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Thread: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

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  1. #1
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Pacers at Magic Postgame thread



    Pacers open with a small ball lineup.

    Pacers continue with their stunning "leave the 3 point line uncovered" defense even against a team known for 3 point shooting.

    Pacers' D gives up 135 points.

    OBrien is an awful coach... I don't care how hard the team plays, if he can't address the defense, he sucks. That's not basketball.

    Granger's argument for making the AS team took a hit.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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    Denim Chicken duke dynamite's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    We played the Magic. I expected an outcome like this. We can't beat every good team in the league. If we can't win most of the next games, especially at home, then everyone throw the franchise under the bus. But please, don't start it now.

  3. #3
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by duke dynamite View Post
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    We played the Magic. I expected an outcome like this. We can't beat every good team in the league. If we can't win most of the next games, especially at home, then everyone throw the franchise under the bus. But please, don't start it now.

    I'm just throwing OBrien and his defense under the bus. I don't think it's coincidence that there's an "O" in O'Brien and no "D". I like the players. Under the right coach this team would be growing and we'd all be thinking about next season in a positive way... not as we are now... Which is that next season just means THIS season is over and we get a clean slate.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  4. #4
    You are my Lucifer D-BONE's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    I didn't expect to win, but that first quarter was just unexcusable.

    It's conceiveable we could squeak into the playoffs but our rebounding/toughness/defensive personnel is not anywhere near actually challenging for anything this year or beyond.

    And I say this recognizing our better play, relatively speaking, of late.
    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

    -Emiliano Zapata

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    Member MiaDragon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by duke dynamite View Post
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    We played the Magic. I expected an outcome like this. We can't beat every good team in the league. If we can't win most of the next games, especially at home, then everyone throw the franchise under the bus. But please, don't start it now.
    OMG are you full of sunshine or just oblivious.

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    Denim Chicken duke dynamite's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by MiaDragon View Post
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    OMG are you full of sunshine or just oblivious.
    I'm just awkwardly optimistic. Always!

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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by MiaDragon View Post
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    OMG are you full of sunshine or just oblivious.
    Nothing against him, but he is not the only one.

  8. #8
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Jim O "The O stands for Offense" Brien reminds me of a perfect candidate for an assistant coaching position. He's too caught up in stats and gimmicks for his own good as the head coach but could be useful to a real head coach who can filter thru the information and actually translate the good parts (or workable parts) to the team at hand.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Granger's been shooting like Stephen Jackson here of late.

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    Member Kuq_e_Zi91's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Was that an actual NBA game or was that just shootaround for the Magic?

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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by tbabyy924 View Post
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    Was that an actual NBA game or was that just shootaround for the Magic?
    I think it was the Magic's with the practice squad............

  12. #12

    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    this guy is terrible w/ a capital T...I dont know when he will be held accountable, that was just embarrassing!!!

  13. #13
    Yeah, I'm a Pacers fan. MyFavMartin's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Sometimes you're the windshield, sometimes you're the fly.

    Dwight Howard was the windshield...

  14. #14
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Has anyone got anything positive to say about the game? I find it hard to take much away from a game where the team gives up 135 points.

    I do like the players and I think the coaching staff is selling them short.

    Defense Defense Defense. Nothing frustrates me like bad basketball and 'no defense' is bad basketball. The coaching staff is putting these players in a position to fail by not addressing this. ....'No defense' and 'small ball' equally frustrate me (but then the two also go hand in hand usually).
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

  15. #15

    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Has anyone got anything positive to say about the game?
    No, not really. I mean, the game was lost before getting midway in the 2Q. All my boyz could do from that point on is pray and hope they could keep the deficit near 20 points.
    Defense Defense Defense. Nothing frustrates me like bad basketball and 'no defense' is bad basketball. The coaching staff is putting these players in a position to fail by not addressing this. ....'No defense' and 'small ball' equally frustrate me (but then the two also go hand in hand usually).
    I didn't mind the small ball tactic because it made sense. You want to pull The Beast (Dwight Howard) out from the paint and force him to work at both ends of the court. Problem is when Murphy wasn't making his shots or driving inside and forcing Howard to adjust it negated that game plan. And we all know Foster's not an offensive threat and poor Hibbert just wasn't skilled enough to know how to handle him for what little time he did play against Howard. And frankly, I doubt Rasho would have faired better.

