but Brown described him as an energetic player and a "good teammate" capable of motivating others.

    "He can help any team," Brown said. "He's a big-time competitor; he really wants to win. I think he'd be a great fit here."

    Dampier was traded for Chris Mullin in the summer of 1997, following his rookie season. He began telling Pacers officials he wanted to return soon after. He is one of the league's hottest commodities this summer, however, and Denver, Atlanta, San Antonio and the Los Angeles Clippers have enough salary cap space to offer an increase on last season's salary of $8.1 million.

    To get Dampier, the Pacers would have to work a sign-and-trade with Golden State, whose basketball operations are directed by Mullin.

    Dampier, who was unavailable for comment, also has expressed interest in Memphis, the closest NBA team to his home in Mississippi. He attended a Grizzlies playoff game last season and has been recruited by some of their players since the season ended.

    Pacers forward Jermaine O'Neal also has been trying to lure Dampier, however. And Dampier might be willing to be lured.

    "He's always talked about going back to Indiana because he didn't want to leave there to begin with," said Ed Jones, Dampier's business manager.

    The Pacers have not made arrangements for anyone to visit, preferring to deal with agents on the telephone. Recruiting tactics, they believe, aren't what drive a decision for a veteran player.

    "My feeling is, they know what you've got," Walsh said. "They want to be on a winning team and to make the money. If you offer the money, you might want to bring them down to talk to them. But all this flying around and recruiting . . . I think it might work with some younger players, but I think you'll see less and less of that."


    Five who fit
    A look at the five free agents who best fit the Indiana Pacers' needs.

    Stephen Jackson
    Age: 26
    Size: 6-8, 218
    Previous team: Atlanta
    Stats: Averaged career-high 18.1 points, 4.6 rebounds and 1.8 steals last season.
    Note: Would provide perimeter shooting, athleticism and versatility. Has close relationship with Pacers assistant Mike Brown from their two seasons together in San Antonio. Their relationship could give Indiana the inside track. Didn't play in college and had troubled beginning to NBA career, but has matured greatly.
    Cost: Was a bargain at $1 million last season. Will command at least $4 million and possibly more if several teams get involved.

    Erick Dampier
    Age: 29
    Size: 6-11, 265
    Previous team: Golden State
    Stats: Averaged 12.3 points and 12 rebounds for Warriors last season. Led NBA in rebounds per 48 minutes (17.7).
    Note: Former Pacer would add bulk to the front line and improve rebounding and defense. Some wonder if his improved play last season was motivated by upcoming free agency, but he still is the best center available.
    Cost: Will be a target of several teams in need of a center and can therefore command a high salary. Opted out of a contract that would have paid him $8.1 million next season and could get as much as $10 million. Pacers would have to arrange a sign-and-trade to get him.

    Brent Barry
    Age: 32
    Size: 6-6, 215
    Previous team: Seattle
    Stats: Averaged 10.8 points and 5.8 assists last season. Shot 50 percent from the field, 45 percent from 3-point range and 83 percent from the foul line.
    Note: Fits backcourt needs as a combo guard who shoots well from the perimeter. Has played shooting guard most of his career but made smooth transition to point guard after Sonics traded Gary Payton to Milwaukee for Ray Allen two seasons ago.
    Cost: Was paid $5.4 million last season. Could command a raise because Denver, which has $23 million in salary cap room, is among the suitors. Might be available for the mid-level exception of about $5 million to a team willing to offer long-term contract.

    Derek Fisher
    Age: 29
    Size: 6-1, 200
    Previous team: Lakers
    Stats: Averaged 7.1 points off the bench last season. Shot just 35 percent from the field and 29 percent from 3-point range in the regular season, but hit 42 percent of 3-pointers in the playoffs. Hit dramatic 18-footer at buzzer to beat San Antonio in Game 5 of Western Conference semifinals.
    Note: Can play either guard position and brings veteran poise and maturity. Wants to start but would accept backup role for a contending team.
    Cost: Was paid $3 million last season. Unlikely to get a significant raise and might be available for less. Perhaps obtainable with a portion of the mid-level exception.

    Mark Blount
    Age: 28
    Size: 7-foot, 230
    Previous team: Boston
    Stats: Averaged 10.3 points, 7.2 rebounds and 1.3 blocks last season, and 12 points and 9.3 rebounds in playoff series against Pacers.
    Note: Late-blooming player left University of Pittsburgh after two seasons, then knocked around minor leagues. Showed dramatic improvement last season with more playing time.
    Cost: Was paid $945,000 last season. It has been widely assumed he will sign with Miami because he makes his offseason home in that area, but other teams will offer more money. Philadelphia has made him its top priority and is said to have offered a midlevel exception. It also can reunite him with former coach in Boston, Jim O'Brien, who met with him five minutes after the negotiating period started at midnight July 1.

