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Thread: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

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    Mr. Clutch granger33's Avatar
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    Smile PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    By Larry Bird | June 28, 2008
    I wish I could tell you everything we did to make the team better during the NBA Draft Thursday night but I can tell you this: We have a brighter future today than we did a few weeks ago.

    There's a lot of media speculation about trades involving our team and our draft picks but, because of some of the league's procedural and salary cap rules, the teams involved are prohibited from discussing anything until all the final details are ironed out. The NBA has a moratorium on announcing transactions from July 1 through July 8, meaning the earliest we could say something officially is July 9.

    Regardless of the technicalities, we're very happy with what we were able to do. We made some strides in terms of talent, athleticism, experience, maturity and depth. We also added players that can get up and down the court and should really fit in well with Jim O'Brien's system. Any time you're able to pick up talent, to get pieces you can move forward with, I think that's a plus for the franchise.

    We're going to try to be active the rest of the summer. There's some areas we think we need filled, but in some positions we're pretty strong. I know we've got a lot of things to do and we've got some ideas, so hopefully, some of them will go through for us.

    We're also changing the culture of the team. If you look at some of the players mentioned in the trade reports, they're a little bit older, they went to school for a few years and that's part of the change: more mature guys, some experience and getting guys we think can come in here and play right away.

    Even though we still have some work to do, we are heading in the right direction.

    Ignite the Passion. Restore the Pride.
    http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/bird_column_080628.html

    I like hearing this from Larry Bird. I think he has another trade in the works. Sounds very positive about this franchise. He has moved this so quickly, i am so suprised. Good on ya Larry.

    AUSTRALIA'S NO.1 PACER FAN

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    Member Swingman's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by granger33 View Post
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    http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/bird_column_080628.html

    I like hearing this from Larry Bird. I think he has another trade in the works. Sounds very positive about this franchise. He has moved this so quickly, i am so suprised. Good on ya Larry.
    The July part was about TJ Ford trade not being official until next month.

    Bird saying he still has work to do could mean anything but looks like another trade is likely.

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    Go Colts! Shade's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    I would hope there are more moves on the horizon. Our front court is a joke. Especially at the 4.

    Tinsley will probably be bought out.
    Quis will likely be traded.
    Foster, Rasho, and/or Shawne may be traded as well.
    There's a chance we may move Dun, but I don't think teams will give good enough value for him right now. Despite last season, he probably still has a stigma about him from his GS days.

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    I know this is just gossip, but I ran into another STH here where I live, and her husband grew up with Larry and are still very great friends. She told me that she has a lot of the "inside info" (still, it's hard to take it either way), but she told me that Larry really likes Mike and will not consider letting him go.

    She also said that at times, however, they do not quite get along very well, and Larry tries to push Dunleavy in another direction with his game. But as of late that has changed.

    Just thought I would share that little tid bit for you guys.

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    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    I would hope there are more moves on the horizon. Our front court is a joke. Especially at the 4.

    Tinsley will probably be bought out.
    Quis will likely be traded.
    Foster, Rasho, and/or Shawne may be traded as well.
    There's a chance we may move Dun, but I don't think teams will give good enough value for him right now. Despite last season, he probably still has a stigma about him from his GS days.
    Man, shade, I think you are looking at the glass half empty.

    I mean, take a look at what we DID do. We picked not one, but two point guards better than anyone we had. We picked up a champion shooting guard, the first pure 2 guard since Reggie retired. We drafted someone who can possibly fill our hole at 5 in a very short time.

    Three out of four ain't bad.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    Man, shade, I think you are looking at the glass half empty.

    I mean, take a look at what we DID do. We picked not one, but two point guards better than anyone we had. We picked up a champion shooting guard, the first pure 2 guard since Reggie retired. We drafted someone who can possibly fill our hole at 5 in a very short time.

    Three out of four ain't bad.
    So far, all we've really done is shift our deficiencies from the back court to the front.

    I mean, Murphy, Baston, and McRoberts? I don't think we could have a worse PF rotation if we tried. And I like Baston.

    As currently constructed, this is maybe a marginally better team than last season. We need to make more moves (hopefully, good ones). But we have some decent trading pieces in Quis, Foster, and Nester to do just that.

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    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    Man, shade, I think you are looking at the glass half empty.

    I mean, take a look at what we DID do. We picked not one, but two point guards better than anyone we had. We picked up a champion shooting guard, the first pure 2 guard since Reggie retired. We drafted someone who can possibly fill our hole at 5 in a very short time.

    Three out of four ain't bad.
    Is our frontcourt really any worse than it was last year? Ike couldn't get off the bench. Harrision...well....
    And lastly JO. He was a shell of his former self when he did play, and he once again missed a ton of games and wasn't exactly a powerful juggernaut when he did play.

    We've balanced the roster, added flexibility, certainly fixed the backcourt on paper, and actually got a significant portion of the fanbase paying attention again. And we added Hibbert to the frontcourt as part of that roster balancing.

    We weren't going to be a championship team the morning after the draft no matter what... but we're in a LOT better shape than we have been on several fronts for quite some time.

