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Thread: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat
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    You need offense from either the SG spot or center spot. I'll leave it at that.
    That, I'll disagree with.

    Whether or not we get any offensive from the center position, we absolutely MUST have consistent production and perimeter shooting from the SG position.

    I think that even you would admit that had the Pacers even had one player able to consistently hit perimeter shots, the Pistons series with the Pacers might have ended differently.

    I agree that we could use another big body on our interior, I just believe that a consistent perimeter shooter is a more important acquisition at this point in time.

  2. #27
    RA231
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Scot Pollard and Al Harrington for Dampier. That still leaves Jeff to guard Odom and Sheed. But we still needed more rebounding and that is what Dampier gives us, he can also block shots and score a lot better than Foster. I dont think we need to get rid of Foster. I just think that he would be better coming off the bench and in some cases come in and play more minutes to guard guys like Odom and Rasheed.

  3. #28
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    The fact that this question even needs to be asked makes me wanna

    Could we all get past the Brad Miller thing? If you guys don't want us to tell you about Brad would be better than this or that would you please drop the entire line of Jeff/Brad comparisons?

    You are kidding yourselves if you think anybody outside the fan base of the Indiana Pacers thinks that Jeff Foster is better than Brad Miller at anything.

    I am posting the following Uncle Buck Quote for a reason. "I realize Jeff will never be an allstar".

    My reason is simple, it is not my opinion that Brad Miller is an All-star it is a fact. In two differant Conferances no less.

    According to Uncle Buck, Jeff is much better than Brad at defense. I think that's a joke myself, but there is no way for me to prove this. However I will say this, also according to U.B. defense wins ball games. Yet, Foster, who is supposedly better at defense than Brad could not get off of the bench for more than 4 min. in the deciding game of the E.C. finals.

    Does anybody on here right now want to come forward & tell me that Brad Miller would not have started vs. the Pistons in every game assuming he was not injured? (there are you happy I put the injury thing in there for those who want to tell us how Brad was injured all of the time)

    I don't care if it was a special circumstance, it was a real circumstance & it will be one that will be repeated again next season (hopefully) & I want to know how Jeff will react then?

    Part of being good on defense is being good on offense. What the hell am I talking about, you ask. Simple, if your man has to spend zero energy guarding you on the offensive end then he can put all of his energy in to scoring. For the most part, you are not going to stop scorers every time from scoring in all games. At some point in time they are going to hit their shots. Ron Artest being one of the rare exceptions of people who can do this. But if you notice Ron also will wear his man down on the offensive end of the floor as well.

    Sorry everybody, I think some of you will have to give me some credit. I have kept out of the Miller thing since the end of the season & never even mentioned that I thought that Brad would have been a deciding factor vs. the Pistons because I thought we all had moved on.

    But I swear to God, to read how Foster is better at defense, rebounding, cat petting, chili eating, etc., etc. makes me wanna lose my mind.

    Brad Miller is an F'n all-star. You do not get to be an F'n all-star by just being an offensive player only, at least not when you are voted on by coach's. Fans are a differant story.

    If an offense was all it took then Jalen Rose would be at least a 2 time all-star & he has not even cracked the team.

    ::

    Here let's all just do this.

    Jeff Foster>>>>>>>>>>>>

    Ok, now that I have that off of my chest....

    I'm perfectly fine with Jeff Foster being the center. The price is right & so far there just aren't that many big men in the east yet that I fear Jeff being bolled over. I think he will eventually be overtaken by some of the younger stronger guys, but for now they won't hurt him.

    He does need to improve his offense. I would like to see him be able to hit a jumper, but if he can't then I would like to see him at least come up with some form or offense. Being able to hit a layup would be nice.

    Defensively, for now, he compliments O'Neal fairly well. However some day there may come a time when a team produces two big men & then I'm not sure what's going to happen.

    I'll tell you one thing though, without getting a scoring guard we will be in deep crap if Jeff can't come up with some form of offense.

    I would much rather see us get a shooting guard than worry about center.

    BTW, I'm interested to see how many people even aknowledge the fact that I am saying that I am fine with Jeff Foster as center & even now give a nod to Donnie for making probably a wise financial move, or how many people will just blow up on the Brad Miller comments?

    I'd rather have Brad, but I'd rather have Jeff than Scott Pollard.

