Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

6-16-04

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • 6-16-04

    Wednesday, June 16, 2004

    Lakers facing 'Day After Tomorrow'

    By Chad Ford
    ESPN Insider


    It's over.

    The Lakers were outplayed, outhustled, out hearted every game by a team few believed could even make it to Game 5 of the Finals, much less close the series out there. Instead, it was the Lakers who hung on barely long enough to be humiliated 100-87 Tuesday night.

    L.A.'s dream team is dead. Now GM Mitch Kupchak faces a real nightmare this summer. Phil Jackson claimed Tuesday night there was only a "slim chance" he'll return to L.A. Kobe Bryant still plans to opt out of his contract and become a free agent. Gary Payton and Karl Malone also can opt out.

    O'Neal, the one guy stuck on the Lakers for at least two more seasons, sounds like he wants out, too.

    "This summer is going to be a different summer for a lot of people," O'Neal said. "Everyone's going to take care of their own business; everyone's going to do what's best for them, including me. So we haven't made any of those decisions yet. But once those decisions are made, you will be well informed."

    The Pistons were hungry, under-paid and under-appreciated. They shared, played nice with one another and worked together toward a common goal.

    The Lakers, we are finding out, are everything NBA champs are not. They're spoiled, overpaid, selfish and, like O'Neal said, essentially businessmen in jerseys, looking out for No. 1.

    "A team always beats a group of individuals," L.A.'s Rick Fox said. "We picked a poor time to be a group of individuals."

    Something has to give.

    "Now it's decision time for this team and what direction they are going to move," Jackson said at the press conference "Obviously, it's going to be a big statement that's going to be made in July. And [General Manager] Mitch Kupchak has done a very good job. They will make a move in August to rebuild this basketball club. I think they will be fine."

    They? You mean "we" right?

    "Well," he said, "that's yet to be determined, OK?"

    Can Kupchak keep it together? Or is it time to start fresh in L.A.? Here's a look at what to expect, as Insider continues its summer blueprint series.

    Lakers Summer Blueprint
    DRAFT: The Lakers are picking 27th this year. They've had their eye on Sasha Vujacic, a 6-foot-7 point guard from Slovenia for more than a year. Vujacic is older and more experienced than most players in the draft. He's an outstanding shooter with good court vision, and drafting him at this spot makes a lot of sense for the Lakers.

    However, don't be surprised if L.A.'s moves this summer include moving up in the draft. The Lakers desperately need a young star to infuse a little life in the franchise. Young point guards like Devin Harris, Ben Gordon or Shaun Livingston would be great fits. A young, athletic big like Dwight Howard would be terrific, too. To get high enough in the draft to nab one of those guys, though, the team is obviously going to have to part with a major player or two. But if the focus becomes rebuilding, that won't be so hard.

    FREE AGENCY: Everything revolves around Kobe, and it could take a while to sort it all out. Over the course of the season we've heard it all: Kobe to the Clippers. Kobe to the Suns, to the Spurs, even to the Knicks. We've also heard just as much talk that he'll never leave the Lakers. If Jackson truly is out of the way, Kobe finally can wrestle control. Owner Jerry Buss values Kobe over any other player or coach on the team. If Kobe wants Shaq gone? The Lakers just might do it.

    How all of that plays out over the next two months is anyone's guess. Kobe still must attend to his rape trial, and that certainly will have a cooling effect on the negotiations. If Kobe really wants to stay, and if he really wants Shaq to go, it's going to take Kupchak a while to find a deal that makes sense for the Lakers.

    It also won't be easy for Kobe's suitors to clear the cap space they need to sign him. The Clippers likely would have to trade their No. 2 pick and one other player to be able to afford Kobe. They'll also have to refrain from re-upping Quentin Richardson to keep a space open for him.

    The Spurs have free agents of their own to attend to, but they'll need every penny to sign Kobe. Where does that leave Manu Ginobili, Hedo Turkoglu and Bruce Bowen? How long will the Spurs wait for a decision?

    The Suns still need to clear around $6 million in cap space. They're trying to convince Charlotte to take Jahidi White in the expansion draft, but it likely will cost them their first-round pick this year to get it done. The Suns don't want to pay that high a price unless they know Kobe's coming.