    Still, I share you frustrations in this one area: defending the Wings! (SCREAMING!!!! ) I could NOT believe the number of times Murphy, Quis, Graham and even Granger at times left Pietrus and Lewis open on the Wings!! There's just no way they should be cheating that much towards the paint knowing how good Orlando's shooters are. They were just asking to get burned last night. Frankly, there's just no excuse for that - NONE!!!!

    Dwight's going to get his; let him even if it means you defending him as solid as you could but he still beat you down. Dwight's like a slimmer version of Shaq in his youth. You're just NOT going to stop him. He's too strong! But the Pacers COULD have limited the Magic's perimeter shooting if they had just found the open man (which even my wife, who has just started to under the game of basketball at the NBA level, was able to spot long before the Magic's offense had fully developed on some plays. Heck, she even rewound a few plays and pointed some things out I missed!!!! She's becoming quite good at that. )

    Pacers' perimeter defense was absolutely terrible last night, and there's really no excuse for it whatsoever.

  16. #16
    '12 PD Sunshiner awardee Kemo's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NuffSaid View Post
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    poor Hibbert just wasn't skilled enough to know how to handle him for what little time he did play against Howard. And frankly, I doubt Rasho would have faired better.

    I'm sorry bro, but I just don't see your reasoning on Hibbert...

    For 1 , he only played , what? like 5 or 6 minutes in the first half AT MOST..

    He picked up the rest of his minutes after we were done down 18+ points in garbage minutes as I recall ...

    YET

    He played a total of 14.58 minutes .. (mostly garbage minutes, especially after there was no way we could come back) shot 6-10 FGM/A
    2 offensive and 2 defensive Rebounds
    1 Assist
    3 Personal Fouls
    2 Blocked Shots (1 I saw against Howard)
    and
    12 Points


    I think he would have faired better than Murphy at Center against Howard..

    Granted he may have drawn his fouls, but heck let him use em all up..

    It wouldn't have hurt .. lol
    Quote Originally Posted by naptownmenace View Post
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    Plumlee reminds me of a young Dale Davis. Good rebounding and he contests shots well on defense and his offensive game is very raw just like DD's was coming out of college.
    "If my answers frighten you, then you should cease asking scary questions."

  17. #17

    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Kemo,

    Well, since you put it that way...

  18. #18
    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Our defensive scheme cheats more than most because many of our players are not good individual defenders. This cheating is easily exposed by 1) teams that pass the ball well (e.g. Utah and San Antonio, 2) teams with a strong inside-out game. (e.g. Orlando)...hence the big losses.

    Really, in both cases the silver bullet is ball movement. Now, ball movement is always a good tool, but against the Pacers it is more lethal and more easily accomplished. That is the difference.

    Edit: Oh, and the reason this is so is a combination of our personnel and the players JOb puts on the floor. Yes, it is a shared problem.

  19. #19
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Our defensive scheme cheats more than most because many of our players are not good individual defenders. This cheating is easily exposed by 1) teams that pass the ball well (e.g. Utah and San Antonio, 2) teams with a strong inside-out game. (e.g. Orlando)...hence the big losses.

    Really, in both cases the silver bullet is ball movement. Now, ball movement is always a good tool, but against the Pacers it is more lethal and more easily accomplished. That is the difference.
    Then switch it up... play more zone sometimes and play more straight up and take our lumps that way for others. The way it is, it's a shootaround for the other team.

    Even go ahead and let a player like Howard have his way as part of the plan and focus our defense on taking his help away.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

    ------

    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Then switch it up... play more zone sometimes and play more straight up and take our lumps that way for others. The way it is, it's a shootaround for the other team.

