Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

    Last week I gave you guys three options, of which trading Al seemed to be the most popular.

    Let me take another swing at this with option # 4 & see if anybody would accept this.

    It's simple really & once again does not require us to trade anybody. This one is just another matter of player adjustments, but would required a differant mind set where it came to Reggie.

    Put Reggie on the bench, move Ron to shooting guard & start Al at the S.F. spot.

    This allows Al to start which will make him happy. This will allow Ron to remain on the team which will make Uncle Buck happy. This allows the frontcourt to not be to small by benching Jeff Foster. This allows our defense to remain intact as Al & Ron can switch who guards who just as well if not better than Reggie & Ron did.

    I know I know your all going to say that this does nothing to help with our outside shooting.

    To a point I will concede that. However my theory is this, with Al all you are going to be able to get is a mid-level player who might develop into something. Flip Murray or somebody like him & everybody didn't like my Flip Murray idea anyway.

    So I ask this, is the two guard we are getting going to be a better two guard than Ron Artest? My guess would be no. I know that people will say that Ron is really a better S.f. but I say that there is almost no differance between the sf & the sg spot on the floor & defensively Ron is going to take the better player anyway.

    Reggie would still be there to come off of the bench for perimater offense as well as Bender, A.J. & Croshere.

    This makes our starting lineup a better rebounding club & if Bender is even close to being ready to help he can take Al's offense with the second unit, not to mention Reggie.

    I'm just not sure that we are going to get from Al what we need, or at the very least nothing that isn't any better that what we already have on our team.

    Ok, tear it apart now.


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

  • #2
    Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

    Forgive me beforehand for bringing some Isiah logic into this thread. rayer:

    How bad does it matter that Ron is labeled as a SG, and strictly a SG? Ron can play the SF and the SG, Al can play the SF and the PF, JO can play the PF and the C, and Jeff can play the C and the PF. It's all interchangable, so the thing is, how important is it that we need a "SG"? As long as the guy fits the needs of the team, does it really matter what the position he plays is, as long as it's an exceptional outside shooter who can either create his own shot or spread the defenses?

    Inquiring minds want to know.

    edit: I wrote this before I read your post Peck. I think we were kind of thinking along the same lines regarding Ron Artest, and if we were, I agree with that.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

      We need a player who strikes fear into the hearts of opponents with his perimeter shooting. We need someone who can consistently draw players out of the paint to open up the middle for Jermaine (and Ron). Would Ron accomplish that? I don't know. But I don't think so. Again, I submit game 4 and how Croshere's performance spread the floor as evidence.

      By the way, I think we can do better than Flip Murray for Al and change.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

        By the way, I think we can do better than Flip Murray for Al and change.
        I agree with that. Didn't he sort of cool off the second half of the season? He only scored 12.4 a game anyway; not much better than Reggie's 10.

        edit: Besides, his 3P% is horrific. (29%)

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

          Oh, don't get me wrong guys. If I thought we could get that solid dead eye outside shooter for Al I would do it.

          But, I think the kind of player you could get in return is really a crap shoot.

          Artest would get you a sure thing & if things are going on behind the scenes (which I suspect they are) then that might happen. But for Al I'm not sure who you could get that would be that solid outside shooter that would be better than either Al or Ron.


          Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

            Let me ask you something, Peck?

            Are you of the mindset that we should stand pat in the off-season? Or are you at least entertaining the thought?

            I can understand this thinking to some degree. We're still a young team. I'd hate to lose either Al or Ron as well because you can see the potential there. Plus Freddie is showing signs of becoming a real contributor. It certainly begs the question: Do we risk the possibility of breaking this team up prematurely, before it's reached its full potential?

            On the other hand...

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

              I like your idea, but only if we can't negotiate a trade to either give us a big, scoring, center, or an outside rifleman. If we don't though, I believe Reggie would be most effective coming off the bench.
              "I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way, Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post."

