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Thread: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

  1. #1
    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    I'll consider this summer a failure. I don't care if we make cool draft picks or what-have-you. Reggie was exposed as a weakness THIS ENTIRE YEAR. He's the weakest link of the starting five, and if we don't improve at SG we won't match the success we had this year.

    Moving Ronnie for a SG is a lateral move at best, unless you're convinced that Bender is ready to become the second coming.

    Trading Harrintgon for picks & projects is a cool thought, but how does it help us win in the short term?

    We were THIS CLOSE this year. I don't want to start more projects.
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  2. #2
    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    That's a very good assesment.

    Unfortunately it's also a look at the future. Reggie will be here & he will start. The only way I see Reggie moving to the backup spot is if we can bring in a pure two guard who can't swing to the three that is currently an all-star caliber player. Think Ray Allen or the like there.

    I was afraid even if we got T-Mac he would be moved to the S.F. spot so Reggie could keep the two spot.


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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    I'll consider this summer a failure. I don't care if we make cool draft picks or what-have-you. Reggie was exposed as a weakness THIS ENTIRE YEAR. He's the weakest link of the starting five, and if we don't improve at SG we won't match the success we had this year.

    Moving Ronnie for a SG is a lateral move at best, unless you're convinced that Bender is ready to become the second coming.

    Trading Harrintgon for picks & projects is a cool thought, but how does it help us win in the short term?

    We were THIS CLOSE this year. I don't want to start more projects.
    I was going to start a thread saying the same thing. But you said it in three sentences and my draft was about 209,490 paragraphs long.

    Chandler is still a project and many still up here still believe - because of how soft he is - that his best position is SF.

    Does anybody really think Carlisle would start a rookie at SG (or even let him play significant minutes)?
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  4. #4
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Well, I've made the comment before wondering if the Pacers have avoided certain moves in the past looking to avoid a 'quarterback controversy' with Reggie's spot on the team.

    Hopefully that is not a factor this summer (if it ever was).

    Althought at this point I think they already have one because I would pencil Freddie Jones ahead of Reggie.... which is not to say I have a world of confidence in Freddie as a starter (yet).

    ...Of course if Freddie would end up part of a trade..... That would end that issue wouldn't it?

    -----

    Let me put this another way... Maybe the reason Reggie's heir apparent isn't on the team is because of loyalty to Reggie to help maintain his starting spot?

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    Member Harddrive7's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    -----

    Let me put this another way... Maybe the reason Reggie's heir apparent isn't on the team is because of loyalty to Reggie to help maintain his starting spot?

    -Bball

    Well IMO, you show loyalty by still paying him decent money and not trading him. Keeping him in a position that could be vital to our success isn't helping him or our team.

    For Reggie not to realize that he's not helping by starting, makes things even harder.

  6. #6

    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    All I have to say here is be careful what you wish for. Reggie is not the player he was even a few years ago, but we could be much worse off. The key thing here is that Reggie knows and accepts his reduced role. I would rather start Reggie than someone like Jamal Crawford because with the lineup as it is, our offense starts with JO. The worst thing I think could happen is to replace Reggie with someone who is most concerned with getting 20-plus a night.
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  7. #7

    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    I want Freddy to start.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

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    Member Doug in CO's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Fred is not a good enough shooter... yet
    Heywoode says... work hard man.

  9. #9

    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Fred is not a good enough shooter... yet

    Oh, but he will be. He is going to improve this offseason, and he is going to be amazing next year.

    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Fred is not a good enough shooter... yet
    Wrong.

    What do you base that on? His 40+ % 3-point shooting the second half of the year?

    He shot bad in October and November of 2003. He shot well after that. He shot as well or better than anyone else on the team the second half of the season.

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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Artest to #2 would be a lateral move at WORST.
    He instantly upgrades the position AND lets us start Al, thus preserving our 3 best scorer and emotional leader.
    That instantly strengthens this team.
    I hope it happens.
    I expect Artest to be traded. Ron's poor decisions, selfish play and instability are exactly the opposite of what LB wants in his players. I think they'll unload him this summer while his value is high.

    Moving him to the 2 is NOT an upgrade. Ball movement stops. Passing is horrible or non-existant. Shot selection is much worse.

  12. #12
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Fred is not a good enough shooter... yet

    Oh, but he will be. He is going to improve this offseason, and he is going to be amazing next year.


    Yep, he is actually. he'll be able to knock down 15's and 18' with great ease as well driving the lane keeping the defense honest with his ability to create his own shots.

    Oh yes, he will come Ray, he will come...

  13. #13

    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Fred is not a good enough shooter... yet
    Wrong.

    What do you base that on? His 40+ % 3-point shooting the second half of the year?

    He shot bad in October and November of 2003. He shot well after that. He shot as well or better than anyone else on the team the second half of the season.
    Not to mention he was one of the FEW guys who actually showed up in the Detroit series. He played with FIRE, and not many had that. When he had that dunk against Detroit, man oh man was he adrenaline filled.
    Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

  14. #14
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    If Fred continues to work with Chuck Person, his shot will improve. I've seen too many Pacers and Fever players who've greatly improved in their shooting over the last year+ to think otherwise.

