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Thread: Dunleavy

  1. #1

    Default Dunleavy

    There has been a lot of discussion on Dunleavy being traded or not being traded, but the one thing I have noticed is everyone just assumes when he comes back he will just fit into the scheme of how the team is playing or how he'll even make it better. The team has played basically 14 games w/o him. The new players aren't use to him. If he gums up the cohesion of the players when he's in the game and the chemistry of the team on the floor after given enough time, what then? Do you make him the 6th man as some would like? Or after a period of time things don't work do you trade him?

    I'm looking for input into how you feel if he isn't working out as a starter or maybe not that well as the 6th man type player on this team. PLEASE DO NOT suggest trade scenarios. This isn't a trade Dun for whoever thread.
    Last edited by Justin Tyme; 11-12-2008 at 11:34 AM.

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    JT, this is a very good question that I've often discussed with Naptown Seth and Hicks in the past couple days. Personally, I see Dunleavy being a plus on the offensive end, but I see him being a Major drag on the defensive end. I just don't see Jr. being as disruptive in the passing lanes as I see Marquise being. Also, I take into consideration that Jr. is not a very good on ball/perimeter defender. I know that there is a lot of talk about Jr. being a great team defense guy, but to me that doesn't cover up enough of his liabilities.

    I also don't see opposing coaches trying to single out Marquis as a point to run their offense thru like I have with Jr. last year.

    The best I can come up with is a wait and see approach. I have faith in the coaching staff to make a hard decision after a point in time it becomes obvious that Jr. is holding the team's first unit back. As for the hard decision, I don't see that being a trade, but more less him being groomed for the super sub roll.
    Last edited by Roaming Gnome; 11-12-2008 at 11:46 AM.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Personally, as many posters have known recently, Ive been one to see Dunleavy shipped out of Indiana.

    Reason being that he is a good played and that he is the best player that will bring us something back without loosing that chemistry of the team. With that said, thats why I havent mentioned Granger or Ford.

    Dunleavy is a great talent, but I think that we are stacked and complete at the swingmen positions, that we can afford to trade him and accept someone back in return to help us at a different position that we need help in, as in PF/C.

    Where ever Dun go, they will benefit. He is a great talent and is a benefit to the team as a whole. But in order for us to make our team better we have to move talent to get back talent at different positions.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Wow, Marquis gets it together in his contract year.

    Who would have imagined?


  5. #5

    Default Re: Dunleavy

    I think I would sooner see him traded than used as the 6th man if he is not working out as the starter, assuming the pacers can get either a decent talent in a position of need (Powar Foward) or role player and a decent future draft pick. He might make a good 6th man, but there is more money tied up in him than I would like to see in that role.

  6. #6

    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by iPACER View Post
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    Wow, Marquis gets it together in his contract year.

    Who would have imagined?

    Better now than never, it either helps the Pacer win this year or improves his value as a mid season trade chip.

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    everytime Quis takes a jumpshot the crowd winces...he is not a Starter SG on a winning team.

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by Raskolnikov View Post
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    thanks - i was too tired to look for it

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Bottom line...even if Quis plays plays the way he is, he is not worth his extension IMO
    Last edited by MillerTime; 11-12-2008 at 12:12 PM.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    am i the only one that is so excited to see Mike running with TJ ford? and his sub-par defense be masked by the players he's on the floor with?

    quite frankly, i don't think we can get anyone at PF/C right now that will trade for mike, or atleast not anyone with as good as a value as he has and a team in need of a player like him.

    We're playing good right now, but i still expect us to hit a wall.. And one thing I seen from the NBA, it's not that bad to be stacked in 1 position, with solid good players(as injury does occur). Quis is solid right now, but we can be seeing a better spaced floor when Mike is on the floor with Danny, as he still shoots greatly better than Marquis.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by andreialta View Post
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    am i the only one that is so excited to see Mike running with TJ ford? and his sub-par defense be masked by the players he's on the floor with?

    quite frankly, i don't think we can get anyone at PF/C right now that will trade for mike, or atleast not anyone with as good as a value as he has and a team in need of a player like him.

    We're playing good right now, but i still expect us to hit a wall.. And one thing I seen from the NBA, it's not that bad to be stacked in 1 position, with solid good players(as injury does occur). Quis is solid right now, but we can be seeing a better spaced floor when Mike is on the floor with Danny, as he still shoots greatly better than Marquis.
    No youre not the only one. Half the board is probably hyped about Dunleavy, personally im not one of them. I would like to see him moved for somone that we could use in another position.

