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Thread: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

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    Administrator Roaming Gnome's Avatar
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    Default Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Look, here's the deal... Every bit of off site content you post onto Pacers Digest needs:

    1. An author's "by line" (our site host says this is most important)
    2. A link to the off-site content (the site founder prefers this at the top of the post)
    3. Name of the website that you are taking content from.


    Example:

    http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dl.../1088/SPORTS04
    Mike Wells
    Indystar.com

    Anything less is going to be deleted! We're done fixing post to bring them into compliance. Even "snip-its" of articles need the requirement listed above to remain on the site.
    Last edited by Roaming Gnome; 12-28-2008 at 12:35 PM.
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    Member MiaDragon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    how about making this a sticky?

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    That would probably be a good idea and if this is not instituted into the Rules of Pacers Digest (it might be I don't know) then no one is going to pay attention to this and every other thread will be deleted.

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Oh, it's been in the Rules for a long time.

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    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    This has been in the official rules almost from day one, I insist upon it and if you don't like it then frankly I don't give a "toss" as they say around here.

    If everyone just read the rules they agreed to abide by, then it would not be needed to put sticky posts up about simply matters.

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    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Unless PD locks the doors and accepts no new members, this is going to continue to raise its head every so often. You just can't reasonably expect new or infrequent posters to remember, let alone understand, the importance of the rule.

    I don't think anyone is violating this rule to be difficult or to be a thorn in the side of the admins. It's simply an omission of ignorance or memory.

    Threads like these serve as reminders to everyone about the rule's existence. Anything that can be done to increase that awareness for newer members is going to be a plus. Since this seems like one of the more important rules of PD I vote for a dedicated sticky (tho I suppose it could be in the New members forum).

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    So it's well known: New members are PMed the Rules when they first log in.

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    PROUD 2 B A PACERS FAN! xtacy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    don't get me wrong guys but you are taking it a little too serious. i started a thread earlier. i quoted from hoopsworld.com. i wrote the name of the site in my post. i didn't want to give a link because there were other articles on the page not about pacers thinking they wouldn't interest you guys. and my thread gets deleted. what happens when i don't write the name of author or give a link to the article?

    you can call me all you want but i don't understand it.

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by xtacy View Post
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    don't get me wrong guys but you are taking it a little too serious. i started a thread earlier. i quoted from hoopsworld.com. i wrote the name of the site in my post. i didn't want to give a link because there were other articles on the page not about pacers thinking they wouldn't interest you guys. and my thread gets deleted. what happens when i don't write the name of author or give a link to the article?

    you can call me all you want but i don't understand it.
    hell I posted two articles earlier and had Link,name and I also added where was coming from and they deleted my post. I don't understand.I think the only reason was that I added the link at the end of the post not in the top.

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    Administrator Roaming Gnome's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by xtacy View Post
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    don't get me wrong guys but you are taking it a little too serious. i started a thread earlier. i quoted from hoopsworld.com. i wrote the name of the site in my post. i didn't want to give a link because there were other articles on the page not about pacers thinking they wouldn't interest you guys. and my thread gets deleted. what happens when i don't write the name of author or give a link to the article?

    you can call me all you want but i don't understand it.
    I deleted your thread because it was missing a link back to the article on Hoopsworld. Just saying it's from Hoopsworld is not enough to satisfy the guidelines. The other thing you left out was a "by lines".

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
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    hell I posted two articles earlier and had Link,name and I also added where was coming from and they deleted my post. I don't understand.I think the only reason was that I added the link at the end of the post not in the top.
    I deleted your post because it was missing a "by line" and the site you quoted from. It only provided a link (at the bottom of the post). Your poor formatting in posting Kravitz's column got my attn. You didn't have anything that said it was from the Star, I went in reading it like you posted it, yourself. Yeah, I figured it was Kravitz column very quickly, but that is not good enough.

