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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

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Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

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Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Rule #10

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Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

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  • #1

    Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

    I wasn't really impressed by this article, but I guess I'll post it anyway


    http://www.torontosun.com/sports/bas...92411-sun.html



    Trading Ford was a mistake
    By FRANK ZICARELLI

    Last Updated: 10th December 2008, 3:36am
    Email Story Print Size A A A Report Typo Share with:
    Facebook Digg Del.icio.us Google Stumble Upon Newsvine Reddit Technorati Feed Me Yahoo Ma.gnolia Simpy Squidoo Spurl Blogmarks Netvouz Scuttle Co.mments Sitejot + What are these? T.J. Ford returns to the Air Canada Centre tonight as basketball's spotlight shifts squarely on to the backcourt.

    In one of those intriguing matchups that features so many layers, Ford will go mano a mano against Jose Calderon.

    It won't quite match the hype that surrounded Tracy McGrady's return to Hogtown when T-Mac went toe to toe with distant cousin Vince Carter in a high-wire act, but tonight's pointed confrontation is one worth noting and debating.

    Ford, in essence, was shown the door in the off-season when the Raptors felt Calderon was best suited to lead the team as the undisputed starter at point guard.

    For years, the Raptors were searching for that elusive floor general, a leader who could run an offence, establish tempo and forge a style of play with the ball in his hands.

    For once in their history, the Raptors had two legitimate players with two contrasting yet equally effective styles, but one just knew something had to give.

    The moment of truth arrived when management felt Ford had to go, and he was traded to the Indiana Pacers in a multi-player package that fetched Jermaine O'Neal.

    O'Neal will face his former team for the first time following years of being the face of the Pacers franchise.

    For Ford and Calderon, it is a rare opportunity to go head to head in a real game, a personal game within the game itself.

    If one thinks there is no ill will between the two, one should think again, despite what both players will say publicly.

    The way Ford and Calderon conduct themselves is as different as their style on the floor.

    Ford pulled no punches when he stated last season that he wanted to be the starter.

    When Calderon assumed the starter's role in the wake of Ford's horrific fall in Atlanta a year ago last week, Ford never could accept his new-found place as backup because it wasn't his nature.

    It made for some awkward moments, dividing the locker room and leading fans to hate Ford's me-first attitude.

    We said it then and we will repeat it again that the Raptors made the wrong choice in moving forward with their starter at point guard.

    This is by no means a knock against Calderon, but Ford's ability to create his own shot, attack defences and his willingness to take over games in late-game situations are precisely what the Raptors need.

    Coaches prefer Calderon's half-court style to Ford's turnover-prone ways because they can better manage and control the likes of a Calderon.

    Ford has an edge and exudes a confidence that borders on cockiness, the very definition of today's NBA player.

    With the Raptors now wanting to play an uptempo game, Ford would seem to be the perfect fit in an imperfect lineup.

    Calderon's stock was at its highest last year as he entered free agency, while an argument could be made that Ford was at his lowest given the personal and medical baggage.

    It wasn't until Calderon returned to his native Spain that he told the world, through his personal website, he wanted to be a starter.

    And so tonight starts the beginning of a point guard rivalry that is sure to divide even the most rabid of Raptor fans.

    Is it Jose or T.J.?

    Ford and Calderon are both good, but they are so different.

    No doubt fans will boo Ford when he is introduced and likely each time he touches the ball because that is the way Toronto reacts.

    The problem with basketball remains the lack of understanding when it comes to the game's culture.

    Every team needs a Ford-like player.

    O'Neal brings an edge, but he can't bring the ball up the floor.

    As currently constituted, the Raptors need Ford more than they need Calderon.

    If anything, what the Raptors have shown the past year is a lack of patience amid growing concerns about their future fortunes.

    Impatience led to the decision to ship out Ford, who at one point was viewed as the cornerstone piece alongside fellow Texan Chris Bosh.

    Impatience led to Sam Mitchell's dismissal.

    The Raptors are in transition and who better to deal with it than Ford.
    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

    There are some comments in this article about the game tonight

    http://www.thestar.com/Sports/article/551302

    King James pours in 31 points as Toronto looks lethargic at both ends of the floor in lopsided loss

    Dec 10, 2008 04:30 AM
    Comments on this story (18)
    Doug Smith
    Sports Reporter

    CLEVELAND–They were beaten soundly – at times humiliated – and now they are headed home for what could be the most emotional game of the season at the Air Canada Centre.

    It's hard to imagine things being much worse for the Raptors right now.

    Giving up a seemingly endless array of breakaway dunks and being blown out almost from the opening tip, the Raptors saw their season-worst losing streak reach five here last night when they were hammered 114-94 by LeBron James and the Cleveland Cavaliers.

    The manner in which the game was ultimately decided – by a 23-2 Cavs run early in the third quarter that was little more than a layup line at times – does little to instill any kind of confidence with the spectre of T.J. Ford and the Indiana Pacers on the horizon tonight.

    In the quiet of the Raptor locker room, with players speaking in hushed tones if they were speaking at all, the man sure to be at the centre of the emotional cauldron tonight said the Ford return has to take a back seat to the dire need for a good performance.

