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Thread: Celtics sign Darius Miles

  1. #26
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
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    So if he gets cuts by Boston the Pacers should sign him and gimp him out there fore 10 games just as Danny insurance? Cripes, couldn't they just throw a 10 game contract at him at some point if he doesn't catch on somewhere. You know at least one Pacer will miss some time so a 10 game deal wouldn't be out of the blue. Get him 5 minutes a game during that period.

    ie, what PacersGuy said
    That's what I'm thinking.......get the roster down to 14 somehow....then sign him to a guaranteed vet contract.
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    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  2. #27
    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    I wondered why this could get this much response, but...

    Why don't we just go ahead and get Danny signed to an extension? Then we could go back to not giving a **** about Darius Miles.

  3. #28
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    Why don't we just go ahead and get Danny signed to an extension? Then we could go back to not giving a **** about Darius Miles.
    Yeah, that would be the best thing. Also, do Morway and Bird somehow think that Danny will be cheaper next summer? The reason why these extensions are so great is that you get these guys before they explode into all-stars.

  4. #29
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by rexnom View Post
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    Yeah, that would be the best thing. Also, do Morway and Bird somehow think that Danny will be cheaper next summer? The reason why these extensions are so great is that you get these guys before they explode into all-stars.
    That was the reasoning with Tinsley, as I recall.
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  5. #30
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    That was the reasoning with Tinsley, as I recall.
    And Bender, Artest, Harrington, and Foster...I actually think the reasoning was to keep a core together and sign players before they could get on the open market where other teams would make really stupid offers to them.

    I think Tinsley and Bender were bad mistakes, but Artest, Foster, and Harrington were all reasonable decisions. (Though, I admit, I questioned the Foster signing at the time, but not Jonathan, under the "burgeoning potential" theory that I've since thrown in the trash.)

    This seems to be a reasonable approach that's seen two recent players that they let go to free agency (Brad Miller, Peja) get offered contracts that were 20-30% above reasonable expectations.

    There will be risks with Danny's contract, signed this year or next. However, I believe that (a) we will be able to sign him for less this summer, and (b) it will help us stabilize our basketball and financial framework so we can move on to the next step in the rebuild.

    I would also be in favor of extending a guy like Jarrett Jack, if you could get him for something like 4-years, $16mm. A guy like Jack, I'd be willing to set a relatively (but not insultingly) low price and see if he bites. If not, let him play and test the market.

    I know you believe that guys who sign long term contracts (generally) stop improving. I would tend to agree, but I don't think that's what you're worried about. Some guys who get their first long-term contract for big bucks promptly get complacent and backslide. I don't believe this will be the case with Danny. There seems to be plenty of evidence that he has his head on straight, and , even if he doesn't "improve", I think I could live with paying $60mm over five years for 20ish & 7ish production with solid defense and a pretty good on- and off-court demeanor. (Yes, it's more than I would've said previously, but I think this summer has given us a pretty good idea of what the market pays for a guy of Danny's calibre.)

  6. #31
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    And Bender, Artest, Harrington, and Foster...I actually think the reasoning was to keep a core together and sign players before they could get on the open market where other teams would make really stupid offers to them.

    I think Tinsley and Bender were bad mistakes, but Artest, Foster, and Harrington were all reasonable decisions. (Though, I admit, I questioned the Foster signing at the time, but not Jonathan, under the "burgeoning potential" theory that I've since thrown in the trash.)
    The problem is that even Bender and Tinsley were somewhat "reasonable" decisions at the time, which is what I suspect you're getting at. "Reasonable" not meaning that everyone agreed with the choice, but meaning that there was a clear logic that many agreed with, and those that didn't could at least understand.

    So we've been burned on that particular strategy, but the problem is that it still seems to be the best, or at least the most sound, strategy for a team in our situation. I think we'll all acknowledge that it is unlikely, at best, that we'd ever land a huge prize through the Free Agent market. We also don't have owners with (seemingly) unlimited resources, and therefore largely operate as if the tax threshhold was our hardcap. Therefore, this team will need to grow through good drafting and prudent trading.

    We will need to balance the development of our "homegrown" players (that leads to the strategy being discussed here of locking our young guys up long term) and the ability to have "tradeable" assets (which generally means short, small-to-mid-sized movable contracts). Sometimes we'll make smart moves, sometimes they'll blow up in our face. However, I believe that if we, as a franchise, don't sign a player like Danny to an extension because the Tinsley signing has blown up in our face, then we're done.

    I prefer sins of commission to sins of ommission. I'd rather make an active decision to commit to Danny, along with the associated risks, than to wait and find out that someone actually will be willing to offer Danny more than we're willing to pay. To me, that's allowing outside factors to have too much sway on a core decision for your franchise.

  7. #32
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    And Bender, Artest, Harrington, and Foster...I actually think the reasoning was to keep a core together and sign players before they could get on the open market where other teams would make really stupid offers to them.
    I think Tinsley and Bender were bad mistakes, but Artest, Foster, and Harrington were all reasonable decisions.
    The Foster/Bender extentions in essence cost us Brad Miller. I think JO's career would have been different (as well as Ron-Ron's) had Miller staid. To me, that loss was the beginning of what became of this team.
    Hopefully, things will turn around now....
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  8. #33
    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerGuy View Post
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    The Foster/Bender extentions in essence cost us Brad Miller. I think JO's career would have been different (as well as Ron-Ron's) had Miller staid. To me, that loss was the beginning of what became of this team.
    Hopefully, things will turn around now....

    We were a better basketball team without Brad Miller. Brad's contract was and is horrific, and not re-signing him at that price was the right decision. If we could've not re-signed Bender and then kept Miller, then maybe we could've gotten away with it. However, if you're going to ask me to choose between Foster and Miller, I'll choose Foster 12 times out of 10.

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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    Brad's contract was and is horrific
    Better than Troy's.
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  10. #35
    100 Miles from the B count55's Avatar
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by Anthem View Post
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    Better than Troy's.
    Talk about damning with faint praise.

  11. #36
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    Quote Originally Posted by count55 View Post
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    We were a better basketball team without Brad Miller. Brad's contract was and is horrific, and not re-signing him at that price was the right decision. If we could've not re-signed Bender and then kept Miller, then maybe we could've gotten away with it. However, if you're going to ask me to choose between Foster and Miller, I'll choose Foster 12 times out of 10.
    I disagree.

    Even today I look at Brad's contract as normal for an All-Star NBA Center. Especially considering the first couple of years were on par with what we were paying Austin Croshere. At the time there were a ton of ridiculously high-priced contracts at center - Vlade Divac, Magloire, a rapidly declining Mutombo just to name a few. He received the going rate for centers at that time.

    He only has 2 years remaining at 11 and then 12 million. That's not horrific to me. Choosing to extend Bender and paying him what they agreed to pay was horrific.


    Speaking of Bender, isn't ironic that both he and Darius Miles had comparable hype surrounding them coming into the league, they were at one point compared and debated by Pacers fans, the both received contract extensions they didn't deserve, and they both were forced to quit playing because of knee injuries?

    Miles though is the better player and he may be able to return and play out his contract. If he's healthy, he could be a good back up for the Celts.
    Last edited by naptownmenace; 08-26-2008 at 03:56 PM.
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    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
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    Default Re: Celtics sign Darius Miles

    If TPTB wanted to keep Brad, they would have. That says it all...
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