    I am never saying that he "sucks". I think hes great, but not as great as Granger or Rush, so I would think he would need to be moved for someone else to come in for another position to be satisfied
    "So, which one of you guys is going to come in second?" - Larry Bird before the 3 point contest. He won.



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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Here's where I point out that last year, Dunleavy was our most effective player as judged by the +/- stat. He was the only player on the team who played more than 2000 minutes and had a positive adjusted +/-. What this means is that Dunleavy's contributions on offense far outweigh his defensive liabilities.

    He absolutely has a role on this team. I'm not opposed to bringing him off the bench. My strategy, if I were O'Brien, would be to have either Dunleavy or Granger on the court for every non-garbage time minute for the rest of the season. We saw in the first half of the OKC game how much we flounder without Granger in the game. If we've got Dunleavy in the game at that point, our offense continues to run efficiently.

    I also think that Dunleavy's presence, as opposed to 'Quis, will space the floor much better and create more space in the lane for guys like Ford, Jack, and Murphy to drive. Right now Murphy is basically forced to hang out around the 3 point line because we only have 2 effective shooters in our starting lineup. This makes things harder on offense.

    I'd also like to see Dunleavy on the floor anytime we have Jack playing PG. Dunleavy has the ability to play as a point forward and have the offense run through him. This would take a lot of pressure off of Jack.

    One other factor to remember is that Dunleavy and Granger are the co-captains of this team. That speaks to how highly he's regarded by J'Ob. Whether or not Dunleavy starts, I think he certainly needs to be on the floor 30+ minutes.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    I'd love to see Dun get all of Daniels' minutes. If Dun got half of his minutes at SF with Rush at the 2, that would dramatically mask his defensive difficulties.

    I think he'll come back and fit in. I think at the very least, the dude deserves the chance to show that he CAN'T fit in, especially since he's a smart and adaptable player who ought to be able to make it work.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    The big thing is that when Dun comes back, he'll start and that means that Danny has to guard the other teams best wing, again.

    I like it Marquis in there and focusing on playing hard D on the opposing best Wing.

    I've said this ever since he's been here, that Dunleavy is the leagues perfect 6th man on a very good team. It doesn't mean Marquis is better at all.

    Jr can still finish games, but I love the idea of Jr with B Rush, Hibbert, Jack, and Foster in the second Unit. It just gives two really balanced tough Units.

    Unit One
    TJ
    Marquis
    DG
    Troy
    Rasho

    2nd Unit
    Jack
    BRush
    Dunleavy
    Foster
    Hibbert

    I'd really really like the look of those rotations and especially to help bring the Rookies along.

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Wow, everyone pretty much summed it up for me already...

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by mellifluous View Post
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    Here's where I point out that last year, Dunleavy was our most effective player as judged by the +/- stat. He was the only player on the team who played more than 2000 minutes and had a positive adjusted +/-. What this means is that Dunleavy's contributions on offense far outweigh his defensive liabilities.

    He absolutely has a role on this team. I'm not opposed to bringing him off the bench. My strategy, if I were O'Brien, would be to have either Dunleavy or Granger on the court for every non-garbage time minute for the rest of the season. We saw in the first half of the OKC game how much we flounder without Granger in the game. If we've got Dunleavy in the game at that point, our offense continues to run efficiently.

    I also think that Dunleavy's presence, as opposed to 'Quis, will space the floor much better and create more space in the lane for guys like Ford, Jack, and Murphy to drive. Right now Murphy is basically forced to hang out around the 3 point line because we only have 2 effective shooters in our starting lineup. This makes things harder on offense.

    I'd also like to see Dunleavy on the floor anytime we have Jack playing PG. Dunleavy has the ability to play as a point forward and have the offense run through him. This would take a lot of pressure off of Jack.

    One other factor to remember is that Dunleavy and Granger are the co-captains of this team. That speaks to how highly he's regarded by J'Ob. Whether or not Dunleavy starts, I think he certainly needs to be on the floor 30+ minutes.
    But Dun is the only player we have that has value enough to bring back another player at the PF/C position to help us. We can gone on for days with our swingmen,...they're great, dont get me wrong. But someone has to get moved for a good PF to come in. We cant trade scraps for a good post player. The one position we're stacked at is the swingman position and our most moveable asset is Dunleavy.