    -Bball
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Is our frontcourt really any worse than it was last year? Ike couldn't get off the bench. Harrision...well....
    And lastly JO. He was a shell of his former self when he did play, and he once again missed a ton of games and wasn't exactly a powerful juggernaut when he did play.

    We've balanced the roster, added flexibility, certainly fixed the backcourt on paper, and actually got a significant portion of the fanbase paying attention again. And we added Hibbert to the frontcourt as part of that roster balancing.

    We weren't going to be a championship team the morning after the draft no matter what... but we're in a LOT better shape than we have been on several fronts for quite some time.

    -Bball
    The only reason were we even in contention to make the playoffs is because JO came back late in the season. Harrison played well at times as well. Ike was never a serious factor.

    But, yes, our front court is worse now than it was last season. Our back court, however, is much better. But this team will still struggle to stay above .500 without any further moves.

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    Member idioteque's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Bball hit the nail on the head.

    As of now, our frontcourt this year will be about as good as it was last year. Which means it is below average, but not atrocious. I mean we won 36 games, so you can't say it was the worst in the league necessarily.

    We are better off improving the front court ONLY if we see a viable long term option available. There is no point adding a band aid.

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    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    How many of those 36 wins were with JO playing?
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    We were 19-23 with JO last year.

    Which makes us 17-23 without him.

    So yeah, our record with JO in the frontcourt is only slightly better.

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    From SI's Chris Mannix:

    O'Neal may just be the first domino to fall in Indiana. Sources say Indiana was willing to trade everyone but small forward Danny Granger at the deadline. "They made it clear they were willing to blow it up," a Western Conference executive said. Contrary to reports, front-office sources say the Pacers have been shopping forward Mike Dunleavy -- who is owed $29.3 million over the next three seasons -- while showing some reluctance to part with center Jeff Foster, who is considered a favorite of coach Jim O'Brien.
    Link

    At the draft party I heard a rumor (from a sales rep) of a three-way consisting of (only main pieces, obviously more players would be needed...) -

    Shawn Marion to Pacers
    Elton Brand to Miami
    Mike Dunleavy to LAC
    "George's athleticism is bananas!" - Marc J. Spears

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    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Kegboy View Post
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    How many of those 36 wins were with JO playing?
    The Pacers went 8-7 in March and IIRC ONeal returned for the last March game.

    The Pacers went 5-3 in April.

    I'm not sure if he played every game after he returned or not.

    The Pacers went 3-5 in January before JO opted to sit out the next 33 games.

    I have no idea if there were individual games in there prior to that he might've sat out (or more aptly I should say I don't know specific individual games he missed).

    We were 15-17 heading into January so we were 18-22 prior to his sitting, but again I have no idea what games individually he might've missed in that period.

    We were 5-14 without JO in the rest of Jan and Feburary but did pick it up considerably for March and actually played a game above .500
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    I've been trying to cool down since the draft for "trading" Bayless, but other than that, I LOVE what Larry has done so far.

    I've thought differently about Larry than most people. When it comes to trades, I think Larry had been too patient, constantly stating he'd make a deal if it were right for the franchise.

    Remember when we got Stanko? I thought we were getting a first rounder from Larry's pre-draft comments, but I imagine that Larry didn't see a good deal and was unwilling to move too much.



    This year, we've received a promise that we'd be active and Larry has delivered. Here are the positives:

    -We traded a player who I thought was untradeable, helped our PG position, made Tinsley expendable, got a serviceable Center, and if he pans out, got a good draft pick out of it.

    -Drafted a very good player in Rush and was able to really strengthen our PG position without giving up a lot.

    -Got us good trading chips. We now have young players with potential and a low salary (Jack, Diener, Williams, Granger, Graham, Rush, Hibbert) that can be packaged with reasonable but expiring contracts (Daniels, Nesterovic) and/or players with value but less attractive contracts (Murphy, Dunleavy, Foster). I believe a combination of the three (though there are players I obviously would not trade unless we got the right deal) could land us a high quality player because a team would get a lot more in return.

    -Our backcourt is significantly better.

    -Our perimeter defense is better.

    -Aside from Ford who is a risk, we have more reliable players (btw, Ford is extremely tough, despite the neck problems)




    I know Larry says more is to come, but I'm not expecting anything until the trade deadline (aside from a Tinsley buyout). If he trades Tinsley, he will have traded two untradeable players.

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    How are you here? Kegboy's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    I just checked, and we were 19-23 with Jermaine, and 17-23 without.

    http://www.nba.com/playerfile/jermai...ame_stats.html
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by tadscout View Post
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    From SI's Chris Mannix:



    Link

    At the draft party I heard a rumor (from a sales rep) of a three-way consisting of (only main pieces, obviously more players would be needed...) -

    Shawn Marion to Pacers
    Elton Brand to Miami
    Mike Dunleavy to LAC
    I would literally crap my pants if that happened. But why the holy hell would the Clips trade Brand for Dun?

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Its not going to happen but Mike Dunleavy, Jeff Foster and Shawne Williams to Clipper with Shawn Marion coming here with Elton Brand going to the Heat works salary wise.