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    Offical Thread Killer TheSauceMaster's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Very good prospects and I hope they really mean they don't want to gut the roster , we need a tuneup ...no a overhaul.

    I would be very happy if we got Stephen Jackson , Blount would be nice also , I am not too intrested in brent barry because of his age . I am not so sure about fisher but if he can be had for a reasonable price I think he would make a nice pickup.
    [edit=279=1089109335][/edit]

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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    I think Barry might be a good pick up because of his age.

    He still has a solid game & I don't see him as the type that would want to come in here & start over Reggie in his final year.

    After that Fred might be ready to start which would leave Barry coming off the bench at both gaurd spots.

    Nice to have a solid veteran that can back up 2 spots, nail the 3 & find guys cutting to the rack.

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    Member Doug in CO's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    I thought Bird was in charge?

    I do not like the fact that the Pacers would rather trade than get a aplayer without giving anything up. Stephen Jackson can be had without giving anyone up.
    Heywoode says... work hard man.

  5. #5
    Zesty
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Anyone else find it amusing that following a season in which he led the team in scoring with ~18 pts/game, Jalen Rose was given a max contract, but following the same circumstances with Stephen Jackson, it sounds like he could be had for the MLE?

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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Doug
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    I thought Bird was in charge?
    ed:

    Jackson and Blount would be nice pickups who wouldn't cost us the farm. I didn't know Jackson was only 26. I thought he was much older. And damn, how many top free agents do you hear saying that they want to come to Indiana?

    [edit=27=1089118841][/edit]
    [edit=27=1089118930][/edit]

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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    There was a Adonal Foyle in the article, but he has agreed to a 5 year deal to stay with the Warriors. They know they are losing Dampier.

    Dampier IMO is too expensive for the Pacers. I would rather have Blount.

    Seems most Pacers fans hate Fisher, not sure if that is just because he is a Laker, or if there is something about his game. I have always liked his game. He hits clutch shots, is a good defender, great teammate, great lockeroom guy, always plays hard, and brings a ton of intangibles.

    Jackson would be a nice pickup, he's played in this system before woth the Spurs. Not sure if he would start or what.

    Let me address this notion that free agents don't want to play for the Pacers. I don't buy that for a minute. Granted, Indy is a small market, the weather is not good, and it is a "boring city".

    But the Pacers are a great orgnanization. Any agent will tell their client that, the Pacers take care of their players financially, they are a winning organization, the media is easy, the cost of living is cheap.

    Taking everything into account the Indiana Pacers are one of the best franchises in the league, and that helps offset some of the other drawbacks I just mentioned
    [edit=24=1089119822][/edit]

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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Let me address this notion that free agents don't want to play for the Pacers. I don't buy that for a minute. Granted, Indy is a small market, the weather is not good, and it is a "boring city".

    But the Pacers are a great orgnanization. Any agent will tell their client that, the Pacers take care of their players financially, they are a winning organization, the media is easy, the cost of living is cheap.

    Taking everything into account the Indiana Pacers are one of the best franchises in the league, and that helps offset some of the other drawbacks I just mentioned
    Go back and reread what I wrote, UB. I said, how many top free agents do you hear saying they want to come to Indiana?

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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by bulletproof
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Let me address this notion that free agents don't want to play for the Pacers. I don't buy that for a minute. Granted, Indy is a small market, the weather is not good, and it is a "boring city".

    But the Pacers are a great orgnanization. Any agent will tell their client that, the Pacers take care of their players financially, they are a winning organization, the media is easy, the cost of living is cheap.

    Taking everything into account the Indiana Pacers are one of the best franchises in the league, and that helps offset some of the other drawbacks I just mentioned
    Go back and reread what I wrote, UB. I said, how many top free agents do you hear saying they want to come to Indiana?
    My bad........part of that is I don't think the Pacers have gone after too many. In fact have they ever gone after any big name free agents or even medium name free agents. Paces always have to either re-sign their own FA's or they don't have any money to attract any FA's





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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    My bad........part of that is I don't think the Pacers have gone after too many. In fact have they ever gone after any big name free agents or even medium name free agents. Pacers always have to either re-sign their own FA's or they don't have any money to attract any FA's.
    They went after McGrady.

    Who knows, perhaps Bird will be more aggressive than Donnie when it comes to FAs. Of course, Donnie holds all the purse strings, so we'll just have to see how it balances out if that's the case.
    [edit=27=1089121612][/edit]

  11. #11

    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    I don't like Fisher (playoff heroics notwithstanding).