    Fred's shot isn't what will keep him from starting. His size will.

    As for the whole "summer will be a failure", I don't agree at all. As Peck said, the only way Reggie isn't starting is if we get a real top-flight two-guard to replace him.

    What people need to get through their heads is, we don't need a "star" to replace Reggie. JO's the franchise. Our success doesn't depend on running double and triple screens trying to get shooters open anymore. What we need is a shooter, not a scorer. Someone who will stretch the floor. If he can penetrate and create his own shot, so much the better.

    Would it be nice to have a Ray Allen or Paul Pierce or He-Who-Shall-Not-Be-Named? Sure. But the price is gonna be too damn high. I'd rather get someone who can grow into replacing Reggie as opposed to gutting our team for a quick fix.

    Two more quick things. One, for those who think Luke Jackson would be a long term project, he's the same age Ron was when he came over from Chicago.

    And two, we didn't lose to Detroit because of our inability to matchup with Rip Hamilton. We lost because Jamaal and JO were hurt. We're not that far away.
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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Not to mention he was one of the FEW guys who actually showed up in the Detroit series. He played with FIRE, and not many had that. When he had that dunk against Detroit, man oh man was he adrenaline filled.

    Freddie played well towards the end of the Pistons series, no doubt, and the only reason he did not lay well early in the season is because of his shoulder......


    However, Suaveness, I hardly ever disagree with you and when I do it is just a little bit, but I vehemently disagree with your statement that I highlighted above. The Pacers played with fire, they played hard, they showed up, they showed heart and desire, they never gave up. If you really believe that they didn't , you are dead wrong. Now if you are just trying to pump up your man Fred, and you are using a little hyperbole, well I still strongly disagree

  16. #16

    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    And two, we didn't lose to Detroit because of our inability to matchup with Rip Hamilton. We lost because Jamaal and JO were hurt. We're not that far away.
    Great post, Keg, but Jamaal and JO being hurt doesn't obscure another glaring reason we lost to Detroit, and that's our lack of a consistent outside scoring threat, as evidenced by what Croshere's performance did to the Pistons defense in game 4.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    And two, we didn't lose to Detroit because of our inability to matchup with Rip Hamilton. We lost because Jamaal and JO were hurt. We're not that far away.
    Great post, Keg, but Jamaal and JO being hurt doesn't obscure another glaring reason we lost to Detroit, and that's our lack of a consistent outside scoring threat, as evidenced by what Croshere's performance did to the Pistons defense in game 4.
    Yep, but that doesn't mean we need Tm...err, you know, to get over the top.
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    If we don't get a trade completed to move up in the draft, theres still hope that we trade for TMac or Ray Allen. Weisbrod said that a deal for TMac is far from finished, so who knows.

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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    If we don't get a trade completed to move up in the draft, theres still hope that we trade for TMac or Ray Allen. Weisbrod said that a deal for TMac is far from finished, so who knows.

    It's funny, I taught my 2 year old to say "No Tmac, no Tmac" So when we go to anyones house and they ask about the draft or who I want to see playing here I just look at my son and say, "Tmac" and he says it clear as day, "No Tmac, No Tmac".

  20. #20

    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    Not to mention he was one of the FEW guys who actually showed up in the Detroit series. He played with FIRE, and not many had that. When he had that dunk against Detroit, man oh man was he adrenaline filled.

    Freddie played well towards the end of the Pistons series, no doubt, and the only reason he did not lay well early in the season is because of his shoulder......


    However, Suaveness, I hardly ever disagree with you and when I do it is just a little bit, but I vehemently disagree with your statement that I highlighted above. The Pacers played with fire, they played hard, they showed up, they showed heart and desire, they never gave up. If you really believe that they didn't , you are dead wrong. Now if you are just trying to pump up your man Fred, and you are using a little hyperbole, well I still strongly disagree
    Sorry I didn't put that the way I wanted to. Let me rephrase. Maybe something of the sort that he visible showed emotion. I do believe they played hard, and showed amazing toughness. But I don't recall them ever yelling on the court, like saying "YA!!". Pumping the fist, showing that look on their face. I do no doubt they played hard and showed up. I don't think they showed it visibly enough. I wish they did that more. I know Fred did it a few times, especially after that big big dunk. That is something I loved seeing.

    I don't know if that is different from what I said before, I think it is. Of course, it is entirely possible that I totally missed all this.
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    Default Re: If Reggie is still starting this fall...

    And two, we didn't lose to Detroit because of our inability to matchup with Rip Hamilton. We lost because Jamaal and JO were hurt. We're not that far away.
    Great post, Keg, but Jamaal and JO being hurt doesn't obscure another glaring reason we lost to Detroit, and that's our lack of a consistent outside scoring threat, as evidenced by what Croshere's performance did to the Pistons defense in game 4.
    It's simpler than that. The Pacers lost to Detroit because Reggie played like a 50 year old man. He couldn't make a breakaway lay-in, and his defense on Rip was worse than horrible.

    The other significant factor was that Artest played like an idiot, hogged the ball and threw up bad shot after bad shot.

    Correct those two things and the Pacers are NBA champs, injuries or no-injuries.

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