    Bob Kravitz is a visitor to this site, he has mentioned as much on his radio show. JMV has commented on this site with regularity. The last thing we need is any legal action against Able (site host) or Hicks (site proprietor) because a poster can't follow directions. This is serious stuff. All we ask is that you are mindful and follow the guidelines.

    Again, use the example in post #1. It is tried and true and has een working since the beginning of PD.
    ...Still "flying casual"
    @roaminggnome74

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    It is ka Thankee sai Major Cold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Free site? Yes
    No annoying adds? Yes
    Rules so that the above can stay the same? Yes


    I don't know why when the admins make request like this we have to question motives.

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    White and Nerdy Anthem's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by intridcold View Post
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    I don't know why when the admins make request like this we have to question motives.
    Agreed. It's not that hard to follow the rules.
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  13. #13
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by xtacy View Post
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    don't get me wrong guys but you are taking it a little too serious. i started a thread earlier. i quoted from hoopsworld.com. i wrote the name of the site in my post. i didn't want to give a link because there were other articles on the page not about pacers thinking they wouldn't interest you guys. and my thread gets deleted. what happens when i don't write the name of author or give a link to the article?

    you can call me all you want but i don't understand it.

    It's always a good idea and good netiquette to post the link whether there is a rule or not. If nothing else it lets readers verify the content of a post. Cut and paste is easy and there's no reason to self-edit or question its need since it is so easy to include anyway.

    There is a rule though, and a good reason for the the rule, so more than anything posters need to remain aware of the rule. IMHO as long as the forum is growing and/or maintaining turnover this topic will turn up again simply because you can't expect new and infrequent posters to remember the rule. Admins and oldtimers might beat their heads against the wall from repetition but it really is something new for the violators of the rule. This thread should tell anyone that.

    That doesn't tell me we have a bunch of rebels looking to give the admins a hard time, it tells me there needs to be better awareness of the rule on an ongoing basis.

    .02,
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    ------

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  14. #14

    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    The admins are just doing their job keeping this website in compliance. What's the fuss?

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    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Copyright infringement is a civil offense and needs some due diligence on the part of the admins. The admins are doing a great job by policing this and providing a periodic reminder...even though it feels like a frisk. Just another sign of a well-run web site...and another sign of our litigious society.

    BTW, copying images (e.g. into avatars) are also a potential liability. Don't recall if that's in the rules. May also want to watch what you type out here...because defamation can be another legal risk.

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    What I don't understand is why it's so bad to take 2 seconds to fix it.. if someone forgets, it's the admins job to fix it. Without regular posters the site would struggle, and deleting peoples posts is a way to scare us off.

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by JGray View Post
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    What I don't understand is why it's so bad to take 2 seconds to fix it.
    Maybe because they all have jobs and don't want to spend all their time fixing other people's mistakes.

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    BTW, copying images (e.g. into avatars) are also a potential liability. Don't recall if that's in the rules. May also want to watch what you type out here...because defamation can be another legal risk.
    Until the current redesign, PD was breaking trademark laws (ie -- trademark dilution) by using the Pacers "circle logo" and replacing it with "Pacers Digest".

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by grace View Post
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    Maybe because they all have jobs and don't want to spend all their time fixing other people's mistakes.
    Oh sorry I didn't know it took an hour to fix a small mistake

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    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by grace View Post
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    Maybe because they all have jobs and don't want to spend all their time fixing other people's mistakes.
    Without regular posters the site would struggle, and deleting peoples posts is a way to scare us off.
    You and JGray both have good points. In this whole thread/discussion I think there is a happy medium that needs to be found.

    Admins don't have time to constantly 'fix' posting violations, especially if they don't actually know where the material came from in the first place to 'fix' it. That is a given. OTOH, deleting posts does more than scare people off, it pi$$es people off (as evidenced by some in this thread). Even if that was not the intent it is a symptom of the action. ...And without posters a site loses its relevancy.