    Even go ahead and let a player like Howard have his way as part of the plan and focus our defense on taking his help away.
    I agree. There's lots of ideas that are probably better than the current plan or lack thereof.

    Considering Orlando scored the second most points of the year, there are probably lots of ideas that work better....like giving better defenders like Foster, Rush and Baston more time...or McRoberts any time at all. Foster, Rush and Baston had the best +/- figures BTW...although it's hard to tell if they could help considering they were planted on the bench most of the game watching Orlando keep scoring, and scoring, and scoring, and scoring.

    Why is defense such a low priority?

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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    I am an O'Brien apologist and didn't see the game thus I'm not putting blame on anyone but...135 points?! It's unacceptable for a professional basketball team to give up that many points.

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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by dcpacersfan View Post
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    I am an O'Brien apologist and didn't see the game thus I'm not putting blame on anyone but...135 points?! It's unacceptable for a professional basketball team to give up that many points.
    you are lucky you did not see the 1st quarter.

  23. #23

    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Our defensive scheme cheats more than most because many of our players are not good individual defenders. This cheating is easily exposed by 1) teams that pass the ball well (e.g. Utah and San Antonio, 2) teams with a strong inside-out game. (e.g. Orlando)...hence the big losses.

    Really, in both cases the silver bullet is ball movement. Now, ball movement is always a good tool, but against the Pacers it is more lethal and more easily accomplished. That is the difference.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Then switch it up... play more zone sometimes and play more straight up and take our lumps that way for others. The way it is, it's a shootaround for the other team.

    Even go ahead and let a player like Howard have his way as part of the plan and focus our defense on taking his help away.
    Edit: Oh, and the reason this is so is a combination of our personnel and the players JOb puts on the floor. Yes, it is a shared problem.
    Sounds reasonable enough to me.

    Sometimes, you're going to come up against a team that's really strong within the interior (Magic, Lakers, Jazz) or has a very good perimeter game (Magic, Raptors) or has very good slashers (Hornets, Jazz). Rarely will you find a team that has all three (Lakers, Nuggets). At some point you'll have to conceed that you don't have to the tools to negate all three or even two. So, you focus on the opponent's one true strength, e.g., the Magic's perimeter shooting, and stop the rest as best you can.

    The Pacers did a lousy job of defending the Magic's shooters. Honestly, there's no reason for giving up so many uncontested 3pt shots! At some point, coach Obrien has to realize that his cheating scheme exposes our defensive weakness too much. Maybe one solution is not to cheat so much or so close-in to the paint to where you can't recover quickly enough!!

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    Member naptownmenace's Avatar
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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Quote Originally Posted by NuffSaid View Post
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    The Pacers did a lousy job of defending the Magic's shooters. Honestly, there's no reason for giving up so many uncontested 3pt shots! At some point, coach Obrien has to realize that his cheating scheme exposes our defensive weakness too much. Maybe one solution is not to cheat so much or so close-in to the paint to where you can't recover quickly enough!!
    This has been a big change from last season. Last season we were one of the best opponent 3pt % teams in the league, IIRC. This scheme has everyone cheating to the paint and I could live with that if they were shutting down the opponents points scored in the paint but they're not. The other team scores at a high percentage against us in the paint. When they don't score we foul them at a very high rate ususally leading to free throws.

    Why not just go to a straight up man-to-man defensive scheme? No doubles, no cheating from the weakside, or up top. Just try and stay in front of your man. Just staying with your man will make it difficult for them to rotate the ball and the number of wide open 3s and 3pt percentage will go down. Giving up 10 more points in the paint would be better than giving the other team 10 plus made 3 pointers.

    But what do I know?
    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
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    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    GOOD GOD THAT'S LARRY BIRD'S MUSIC!

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    Default Re: Pacers at Magic Postgame thread

    Did we really give up 135 points on 55% shooting tonight? Really? Honestly the only saving grace I can imagine is I didn't have to watch this. How pitiful.

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