    [edit=110=1088405167]looking[/edit]


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  4. #29
    Rebound King Kstat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Brad Miller? whats all this about Brad Miller? I was referring to Rik Smits:P

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  5. #30
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by beast23
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    Buck -

    I agree that Jeff is a very mobile center on both ends of the floor. But, mobility or not, we had problems covering both Ben and Rasheed, and keeping both off the boards.

    I think our interior defensive presence needs to be more physical. Perhaps in time Harrison can provide that. I do believe that either of Dampier or Foyle could provide that.

    Jeff plays about 23-25 minutes a game. That's half a game. Plenty of opportunity for another center, whether a starter or bench player, to make a major contribution. I just want that player to be a big physical defender who is capable of hitting a 10 foot shot if left open.

    As for Jeff, there is only one thing about Jeff that irks the hell out of me. He absolutely must improve to 70% from the line. Until he does, he has no business finishing games for us.

    first, then to step back and see what can be done to acquire the center.

    Agree with part and disagree with part.

    Jeff was very close to shooting 70% from the FT line. I'll check the stats, but I think he was over 65% for sure.

    I don't agree with you about any trouble keeping Ben and Sheed off the boards. Not when Jeff and a healthy J.O were in there, no problem at all.

    I do agree that I would have no problem with a better center than Pollard being brought in, but if AL is still around there aren't many minutes.

  6. #31
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Foster's free thorw shooting.

    2004 playoffs - 80% 8 of 10
    2004 regular season - 67%
    2003 regular season - 54%



    Peck, I almost missed your post. let me first say I read your whole post and enjoyed the last part of your post.

    But I have to blow up a little.

    Your comment about Jeff barely getting off the bench in games 4, 5, and 6 are ineresting. Because brad barely got off the bench in games 5 and 6 a year earlier against the Celts.

    We have discussed this so many times, but I can maybe count 2 or 3 guys in the whole league that brad defends better than Jeff does. In the game at Sacramento Brad tried to guard J.O. but was doing such a horrible job for the Kings had to play their joruneymen backup center whose name I am drawing a blank on.

    Ask the King fans if they need a little athleticism in their front court
    [edit=24=1088432122][/edit]

  7. #32
    diego
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    personally i think we need a bigger body at least play alongside Jeff. I would like to get Damp or Blount, both would serve major needs.

    UB, dont forget, unless we give Jeff up intrade we will still have him on team to play in situations where he benefits the team. IE...Miami.

    We need more size down low, period. We would not have played LA the way Detroit did, because we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit was. I really like Jeff, and think is very quality back up.

    Lets be honest here we are talking about a guy who will never be an all star center IN THE EAST.

  8. #33
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    We need more size down low, period. We would not have played LA the way Detroit did, because we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit was. I really like Jeff, and think is very quality back up.


    "we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit" ?

    Not starting unit vs starting unit. Jeff is as big as Ben and J.O is as big as Sheed. granted we don't have Okur or Campbell coming off the bench and Campbell played Shaq a lot and veyr well.

  9. #34

    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    The NBA has changed. Big big guys aren't always needed. Jeff does quality work and he gets the job done. He does what he does very well. As long as he's on the team, he will be one of my very favorite Pacers.

  10. #35
    diego
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    We need more size down low, period. We would not have played LA the way Detroit did, because we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit was. I really like Jeff, and think is very quality back up.
    "we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit" ?

    Not starting unit vs starting unit. Jeff is as big as Ben and J.O is as big as Sheed. granted we don't have Okur or Campbell coming off the bench and Campbell played Shaq a lot and veyr well.


    Yes height wise but not strength wise. Big difference. Foster is nowhere near as strong as Ben and does not have th ejumping ability either. Come on UB, you know what i meant. Not to mention your points about Cambell and Okur.



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  11. #36
    ENABEABLER MagicRat's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck
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    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    We need more size down low, period. We would not have played LA the way Detroit did, because we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit was. I really like Jeff, and think is very quality back up.
    "we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit" ?

    Not starting unit vs starting unit. Jeff is as big as Ben and J.O is as big as Sheed. granted we don't have Okur or Campbell coming off the bench and Campbell played Shaq a lot and veyr well.


    Yes height wise but not strength wise. Big difference. Foster is nowhere near as strong as Ben and does not have th ejumping ability either. Come on UB, you know what i meant. Not to mention your points about Cambell and Okur.
    Well, Foster is listed at 242 lbs. and Ben is listed at 240, so Jeff must be stronger.....:P

    And Jeff jumps as well or better than most guys his size...see Hoop's avatar.....