    But if the net result of the offseason is getting Barry/Jackson and Dampier/Blount while losing Harrington then I think the Pacers will have succeeded in becoming a more balanced (and I think better) team.

    One of the problems with trading Harrington is that we lose a lot of PF minutes. O'Neal has been playing a lot at center and Al has been his backup. If Al is traded then O'Neal's backup is.....Croshere I guess. The other resolution is to get another center so that O'Neal can play the bulk of his minutes at PF.

    If the Pacer's signed Jackson as a free agent and traded Harrington and Pollard for Dampier they would look like this:

    Tinsley/AJ/Brewer
    Jackson/Jones/Miller
    Artest/Bender/Jones
    O'Neal/Croshere
    Dampier/Foster/Harrison
    [edit=92=1089122179][/edit]

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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Grant
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    I don't like Fisher (playoff heroics notwithstanding).

    But if the net result of the offseason is getting Barry/Jackson and Dampier/Blount while losing Harrington then I think the Pacers will have succeeded in becoming a more balanced (and I think better) team.

    One of the problems with trading Harrington is that we lose a lot of PF minutes. O'Neal has been playing a lot at center and Al has been his backup. If Al is traded then O'Neal's backup is.....Croshere I guess. The other resolution is to get another center so that O'Neal can play the bulk of his minutes at PF.

    If the Pacer's signed Jackson as a free agent and traded Harrington and Pollard for Dampier they would look like this:

    Tinsley/AJ/Brewer
    Jackson/Jones/Miller
    Artest/Bender/Jones
    O'Neal/Croshere
    Dampier/Foster/Harrison

    Foster can play power forward if Damp or Blount are playing center.

    The Sixers have offered Blount a full mid level exception contract.


    [edit=24=1089124797][/edit]

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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grant
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    I don't like Fisher (playoff heroics notwithstanding).

    But if the net result of the offseason is getting Barry/Jackson and Dampier/Blount while losing Harrington then I think the Pacers will have succeeded in becoming a more balanced (and I think better) team.

    One of the problems with trading Harrington is that we lose a lot of PF minutes. O'Neal has been playing a lot at center and Al has been his backup. If Al is traded then O'Neal's backup is.....Croshere I guess. The other resolution is to get another center so that O'Neal can play the bulk of his minutes at PF.

    If the Pacer's signed Jackson as a free agent and traded Harrington and Pollard for Dampier they would look like this:

    Tinsley/AJ/Brewer
    Jackson/Jones/Miller
    Artest/Bender/Jones
    O'Neal/Croshere
    Dampier/Foster/Harrison

    Foster can play power forward if Damp or Blount are playing center.

    The Sixers have offered Blount a contract

    Also, if Al is gone, that means we must have traded him for someone, right?
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    This article is just what I expected and just what I wanted. It's about time.

    The only name I'm not liking is Dampier. All I heard earlier was how bad his work ethic is, and that has really turned me off on him. If someone would like to convince me that he is worthy of becoming a Pacers (lol), then go ahead.

    Other than that, I'm saving this article for a long time & I'm hoping that at least one of those names in the article actually does end up on the Pacers. I am glad that we aren't "recruiting" players; that sounds like a good idea.

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    ENABEABLER MagicRat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    <<<<<<<<<<<<
    Mark Blount
    Age: 28
    Size: 7-foot, 230
    Previous team: Boston
    Stats: Averaged 10.3 points, 7.2 rebounds and 1.3 blocks last season, and 12 points and 9.3 rebounds in playoff series against Pacers.
    Note: Late-blooming player left University of Pittsburgh after two seasons, then knocked around minor leagues. Showed dramatic improvement last season with more playing time.
    Cost: Was paid $945,000 last season. It has been widely assumed he will sign with Miami because he makes his offseason home in that area, but other teams will offer more money. Philadelphia has made him its top priority and is said to have offered a midlevel exception. It also can reunite him with former coach in Boston, Jim O'Brien, who met with him five minutes after the negotiating period started at midnight July 1.
    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

    In the print edition of The Star this morning, the write-up of Mark Blount is accompanied by a photo of Corie Blount. Nice work ......
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRat
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    In the print edition of The Star this morning, the write-up of Mark Blount is accompanied by a photo of Corie Blount. Nice work ......



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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by MSA2CF
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    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRat
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    In the print edition of The Star this morning, the write-up of Mark Blount is accompanied by a photo of Corie Blount. Nice work ......