              --Jack Nicholson as Colonel Nathan Jessup in A Few Good Men

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                I can understand this thinking to some degree. We're still a young team. I'd hate to lose either Al and Ron as well because you can see the long-term potential there and what each player means to the team. Plus Freddie is showing signs of becoming a real contributor. It certainly begs the question: Do we risk the possibility of breaking this team up prematurely, before it's reached its true potential?
                I like the idea. If things aren't going right and/or Al is complaining, we could trade him by the deadline. Just see how things go I guess. Then again, I don't think Larry will go into the season without giving the fans some confidence that next season will turn out different.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                  I can't say I like it at all :shakehead: Standing pat is the worst thing we can do at this point .
                  Broadcasting Classic Rock Hits 24/7 SauceMaster Radio!!!!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                    I have to say that I agree with Peck - there is no way we get value for Al given his salary level and a draft pick is not attrative to me.

                    We could get a solid 2 with the mid level exemption - probably every bit as good as a flip murray or whatever we would get.

                    And trading Al for a Center - well that just rubs salt in the Brad Miller wound.

                    This is an attractive team for a free agent. If the Knicks can dream of Rasheed for the mid level exemption - tell me - why can't we get a 2 guard for the same. And while it did not work out - Gary Payton and Malone whored themselves out for a combined $6.4 million this year for a shot at a championship. Tell me we could not get a quality 2? I think we could do well in free agency. Does anyone have a list of available 2's?
                    Heywoode says... work hard man.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                      Let me ask you something, Peck?

                      Are you of the mindset that we should stand pat in the off-season? Or are you at least entertaining the thought?

                      I can understand this thinking to some degree. We're still a young team. I'd hate to lose either Al or Ron as well because you can see the potential there. Plus Freddie is showing signs of becoming a real contributor. It certainly begs the question: Do we risk the possibility of breaking this team up prematurely, before it's reached its full potential?

                      On the other hand...
                      No, not whatsoever. I am not of the mind to stand pat.

                      But I don't want to just give away Al for peanuts either.

                      Of course both you & I are aware that the trade may NOT be for Al.

                      I guess what I am trying to do is get people to thinking about not just getting rid of Al. BTW, I'm not Al's biggest fan either. It's just that I think that we have to wonder what we get in return.

                      Jason Richardson? He's a great scorer but not a great shooter. So in reality is he any better than Ron in the backcourt? I don't think so.

                      I just use him as an example.

                      I guess what I'm saying is I can see an argument for either side. In the past I've always been for a trade & I still wouldn't mind one this season either. But if nothing happens then I would much rather see this happen than to come back with the same old lineup next year.


                      Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                        Peck, I guess I like this idea better than making a bad trade involving Al.

                        Rick Carlisle played this lineup a few minutes every game, but only for a few minutes. Usually AL would come in for Reggie at the 6 minute mark of the 1st and 3rd quarters. But usually by the 4 minute mark Freddie and AJ were in.

                        So they played this lineup about 4 or 5 minutes per game.

                        My point is Rick did try it, but he never used it at crunch time. Rick's offense is based on floor spacing, that is his "big thing", and I just don't see him going to it very often for that reason.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                          Floor spacing is important, especially at crunch time.

                          Remember I'm just talking about starting here, not who plays the most or when they play.

                          At crunch time I would suspect that Jeff or Al would be on the bench & either Fred, Reggie or maybe even Crosher or Bender might be in.

                          But do you at least see that this may solve Al's problem of wanting to start?


                          Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                            At the core of Peck's post - can we get equal value for Al.

                            All the rumors I have heard so far tell me no.

                            I would be happy to trade him - but not for someone who is no better than someone we could get for the mid level exemption.
                            Heywoode says... work hard man.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Ok, time for my second go round about trades or lacktherof....

                              But do you at least see that this may solve Al's problem of wanting to start?

                              Yes I can see that, but if AL is on the bench in the last 5 minutes of close games, he won't be satisfied about that either

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X