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  12. #37
    diego
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by MagicRat
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    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    We need more size down low, period. We would not have played LA the way Detroit did, because we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit was. I really like Jeff, and think is very quality back up.
    "we are much smaller on the blocks than Detroit" ?

    Not starting unit vs starting unit. Jeff is as big as Ben and J.O is as big as Sheed. granted we don't have Okur or Campbell coming off the bench and Campbell played Shaq a lot and veyr well.


    Yes height wise but not strength wise. Big difference. Foster is nowhere near as strong as Ben and does not have th ejumping ability either. Come on UB, you know what i meant. Not to mention your points about Cambell and Okur.
    Well, Foster is listed at 242 lbs. and Ben is listed at 240, so Jeff must be stronger.....:P

    And Jeff jumps as well or better than most guys his size...see Hoop's avatar.....

    Please tell me your joking. Foster looked like a rag doll against Ben.


  13. #38
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Pacers lost to the Pistons for several reasons, but Jeff Foster was not one of those reasons. he was not taken out of the lineup because he did not play well. if Reggie and Ron would have been able to score Cro would not have been needed. Also if Tinsley would have been healthy he could have created enough offense to keep Jeff on the floor

    EditL Wow I need a 4th grade writing class. A double negative in one sentence. :P
    [edit=24=1088434965][/edit]

  14. #39

    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    The only reason Jeff was taken out was not because of his playing ability or lack of it, but because we needed offense. Jeff held his own against Ben pretty well.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    Please tell me your joking. Foster looked like a rag doll against Ben.
    I'm joking. You must not've ventured into the Billups-Wagner strongman thread.....

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  16. #41
    diego
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by Suaveness
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    The only reason Jeff was taken out was not because of his playing ability or lack of it, but because we needed offense. Jeff held his own against Ben pretty well.

    OMG are you kidding me. Lets look at some numbers shall we:

    Lets just look at games 1-3 since Jeff didnt get off the bench in the last 3 games.

    Ben Wallace - 46 rebounds, 33 points, 12 blocks
    averages - 15.3rpg/11ppg/4bpg

    Foster - 22 rebounds, 4 points, 3 blocks
    averages - 7.33 rpg, 1.33ppg, 1bpg

    To me that looks like domination. Buts lets not let facts get in the way of our warm and fuzzy 61 win season. Gimme a break. Ben destroyed Foster, plain ans siimple. You cannot say the only reason he was pulled was for more offense. If Jeff was controlling Ben they would have kept him in there, PERIOD. But Ben was destroying us. Come on guys take off the pacer colored glasses. i love Foster and his hustle, but it was obvious he is no match for Ben.


  17. #42

    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Numbers mean nothing, unless they pertain to wins/losses.

  18. #43

    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by diego
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    Quote Originally Posted by Suaveness
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    The only reason Jeff was taken out was not because of his playing ability or lack of it, but because we needed offense. Jeff held his own against Ben pretty well.

    OMG are you kidding me. Lets look at some numbers shall we:

    Lets just look at games 1-3 since Jeff didnt get off the bench in the last 3 games.

    Ben Wallace - 46 rebounds, 33 points, 12 blocks
    averages - 15.3rpg/11ppg/4bpg

    Foster - 22 rebounds, 4 points, 3 blocks
    averages - 7.33 rpg, 1.33ppg, 1bpg

    To me that looks like domination. Buts lets not let facts get in the way of our warm and fuzzy 61 win season. Gimme a break. Ben destroyed Foster, plain ans siimple. You cannot say the only reason he was pulled was for more offense. If Jeff was controlling Ben they would have kept him in there, PERIOD. But Ben was destroying us. Come on guys take off the pacer colored glasses. i love Foster and his hustle, but it was obvious he is no match for Ben.
    One on one matchups meant nothing in that. And numbers don't tell the entire story. Yes, Ben had more rebounds. But Foster's hustle plays accounted for a lot. I don't seem to remember Ben beating us offensively. And defensively he got a lot of rebounds because we missed a lot of shots. A lot.

    Foster definitely had a presence in there. Do you think we would have won game 1 without him? I don't. Think about if someone else had guarded Ben. Pollard maybe? Ben would have blown by him every time. Because of Foster's quickness, he was able to stay with him.