    I'm sure it's frustrating for the admins to continually deal with posting violations, but are the violators the same ones each time? Hicks has said that new posters get a PM of the rules when they sign on. If a rule is being broken to the point that it is frustrating admins and causing posts to get deleted (posts with valid/interesting Pacer/NBA content) then it seems to me something isn't working in getting a major rule out there in the poster's realm of awareness.

    Maybe we need a weekly 'reminder' post.... maybe a 'sticky'.... maybe instead of immediately deleting a post we need a cut and paster 'warning' to the OP to get the info added before the post is deleted....something. I dunno.... I just don't think we have people breaking the rule out of vengeance. I think it's out of ignorance to the rule. ....therefore I think whatever steps are currently in place aren't exactly working as intended. We don't need posters or admins getting insulted, pi$$ed, etc.. That defeats everything right there.
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by JGray View Post
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    What I don't understand is why it's so bad to take 2 seconds to fix it.. if someone forgets, it's the admins job to fix it. Without regular posters the site would struggle, and deleting peoples posts is a way to scare us off.
    It would be even better if the original poster would take those 2 seconds to do it right the first time. That way, a VOLUNTEER (not paid, not a job) admin/site host won't have to fix it in order to keep his labor of love out of very expensive legal trouble.

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    Administrator Roaming Gnome's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    I've never deleted someone's post on the first offense. I just get tired of doing it for the same people over and over. Therefore, I had to go thru this to get certain poster's attn.

    Quote Originally Posted by JGray
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    What I don't understand is why it's so bad to take 2 seconds to fix it.. if someone forgets, it's the admins job to fix it. Without regular posters the site would struggle, and deleting peoples posts is a way to scare us off.
    2 seconds my ***, by time I'm done tracking down some of the poor links given. I can dump some substantial time into this. I'm done doing that... Follow the guidelines, that is all we are asking.

    Struggle, with what. We are not bank rolled by hits, volume or anything like that. We value new posters, but they are not the life blood of this site like you imply.
    Last edited by Roaming Gnome; 12-29-2008 at 01:02 AM.
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by JGray View Post
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    Oh sorry I didn't know it took an hour to fix a small mistake
    Why don't you fix it yourself then?

    I've moderated forums before, and I've run several online communities. There is more to it than you might think to keep a site like this running. It's not that hard to copy the link, name the author, and the site it comes from this is true, but they have other more important things to be doing. So just do it yourself. You'll have to do more than that any time you cite something in a legitimate paper or document.
    Last edited by Trader Joe; 12-29-2008 at 04:37 AM.

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    PROUD 2 B A PACERS FAN! xtacy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    Quote Originally Posted by grace View Post
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    Maybe because they all have jobs and don't want to spend all their time fixing other people's mistakes.
    i guess deleting the thread right away and writing down the reason like they are doing now takes about the same amount of time as sendind me a pm telling me that if i don't add a link lets say in 1-2 hours it will get deleted like they should be doing. i'm not saying they should fix the posts. i'm saying they should give the chance to the poster to fix it and it wouldn't take hours. but rules are rules and i'm done posting stuff on pd.
    Last edited by xtacy; 12-29-2008 at 08:01 AM.

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    Default Re: Guidelines for posting "off-site" content

    On the issue of just asking posters, it's been done for a while, and what I usually ran into was that nothing was done. Be it they ignored me or simply didn't read it. That's where the frustration kicks in when it's a repeat offender.

    It probably means we need to skip saying something in the thread itself, and go straight to PMing the offender.

    If any of you feel strongly about better communication, then by all means PM them yourselves or remind them yourselves another way. As long as it's not done rudely, it can't hurt. It'd be appreciated.

    Also, I have a question for regular members. When we delete a thread (for example, the ones Gnome recently removed), can you see its placeholder on the board? Meaning as you're skimming the various thread titles on the Pacers board, does it show you a line where a thread used to be, but is now deleted and unaccessable?

    Because for Admins it does, and when we leave a reason for deleting the post, we admins can read that reason, but I wasn't sure if you guys could or not. Can you?

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