    Would you guys rather move Granger or Rush before we move Dunealvy?
    "So, which one of you guys is going to come in second?" - Larry Bird before the 3 point contest. He won.



  18. #18
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by duke dynamite View Post
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    Wow, everyone pretty much summed it up for me already...
    what do you mean?
    "So, which one of you guys is going to come in second?" - Larry Bird before the 3 point contest. He won.



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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Just one thought on the trade front: If we trade Dun and do not get a wing or 2-guard in return, we're going to be scarily thin at that position. You can't rely on 'Quis to be healthy all season and if he were to miss a few games we'd be seeing 20+ mpg of Jack at SG and probably a lot of Graham at SF. Also, if we're short a 2 or 3, you can kiss the smallball Granger PF lineup goodbye.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by MillerTime View Post
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    But Dun is the only player we have that has value enough to bring back another player at the PF/C position to help us. We can gone on for days with our swingmen,...they're great, dont get me wrong. But someone has to get moved for a good PF to come in. We cant trade scraps for a good post player. The one position we're stacked at is the swingman position and our most moveable asset is Dunleavy.

    Would you guys rather move Granger or Rush before we move Dunealvy?
    Granger is staying put.

    Rasho was doing just fine with Murphy together before he got hurt. Do you not watch the games? If numbers are all you look at, then you aren't getting the whole picture here.

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by MillerTime View Post
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    what do you mean?
    Read through all the positive comments. In layman's terms, all the good things about Dunleavy.

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by MillerTime View Post
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    But Dun is the only player we have that has value enough to bring back another player at the PF/C position to help us. We can gone on for days with our swingmen,...they're great, dont get me wrong. But someone has to get moved for a good PF to come in. We cant trade scraps for a good post player. The one position we're stacked at is the swingman position and our most moveable asset is Dunleavy.

    Would you guys rather move Granger or Rush before we move Dunealvy?
    guess we shouldn't have traded JO then huh?

    I don't even think there's a good PF/C that's available besides Kaman... and i think he's overrated.

    I don't think anyone should be moved right now. Our offense clearly does not revolve any post play at all. I'd rather move marquis and get a soild off the bench PF than move Mike.
    [SIGPIC]Dun Dun shooting form![/SIGPIC]

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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by MillerTime View Post
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    But Dun is the only player we have that has value enough to bring back another player at the PF/C position to help us. We can gone on for days with our swingmen,...they're great, dont get me wrong. But someone has to get moved for a good PF to come in. We cant trade scraps for a good post player. The one position we're stacked at is the swingman position and our most moveable asset is Dunleavy.

    Would you guys rather move Granger or Rush before we move Dunealvy?
    This wasn't supposed to be a trade thread, but...

    I don't think trading Dunleavy will bring us back a PF who's good enough to justify trading for him. I'd love to see a 3 wing rotation of Dun, Granger, and Rush for the next few years.

    Also, I'm not unhappy with our bigs. Troy Murphy is an above average PF who deserves 25+ mpg. Foster gives us everything he's got every second he's on the floor and makes a positive impact on the game in a lot of different ways. Rasho is a good center who does a lot of things well. I like that Hibbert is getting a few minutes a game to develop. Also, I think that McRoberts and Baston earned the right to a few minutes with their play the other night.

    My point is that it's going to take a superior talent to replace all the things we get from our patchwork of bigs with one player. The only bigs who are going to be available that have that much talent are going to be guys with character issues like Zach Randolph, and I'd prefer not to have them on the team.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by andreialta View Post
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    I don't think anyone should be moved right now. Our offense clearly does not revolve any post play at all. I'd rather move marquis and get a soild off the bench PF than move Mike.
    We already have a solid off-the-bench PF in Foster. We've even got a promising third-stringer in McBob.

    Unless it involved moving Tinsley or getting a superduperstar, these guys should get the opportunity to play together for a season before tweaking anything.
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    Default Re: Dunleavy

    Quote Originally Posted by duke dynamite View Post
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    Read through all the positive comments. In layman's terms, all the good things about Dunleavy.
    thanks for clearing that up slappy
    Last edited by avoidingtheclowns; 11-12-2008 at 12:53 PM. Reason: duke quoted it too, crap
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