    "Yeah, I didn't think about that, I was just thinking about it being next game," said Jose Calderon. "It will be special for sure but right now we don't have to be worried about who we play against, we have to win and that's all that matters right now.

    "If we get a win, everybody's going to relax a little bit. ... We can start playing better and that's what we need."

    What they need is an effort 180 degrees away from the one they put on here.

    James had three steals and punctuated the third-quarter breakaway dunk by posing mid-air with his off-hand behind his head as if he were in some kind of repose on a couch.

    It might not have been overtly mocking but it was close. Considering how things turned out here, it was entirely appropriate.

    James did it again on the next Cleveland possession off a Raptor turnover, going coast-to-coast and dunking ahead of a chasing Chris Bosh, pausing at the end of the play to cast a large smile at his American Olympic teammate.

    "Every mistake was like almost a layup," said Calderon.

    The trouble signs are everywhere.

    Bosh once again teetered from uninvolved to something close to uninterested, not guarding the lane, not attacking the basket, going for long stretches like he was going through the motions.

    But he was not solely to blame for this dog of an outing. The Raptors didn't rebound as a team, they committed 19 turnovers that Cleveland turned into 27 points and they were never a threat to win.

    Jermaine O'Neal, who politely declined to discuss the events after the game ("I've got nothing to say, it's the same stuff, it's just redundant") had more turnovers (six) than he did rebounds (four), Calderon had just three assists – and three turnovers – in just 24 minutes.

    The body language said dejection but not anger.

    "I don't think that they've turned on themselves at all and I don't think they've turned on anybody else," said coach Jay Triano. "I just think they're angry like everybody is. Losing isn't fun."

    The Raptors haven't won since before they left on a western trip that cost then-head coach Sam Mitchell his job. They've trailed by at least 10 points at the end of the first quarter in three of their last four defeats and have been beaten by at least 20 in three of their five straight losses.

    Bosh had just nine points and hasn't scored more than 15 in any game on the losing streak and has gone long stretches without being the focal point of the offence.

    "I don't know what happened (last night), we need him to take more shots and we need everybody to play a little bit better," said Calderon. "(Tonight) is a great game for us at home. We have to start proving ourselves. We have to start winning."

    Comment

    • #3
      Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

      I read up to "We said it then and we will repeat it again that the Raptors made the wrong choice in moving forward with their starter at point guard." and couldn't any more.

      These are the same media people who rode TJ out of town. You hear TJ all the time mention that he wasn't the problem and it's obvious now he wasn't.
      2015, 2016, 2019 IKL Fantasy Basketball Champions - DC Dreamers

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

        Originally posted by tbabyy924 View Post
        I read up to "We said it then and we will repeat it again that the Raptors made the wrong choice in moving forward with their starter at point guard." and couldn't any more.

        These are the same media people who rode TJ out of town. You hear TJ all the time mention that he wasn't the problem and it's obvious now he wasn't.
        Lol, that's crazy.. I stopped at the exact same point.. and was like, ok, this isn't worth my time anymore..

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

          "Ford's ability to create his own shot, attack defences and his willingness to take over games in late-game situations are precisely what the Raptors need."

          Hmmmm. The Ps aren't using him in late-game situations either.
          "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

            Originally posted by McKeyFan View Post
            "Ford's ability to create his own shot, attack defences and his willingness to take over games in late-game situations are precisely what the Raptors need."

            Hmmmm. The Ps aren't using him in late-game situations either.
            He's certainly has been in most late game situations. He wasn't against the Celtics on Sunday (for the most part) and I think maybe 2 or 3 other games - but other than that Ford has been in. (exceot for defensive purposes I want Ford in the game at the end - although as I was watching the game on Sunday I agreed with having Jack in there - not sure why but he was playing well)

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

              Hope you're right, and it was just the Celts.

              I didn't agree with keeping TJ out. He's more of a gamer than Quis or Jack, in my opinion. What we lose in defense is made up by his good offense late in games.

              P.S. He's not great -- as we've seen in some late game situations where he's been a bit wild. But he's the best we've got.
              "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                Wild means out-of-control but easy to block layup attempts?

                Hmmm....

                There's a difference between "able to create his own shot" and "able to create a makable shot."
                Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                And life itself, rushing over me
                Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                  I got as far as Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake and then I said "No ".

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                    Ha!

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                      Want him back? We'll take Jarett Jack for him.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                        Sorry, I was making a trade proposal and this article came up as a blast from the past. I simply found it hilarious given our certain situation....

                        Ok more sad then hilarious but still

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                          Brutal. But not so much as it is for the writer. Guy knows his stuff....for the loss.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                            Can I hypnotize TOR management into making Ford/Diener for Jack/Banks a reality?

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Re: Toronto Sun: trading TJ Ford was a mistake

                              Jose ( if anything ) is a highly efficient PG that can properly run a team while being a solid shooter. His defense supposedly sucks....but it's not like starting quality PGs that plays great defense grows on trees. Even with Jose's longer contract, I'd easily trade Jose for TJ.
                              Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

                              Comment

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