    Ben is definitely a polished defensive player and has a good nose for the ball. But Foster played him better than anyone else Detroit faced.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  19. #44
    debohstheman
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    OMG are you kidding me. Lets look at some numbers shall we:

    Lets just look at games 1-3 since Jeff didnt get off the bench in the last 3 games.

    Ben Wallace - 46 rebounds, 33 points, 12 blocks
    averages - 15.3rpg/11ppg/4bpg

    Foster - 22 rebounds, 4 points, 3 blocks
    averages - 7.33 rpg, 1.33ppg, 1bpg

    To me that looks like domination. Buts lets not let facts get in the way of our warm and fuzzy 61 win season. Gimme a break. Ben destroyed Foster, plain ans siimple. You cannot say the only reason he was pulled was for more offense. If Jeff was controlling Ben they would have kept him in there, PERIOD. But Ben was destroying us. Come on guys take off the pacer colored glasses. i love Foster and his hustle, but it was obvious he is no match for Ben.


    nobody is saying foster is ben wallace. He doesnt put up the same kind of numbers. hell, he isnt as good. but ben played a hell of a lot more minutes than jeff...and had guards that were able to penetrate and/or stretch the defense...giving ben TONS of wideopen dunks and layups....

    if and when tinsley is playing healthy..he does the same thing for jeff....jeff is exactly what we need offensively when tinsley is in the game......
    when AJ comes in...i think Jeff does not do as much on the offensive end (well, nobody does)...which is why i think jeff is more effective as a starter than as a backup.

    anyways..im straying all over the place here..
    but my points are:

    1. foster can jump..jesus you guys havent seen him sky over anyone for a dunk?
    2. foster is a good defender and excellent rebounder.
    3. foster is not ben wallace
    4. foster doesnt need to be ben wallace
    5. if foster was ben wallace's long lost brother id be okay with it
    6. both foster and ben wallace depend on their guards for their offensive game....and in the ECF...with tins hurt and reggie being old....BEN's guards had the advantage.....and that explains why his numbers are much better than jeff's.

  20. #45
    debohstheman
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    hey
    how do i highlight the part im replying to ...so i can differentiate it from my post?

  21. #46

    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by debohs
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    hey
    how do i highlight the part im replying to ...so i can differentiate it from my post?
    Just click the "quote" part under their name.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  22. #47
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    What's satisfied? He's better than about half of the EC centers.

    The problem isn't really having Jeff, or even if he starts or not. The problem is you don't have someone who can really muscle people in the post - particularly on defense.

    Jeff's one of the best defenders against interior athletic players but he can't stand up to the physical guys. I know the thought was that Pollard was going to be that guy but he wasn't.

    It's less a Jeff problem than having to always match JO up with someone better suited to guarding athletes than bangers. That's why Blount would be such a good pickup. Who starts would be kind of irrelevant but it would help your matchups a lot.

    And I still can't figure out why he can't hit a 15-foot jump shot. His form's good, his footwork's good - but the ball doesn't go in.
    The poster formerly known as Rimfire

  23. #48

    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by DisplacedKnick
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    And I still can't figure out why he can't hit a 15-foot jump shot. His form's good, his footwork's good - but the ball doesn't go in.
    That is what I wonder about too. He has excellent form on his outside shots and FTs. I just think if he practices a little more, they will start going in.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  24. #49
    Administrator/ The Real Jay ChicagoJ's Avatar
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    Quote Originally Posted by DisplacedKnick
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    It's less a Jeff problem than having to always match JO up with someone better suited to guarding athletes than bangers. That's why Blount would be such a good pickup. Who starts would be kind of irrelevant but it would help your matchups a lot.
    That's basically my point as well. As a combo, JO and either Jeff or Al is just too light.

    Now that I've said that... after being offline all weekend... we didn't trade Al yet, did we?
    Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
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  25. #50
    debohstheman
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    Default Re: Are you satisfied with Jeff Foster starting and finishing

    i think that for Jeff to be effective offensively he needs to be matched with a point guard (or guards) that can penetrate and/or stretch the D with a good 3pt shot. He has that in tinsley (although not for the entire ECF). He does NOT have that in AJ.

    Ben W. needs the same thing. He had that the entire ECF..Jeff did not.

    i do agree, blount would be a great pickup. Who would people here rather see? id much rather see blount.

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