    But like I said its not happening. You could even add Marquis Daniels to Heat and Udonis Haslem here.
    Last edited by diamonddave00; 06-29-2008 at 03:36 PM.

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    I think Hibbert is going to fill the "role" JO tried to fill last year better than JO. Defensive anchor, and a guy you can run the offense through in the post who can pass out of the double team. JO only gave us about 14/7/2/2 last year. These are the kind of numbers I would expect from Hibbert(maybe not right away, but eventually), except he would probably play the entire season.

    I think we dramatically improved the backcourt, and the frontcourt stayed about the same.
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    I think some of you need to not worry about the "front court" so much.. Our front court is STRONGER then it was last year, ya, I went there.. We have Hibbert, whom is a defensive and rebounding stud (Basically a JO, just not polished), Nesterovic is a legit 7 footer and better then any center we had last year.. The PF position is a bit weak, but move foster and murphy down there and it doesn't look so bad anymore.. I truly believe that our front court is better then last year, which isnt saying much, it still is weak, but it is getting better. And our back court is much better then last year. I'm finally starting to get my thinking straight after the crazyness that calls itself Jaryd Bayless.. I wish we would have kept him, but at the same time, it was an equal trade.. And we probably have a brighter future because of it.

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Ownagedood View Post
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    We have Hibbert, whom is a defensive and rebounding stud (Basically a JO, just not polished)
    Um...no. Hibbert is nothing like JO. Roy is much slower, a much weaker rebounder, and a much weaker scorer. He's not even as strong of a shot-blocker (yet), and that's Roy's main strength.

    Nesterovic is a legit 7 footer and better then any center we had last year...
    Nester is essentially a taller Foster that can't rebound as well, but has a marginally better offensive game.

    The PF position is a bit weak, but move foster and murphy down there and it doesn't look so bad anymore...
    No, it still looks really, really bad down there.

    Foster and Nester are too redundant to play together, and Roy and Troy are too slow to play together.

    I wish we would have kept him, but at the same time, it was an equal trade.. And we probably have a brighter future because of it.
    It really, really was not an equal trade.

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Foster is naturally a power forward, and I don't think a Foster/Murphy rotation at the 4 is that terrible.

    Hibbert/Rasho will be a very solid combination of two true centers, which we haven't had in a very long time.

    People are underestimating Rasho, he is a very solid defender who is capable of scoring a little bit and doesn't make many mistakes.

    Overall we drastically improved our point guard situation, drastically improved our center situation, improved the shooting guard spot by getting Rush, and we get to shift Jeff to his natural position.

    Shade your Bayless love is blinding you from the great work we've done so far.

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by tadscout View Post
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    At the draft party I heard a rumor (from a sales rep) of a three-way consisting of (only main pieces, obviously more players would be needed...) -

    Shawn Marion to Pacers
    Elton Brand to Miami
    Mike Dunleavy to LAC

    clearly the nba knew dunleavy's status was sky-rocketing to fringe all-star level in NOLA last feb




    Saturday, Feb 16, 2008 12:26 am EST

    BDL in the Easy: The NBA respects Mike Dunleavy Jr.
    By J.E. Skeets

    You can’t really tell from the picture, but this Mike Dunleavy Jr. poster had to have been nearly 20 feet tall. Other, similar, posters at the NBA Jam Session featured the mugs of LeBron James, Steve Nash, Dwyane Wade, Kobe Bryant, Yao Ming, Chauncey Billups, Tim Duncan ... um, yeah, I’ll just stop there. Poor Lil' Dun. What an evil, evil prank.

    More photos and notes from Friday's Jam Session and D-League Dream Factory -- yes, you convinced me -- coming tomorrow/later today depending on your time zone. Good night/good morning.


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    Intuition over Integers McKeyFan's Avatar
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by tadscout View Post
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    From SI's Chris Mannix:



    Link

    At the draft party I heard a rumor (from a sales rep) of a three-way consisting of (only main pieces, obviously more players would be needed...) -

    Shawn Marion to Pacers
    Elton Brand to Miami
    Mike Dunleavy to LAC
    I'll just make that a two-way trade and take Elton Brand, thank you.
    .

    .

    .

    .


    “People talk about how quiet he [McKey] is, but he’s really been helpful. He gives a lot of insight to players in how to guard certain teams and what their weaknesses are. The whole team listens to him, and it makes my job a lot easier. Having players like him is what pro basketball is all about for me.” —Larry Brown

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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    I'll just make that a two-way trade and take Elton Brand, thank you.
    No doubt.
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    Default Re: PROMISING DRAFT NIGHT More to come in July

    Quote Originally Posted by Shade View Post
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    It really, really was not an equal trade.
    I'm surprised you love Bayless so much. He's a 2-guard in a stocky point-guards body. He's not a fantastic defender and isn't ready to start out the gate.

    We get rid of Ike, get a solid backup PG who can actually play defense, and get the player we wanted to draft anyway at #11.

    Out of curiosity, would you have been as upset if we drafted Augustin and traded him? I believe Rab from the Star said the deal was pre-arranged w/ DJ or Bayless.

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