    Yeah, I did a double take on that. F-ing Star. ed:
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Also, I was a bit puzzled when they said that Jackson would give us perimeter shooting. Thinking I was in error, I looked him up.

    Career percentages:
    .426 .329 .761

    ed:
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    If we can bring in Blount and Jackson while only giving up Al and filler (Pollard), we have to do it.

    Then, if there's enough $ left, let AJ walk and sign Fisher.

    C - Blount/Foster/Harrison
    PF - O'Neal/Croshere
    SF - Artest/Bender/JJones
    SG - Miller/Jackson/FJones
    PG - Tinsley/Fisher/Brewer/Wright

    That's a championship team right there.

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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    I would love to get Jackson. Sounds like he and Mike are still really close, so maybe we'll have a good shot at him, and more importantly, maybe Mike can convince Donnie and Larry he's the guy to get.

    Blount would be perfect. Jackson and Blount, that's who I want.
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Snickers
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    I would love to get Jackson. Sounds like he and Mike are still really close, so maybe we'll have a good shot at him, and more importantly, maybe Mike can convince Donnie and Larry he's the guy to get.

    Blount would be perfect. Jackson and Blount, that's who I want.
    We should be able to sign Jackson straight-out. I think the P's will tell him that he'd back up Reg this year, then take over the starting spot next year. I'd offer a 3-4 year deal.

    Blount should be had for Al and Scot pretty easily. If he's out the door already, getting a player like Al and a servicable center in Polly is too good for even Ainge to screw up.

    If we made the above moves, and have enough $ left over, I'd still like to see us sign Fisher instead of AJ.

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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    I don't see Stephen Jackson starting over Reggie.

    I don't think Stephen Jackson would 'earn' it. I don't think he's that good although he's better as a role player in the Mike Brown/ Carlisle/ Popovich system. He's very streaky and I've never thought of him as a 'team-first' kinda guy.

    In the whole UB-scheme of how many games you win or lose because of him, I'm guessing Jackson is near zero or slightly negative.
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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy
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    Also, I was a bit puzzled when they said that Jackson would give us perimeter shooting. Thinking I was in error, I looked him up.

    Career percentages:
    .426 .329 .761

    ed:
    ---
    That's because your assuming perimeter shooting means 3 point shooting , Also I think Tinsley all showed us if you can Work with Chuck Person you can Improve your 3 point shooting very well

    Sorry it just really bugs me when I see people associating perimeter shooting with 3 point % and his .426 is right on track with most of the pacers roster


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    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheSauceMaster
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy
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    Also, I was a bit puzzled when they said that Jackson would give us perimeter shooting. Thinking I was in error, I looked him up.

    Career percentages:
    .426 .329 .761

    ed:
    ---
    That's because your assuming perimeter shooting means 3 point shooting , Also I think Tinsley all showed us if you can Work with Chuck Person you can Improve your 3 point shooting very well

    Sorry it just really bugs me when I see people associating perimeter shooting with 3 point % and his .426 is right on track with most of the pacers roster
    Sorry to offend you, but I've always seen Jackson more of a slasher, not taking the 20-footer, or at least making it.

    As I've said many times, all I want is a "shooter" who will be perfectly happy being the third option behind JO and Ron. A "shooter" (as opposed to "scorer") shoots better than 42% and 33%, IMO.

    You are dead on about Chuck, however. And I wouldn't be against getting Jackson, in fact he might be the best we can get while giving up the least in return. But I still feel his shot is suspect.
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  25. #25

    Default Re: Star Article, Pacers don't want to gut roster.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy
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    Also, I was a bit puzzled when they said that Jackson would give us perimeter shooting. Thinking I was in error, I looked him up.

    Career percentages:
    .426 .329 .761

    ed:
    ---
    I'm not really all that impressed with Jackson either, but those numbers are not that far off of other guys being trumpeted around here.

    R. Allen.............44.0 FG%; 39.1 3P%
    J. Crawford......38.6 FG%; 31.7 3P%
    M. Ginobili........41.8 FG%; 35.9 3P%
    L. Hughes........39.7 FG%; 34.0 3P%
    T. McGrady.......41.7 FG%; 33.9 3P%
    C. Mobley.........42.5 FG%; 39.0 3P%
    F. Murray.........42.5 FG%; 29.3 3P%
    P. Pierce...........40.2 FG%; 29.9 3P%
    M. Redd............44.0 FG%; 35.0 3P%
    Q. Richardson...39.8 FG%; 35.2 3P%
    J. Richardson....43.9 FG%; 28.2 3P%

    S. Jackson.......42.6 FG%; 32.9 3P%

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