    Derek Fisher can join Kobe, Payton and Malone in opting out. Malone and Fisher are expected to test the waters. Payton has been unhappy in L.A., but he faces a pretty stark financial reality. As poorly as he played this year, there's no guarantee another team is going to offer him the same money he's due in L.A. ($4.9 million). Payton likely will wait to see what the Lakers' gameplan is before deciding whether to stick it out another year.

    TRADES: The Lakers just don't have the assets to make a trade without breaking up the dynamic duo. Trading Brian Cook, Kareem Rush or Devean George just isn't going to cut it.

    Will they trade Shaq? That's the $27 million question. Whenever a player makes that much, trading him is almost impossible. His salary eclipses the entire Utah Jazz payroll. Shaq may be the most dominant player on the planet, but if a team has to gut its entire roster to get him, what's the point? When you factor in Shaq's age, his poor conditioning and questionable motivation, the decision becomes even murkier.

    The same holds true for L.A. Why trade him unless the team is getting better in the process? There's talk the Pacers may be interested. Ditto for the Magic But let's do a reality check. Indiana has the salaries to get it done, but it would cost them Jermaine O'Neal in the process. Are they willing to give up someone so young just for two years of Shaq? If the Lakers would accept O'Neal, Austin Croshere and Scot Pollard in return for Shaq, the Pacers would have to consider it. Al Harrington and Jonathan Bender could take over for Jermaine. But it's still an awfully big price to pay down the road.

    There's almost no way the Magic could afford Shaq, short of the Lakers agreeing to take on Grant Hill's contract. I can't see that happening unless Hill assures everyone he's retiring and the money will come off the books this winter. Even then the trade would cost the Magic the No. 1 pick, Juwan Howard and a few other throw-ins. If that's the case, wouldn't it be easier just to swap T-Mac for Kobe?

    The Lakers could attempt to work a sign-and-trade with Kobe if they're sure he's going to leave. That would allow them to salvage something in return. There's been talk of a McGrady-Kobe swap for years. But for that to work, Kobe would have to agree to play in Orlando. Given the crumbling state of the franchise, I find it hard to believe he would. T-Mac is from there, and he still wants out.

    However, the Lakers can't risk standing pat. If Kobe leaves without compensation, Malone, Payton and Fisher will follow. The Lakers will be left with Shaq, a bunch of role players and no cap room to sign a top-flight free agent. At that point they'll be forced to trade Shaq, but his value will plummet as every team in the league tries to cash in on the fire sale.

    COACHING: Jackson sounded like he was giving his farewell speech Tuesday night.

    "My timetable is to meet with the management of the Lakers after the season, discuss some things that we have to discuss as an organization," he said. "And then we'll make a decision from there.

    "But right now I would say that it's a pretty slim chance that I'll be back coaching next year. It's a pretty slim chance. I've had a lot of persuasion given to me by these kids; they were hoping I would win the 10th and retire. But maybe losing this one, this opportunity is enough for me to say that it's time to give it up. But right now, I'm not going to make that decision or give that statement."

    By almost every account, Jackson will be the first to leave. The man everyone thought would be his successor, Byron Scott, couldn't wait around and took the Hornets' job instead. There isn't another coach available with Jackson's stature. Mike Fratello, George Karl and a plethora of other castoffs and assistants aren't going to cut it.

    FRONT OFFICE: Kupchak was the NBA's golden boy last summer after convincing Payton and Malone to join up. However, with his team on the brink of disaster, he could just as easily turn out to be the goat. Why didn't the Lakers use their money on younger players to keep rebuilding?

    While Joe Dumars, his counterpart in Detroit, was building a team that could win now and in the future, Kupchak was obsessed with only today. Now that it didn't work, the flexibility to rebuild quickly just isn't there. He can try to patch things together between Shaq and Kobe, or he can blow the roster up. The patching up thing may work for another year, but in the long-term it's destined for failure. Blowing up the Lakers will be unpopular. Given where they're at right now as far as player development and cap space goes -- even with Kobe, Payton, Fisher and Malone off the books the Lakers still would be over the cap -- it could be a long, long process.

    Back in February we warned that a Lakers' worst case scenario could be unfolding before our eyes. If Kupchak manages to convince Kobe to stay, the damage can be minimized. If he can't, the Lakers will resemble L.A. after the twisters tore through town in the movie the Day After Tomorrow -- a disaster area.
Working...
X